Is this really a 1750? - Page 2 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #16 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-19-2016, 05:32 AM
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Originally Posted by flivesay View Post
My May 1968 GTV sold in Germany has the crossover. Engine bay looks correct to me (maybe an extra relay for headlights?). Nice looking GTV, but the steering wheel has been misplaced.
Can you elaborate on the steering wheel ?

72 2L GT Junior 73 2000 Spider. 2004 Alfa Romeo GT 3.2 V6.
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post #17 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-19-2016, 06:04 AM
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I think it was meant as a joke, as he would prefer the wheel on the other side.

http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/alfa-romeo-club-canada-toronto-chapter/149533-alfa-parts-garage-sale.html
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post #18 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-19-2016, 07:41 AM
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It seems that model year 1969 non usa models have/had crossover air cleaner
It seems tha Wille R's Spider 1750 Veloce 1969 havde the crossover air cleaner
Engine numbers
Engine type no. for 1750 engines is 00548. My Spider 1750 S2 1970 had that engine type no. but not crossover air cleaner.
The GTV looks quite nice on the six photos. I does have the uniq front seats of the 1st. generation GTV 1750
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post #19 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-20-2016, 01:35 AM Thread Starter
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Erik,

Not correct. As Brad and Pappajam indicated, the changeover happened sometime in '68.

My 1969 105.45 (RHD) has the tubular cannister on the carbie side. It was built in Nov '68 (#1451572).

Cheers,
Wazza.

"horsepower sells cars - torque wins races".
1969 MK1 1750 GTV
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post #20 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-20-2016, 03:04 AM
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Sometimes (quite often) Alfas took sometime to sell and stayed in importers or dealers stock for a long time.
The add says "This car is no longer available for sale." So this time the sale was quick.
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post #21 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-20-2016, 03:18 AM
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Australian cars only,,,RHD

As far as I am aware,,all 1750 series 1 cars that came to Australia,,had the remote air filter system.
1750 series 2 cars had the air cleaner at the carbys.

1750 series 1 had 1 brake booster
1750 series 2 had 2 brake boosters,,= no room for a huge remote air filter canister on the LH inner guard.

Have seen many (over the last 30 odd years ),, 105 1750 series 1 with series 2 bumper bars and tail lights and duel brake boosters and front indicators park lights in the bodywork,and not on the top of the front bumper bar

This information could confuse a lot of our overseas visitors.

As an example,,Australian delivered 105 GTV 2000 cars had the larger taillights and different front Diecast grille and instrument cluster and Limited Slip Diff,,,where overseas 1600s had our front grille and Instument cluster and small taillights.

Another difference to Australian delivered cars were the Camshafts and engine number location.
Series 1 engines had 10502 camshafts where series 2 has 10548 camshafts.
Another thing I noticed many years ago was that series 1 engines had the engine number AR00548 etc under the carbys on the block,,where series 2 engine numbers were on the exhaust side of the block.

Of corse,,lots has happened over the years and items have been swapped.

Also,All Australian delivered 105 series 2 litre Coupe,Berlina and Spider cars came standard with a LSD
Coupe + Spider came with 4.10 ratio and Berlina with 4.30 ratio.

I heard that the LSD was an option overseas.
Even our Auto Berlinas + Coupes had an LSD with 3.2 ratio= 46 crownwheel and 14 pinion teeth.

Last point is,,,,Im glad Australian delivered 105 never came with that Spica fuel injection.

One day I will chat with a LHD Alfa Specialist to tell me how difficult it is to work on, to have a brake booster-mastercylinder,,exhaust manifolds and a steering box on the same side.

Always wondered why I sell so many carby intake manifolds and exhaust manifolds to overseas people.
Glad we got standard= twin carbys,and 4 into 2 into one exhaust,and not 4 into 1 like LHD cars got to possibly clear the steering box.

1972 105 GT Veloce 2000
1976 2L Spider
1984 GTV 6 3 litre
1967 GSGT 2 litre
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post #22 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-20-2016, 05:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTVMk1 View Post
As Brad and Pappajam indicated, the changeover happened sometime in '68.
For a bit more accuracy, the changeover occurred DURING 1968. Some known examples;
1352540 built 09 Feb 68 left side filter
1352698 built 14 Feb 68 right side filter
1358900 built 26 Sep 68 left side filter
1367053 built 18 Apr 69 right side filter
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Jim

Series 2 USA 1750 GTV (in Series 1 European clothing)
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post #23 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-20-2016, 06:10 AM
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Cool

It's commonly known that at the Alfa assembly line whatever was laying on the shelf was fitted so changes was from one chassis no, to the next wasn't applied.
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post #24 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-20-2016, 06:20 AM
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Interesting how the change in 1968 seemed to alternate back and forth between left and right air cleaner. The body work would have to match for example the bracket for left air cleaner welded to fender, possibly wire loom changes relay brackets etc... I seem to recall that there was a change to the right side inner fender to give clearance to the right side air cleaner, possibly done for 1300 GT Jrs. as the carb height was lower but used on the 1750 as well? In my mind the left side air cleaner cars always had the unique and rare tail lites, wonder if they alternated back and forth to match the left air cleaner? I think the change from S1 to S2 happened on a specific date in December 1969 at a specific # 1385000 if my memory is correct. It was a far more complicated and extensive change, I owned car 1385099.

http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/alfa-romeo-club-canada-toronto-chapter/149533-alfa-parts-garage-sale.html

Last edited by brad fischer; 03-21-2016 at 06:24 PM. Reason: typo
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post #25 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-21-2016, 10:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brad fischer View Post
Interesting how the change in 1968 seemed to alternate back and forth between left and right air cleaner. The body work would have to match for example the bracket for left air cleaner welded to fender, possibly wire loom changes relay brackets etc... I seem to recall that there was a change to the right side inner fender to give clearance to the right side air cleaner, possibly done for 1300 GT Jrs. as the carb height was lower but used on the 1750 as well? In my mind the left side air cleaner cars always had the unique and rare tail lites, wonder if they alternated back and forth to match the left air cleaner? I think the change from S1 to S2 happened on a specific date in December 1969 at a specific # 1385000 if my memory is correct. It was a far more complicated and extensive change, I owned car 1385099.
Don't forget that 1300 Juniors until 1972 or so still had the earlier step front, the sheetmetal forward if the windscreen was as per a 1600 not a 1750.

Also, talk of model years is a US / Nth America thing. As far as Australian cars were concerned you just had 'year of manufacturer' and 'year of first registration'. In the 70's we also got 'year of compliance' but that's a whole different conversation. Example, my GTV was built in September '72 and registered May '73. Its not a model year at all, it's just a 2000 GTV.

Alister
1973 105 GTV (Alfa #6 of 19 owned)
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post #26 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-22-2016, 03:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Aggie57 View Post
Don't forget that 1300 Juniors until 1972 or so still had the earlier step front, the sheet metal forward if the windscreen was as per a 1600 not a 1750.

Also, talk of model years is a US / Nth America thing. As far as Australian cars were concerned you just had 'year of manufacturer' and 'year of first registration'. In the 70's we also got 'year of compliance' but that's a whole different conversation. Example, my GTV was built in September '72 and registered May '73. Its not a model year at all, it's just a 2000 GTV.
As far as I know, GT Jrs changed from step nose S2 to smooth nose S3 about the same time as the 1750 changed from S1 to S2. I think Jrs made in 1970 and onward were smooth nose.

http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/alfa-romeo-club-canada-toronto-chapter/149533-alfa-parts-garage-sale.html
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post #27 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-22-2016, 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by brad fischer View Post
As far as I know, GT Jrs changed from step nose S2 to smooth nose S3 about the same time as the 1750 changed from S1 to S2. I think Jrs made in 1970 and onward were smooth nose.
In Australia at least the last of the 1300 Jrs were step nose built in 1969, maybe even '70. We had one which was rusty but a great track day thrasher. I can't believe I wasted a genuine factory outer sill on it!

The next, and last, series of juniors sold there were smooth nose 1600's around '72-73. Other than the front sheet metal pretty much identical to the last of the 1300's.

Alister
1973 105 GTV (Alfa #6 of 19 owned)
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post #28 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-23-2016, 01:16 PM
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I have the early 68' that the PO fitted an incorrect S2 euro airbox to but that has now been corrected. The small Carello tailights are also present.

I am curious if any cars lacked the cross over but retained the fender sheet metal to mount the remote airbox. I wouldn't put it past Alfa.

I put mine back in the cross over configuration as the S2 euro airbox snorkel prevented me from placing the coolant tank in front of it and the cross over canister mount sheet metal prevented placing the coolant tank or washer bag in that location. Now everything has a proper place.
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68' Parisian Alfa GTV 1750
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post #29 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-23-2016, 01:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Erik View Post
It's commonly known that at the Alfa assembly line whatever was laying on the shelf was fitted so changes was from one chassis no, to the next wasn't applied.
I don't buy into this urban myth...sorry. Alfa Romeo had to produce cars to numerous and varied standards between the many different countries that it exported to. I'm pretty sure that if we were to compare cars with the same base prefix numbers (like say the 1530xxx or the 1524xxx cars), we would see more uniform component configurations. Comparing a 1968 GT junior sold in Italy to a 1968 GT junior sold in the US or whatever other country is meaningless ....in my opinion.


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1971 1750 GTV 105.48 (sold), 1972 1300GTJunior (sold)
1969 1750 GTV 105.5 , 1972 Montreal
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post #30 of 31 (permalink) Old 03-23-2016, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erik View Post
It's commonly known that at the Alfa assembly line whatever was laying on the shelf was fitted so changes was from one chassis no, to the next wasn't applied.
Is it really commonly known that Alfa did as Erik suggests once they entered the era of the production line, or is this an urban myth? Have people said this, half jokingly when they have no other way to defend the fitment of their production line Alfa?

Further do we know if Alfa built their production line vehicles with sequential serial numbers, I would guess yes but we know they did not or say not for the GTA, but true the GTA was is a special circumstance.

Body bracketry absent, present or evidence of its removal or addition should tell the story for individual cars, I think.

Just Saying!!

FWIW

Ken

Ken Geiger, Toronto
1965 GTA, RHD, Stradale
ex- 1965 GTA, RHD, Corsa, Trans/Am 66-72
1964 Sprint GT, B-Sedan in 70's
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