1965 Giulia GTA 1600 (Auto Delta Corsa ?) - Page 2 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #16 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 01:28 AM Thread Starter
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post #17 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 07:08 AM
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Hi Patrick,
Are you at liberty to mention your friend's plan for the car?
Regards Steve

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post #18 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 10:44 AM Thread Starter
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Hi Steve,

Well to be honest I presume he doesn't know yet. He already has an impression of what the cost of restauration would be, but since we do not have a full history of the car yet, it is very difficult to say if it would be worth the while. So in a first stage he would like to determine exactly what this car represents and what it's history is.
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Patrick
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post #19 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 11:02 AM Thread Starter
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Hello Martinue,

I was under the impression Alfa Romeo Benelux did not exist yet in 1965 but started up in the late sixties, 1970 ?. Before that there were 4 independant importers in Belgium.
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post #20 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 02:44 PM
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Here is initial “missing part” of the history of AR613107. The car AR 613107, Biancospino 101 (hawthorn white), with black ‘skai’ interior, was delivered to Autodelta in June 1965 and prepared in rally trim together with limited number of other cars. The car was sold in 1966 to Benelux (precisely to Belgium, so no French importation) and was listed as Ecurie Concordia (Racing Team Concordia) car and Georges Hacquin was the principal driver (maybe also owner). The car was raced during 1966 season in Rallye de Lorraine (so French race), Omloop van Vlaanderen, Circuit des Ardennes (in both occasions with Van Huffel as co-driver), 12 H de Oostende, and also in occasion of 2e Bekers van de Toekomst (Zolder), Trofee de Limburg. In none of listed events the car scored significant placements and was also retired in more than one occasion. In 1967 AR 613107 started at Boucles de Spa event but had serious engine damage and was retired. During the year the engine was changed and car sold. I understand that the rest of the history is known to you.
P.S. Georges Hacquin is fine old Gentleman in good shape regardless his 95 birthdays. I think that he would be happy to “re-discover” his GTA. Try to contact him, as I understand that you live in Belgium too.
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post #21 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-15-2019, 02:48 PM
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post #23 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-16-2019, 12:12 AM Thread Starter
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Very interesting , thank you so much.
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post #24 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-16-2019, 12:24 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ARGTAReg View Post
Here is initial “missing part” of the history of AR613107. The car AR 613107, Biancospino 101 (hawthorn white), with black ‘skai’ interior, was delivered to Autodelta in June 1965 and prepared in rally trim together with limited number of other cars. The car was sold in 1966 to Benelux (precisely to Belgium, so no French importation) and was listed as Ecurie Concordia (Racing Team Concordia) car and Georges Hacquin was the principal driver (maybe also owner). The car was raced during 1966 season in Rallye de Lorraine (so French race), Omloop van Vlaanderen, Circuit des Ardennes (in both occasions with Van Huffel as co-driver), 12 H de Oostende, and also in occasion of 2e Bekers van de Toekomst (Zolder), Trofee de Limburg. In none of listed events the car scored significant placements and was also retired in more than one occasion. In 1967 AR 613107 started at Boucles de Spa event but had serious engine damage and was retired. During the year the engine was changed and car sold. I understand that the rest of the history is known to you.
P.S. Georges Hacquin is fine old Gentleman in good shape regardless his 95 birthdays. I think that he would be happy to “re-discover” his GTA. Try to contact him, as I understand that you live in Belgium too.
Thank you so much ! Very interesting. Where do you get this kind of detailed information I ask myself ? Also the pictures are very nice and interesting, actually the one with the O.M. registration is the first one we received. I now have 2 different and independant sources stating that Autodelta invoiced the car to Belgium. Would be interesting to know to which importer in Belgium, since there were 4 at that time.

I wanted to send you a private message but apparently I do not have enough posts yet to do so ? Strange system. You can reach me at ???? in case you feel ok corresponding over email. The system is even blocking sending an emailadress I now notice...
Thank you very much in advance,
Patrick
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post #25 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-16-2019, 06:17 AM
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If you guys want to go through me I can be an intermediary for PMs til you're "up to speed." Patrick I will send you a PM, or you can send me an email?
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post #26 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-16-2019, 07:00 AM
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Fascinating thread.
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post #27 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-16-2019, 10:29 AM
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If you guys want to go through me I can be an intermediary for PMs til you're "up to speed." Patrick I will send you a PM, or you can send me an email?
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I've bumped up Patrick's post count. He should be able to PM.

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post #28 of 49 (permalink) Old 05-17-2019, 12:13 AM
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Originally Posted by BOX 11 View Post
Thank you so much ! Very interesting. Where do you get this kind of detailed information I ask myself ? Also the pictures are very nice and interesting, actually the one with the O.M. registration is the first one we received. I now have 2 different and independant sources stating that Autodelta invoiced the car to Belgium. Would be interesting to know to which importer in Belgium, since there were 4 at that time.

I wanted to send you a private message but apparently I do not have enough posts yet to do so ? Strange system. You can reach me at ???? in case you feel ok corresponding over email. The system is even blocking sending an emailadress I now notice...
Thank you very much in advance,
Patrick

The photos and data for AR613107 are from Paolini archive, from the folder dedicated to Rallye prepared early GTAs. They are all of public domain (as far as I know). There is no much more about that chassis number in the documents. The original papers (scans) are now among unclassified material destined to Turin Automobile Museum, and will be free for consultation after elaboration (I hope). In the same folder there are more complete data for other rally trim GTAs (like AR613026 and AR613100, imported by So.F.A.R. in France, and probably the reason of misinterpretation of the history of AR613107; for one of them, Jean Rolland’s car, there is complete technical fiche, and if necessary, I can send those data to you for eventual restoration of AR613107 as it is sister car to other ones) I think that it is the right opportunity to restore that car, as the photos show the rare originality of almost all parts. My advice would be to investigate the history of “Racing Team Concordia” from Brussels in 1966-67, and search for fiches of AR613107, that are probably preserved.
I do consider the absolute majority of members of this forum, fine and educate people, but alas, I have had extremely bad experience with someone (almost certainly) present in forum, that abused of my ID and stolen my IP, sent numerous fake e-mails and hallucinatory material to various addresses. When I put my IP under control, the mails stopped but the habit of sending libellous letters (even to my close friends!) on my behalf and against Scuderia del Portello, continued. I am over 70 now and I need not to participate to similar merrymaking for sure. This is the reason that I would prefer not to expose my address, but you can certainly find the way to contact me if necessary.
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post #29 of 49 (permalink) Old 06-13-2019, 11:20 AM Thread Starter
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The Archivio Storico in Arese had a copy of an invoice in their files, sent in late '65 from Autodelta to Alfa Romeo Benelux regarding the preparation of GTA *613107* for Georges Hacquin. We discovered it there during our research for Alleggerita II and the following books and noticed what we needed about. Photos that I got later show Hacquin in '66 and '67 with a white GTA and registration "0.M.694" (not "OM.694"), most likely that was *613107*.
Dear Martinue,

I am in contact with the Centro Documentazione, and they tell me they are not able to give me a copy of the invoice/document you refer to and have actually seen. Question : Do you know the reason why they are not disclosing this document ? And, is there any other possible way to get hold of this document ?

And I repeat my question : According to my information Alfa Romeo Benelux did not exist in 1965. At least not as an official importer. So how can you have seen an invoice to Alfa Romeo Benelux ?
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post #30 of 49 (permalink) Old 06-13-2019, 11:44 AM Thread Starter
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Hi everybody,

I am slowly but steadily putting the history of the car together, which will most probably be done faster, and a hell of a lot cheaper than putting the car together.

However, the information I have been able to gather uptill now, is very interesting and very promising. From the moment everyting is confirmed in official documents I will of course let you know.

According to the Centro Documentazione, the original documents do NOT state an engine number.
We know the car had some major engine damage (piston) in 1974, and have to make sure we still have the original engine block. Without documents this is not easy.

Is there anybody out there who can give me a hint on where to look, or where to find additional information please ?

The engine number is as follows, attached a picture of the number : AR 00502/A*18616
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