petrol/gas tank removal on 1750 GTV - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-23-2007, 12:53 AM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Threealfas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 1,373
petrol/gas tank removal on 1750 GTV

OK guys some advice needed. Today I decided to remove my fuel tank. I did the following things.

1. Drained the last 5 litres from the bottom of the tank leaving the drain plug out so that the tank could breath whilst I then,

2. removed the fuel sender assembly from the tank and disconnected it from the fuel line.

3.I removed the filler cap and allowed the tank to breath.

4.removed the screws holding the tank to the body.

I could not however remove the rubber boot around the filler neck, but I did unpeel it from the filler door surround.

When I pushed the tank up in an attempt to extract it from the boot/trunk, I found that it jammed solid. Moreover I was concerned that scraping the open exposed fuel filler outlet against the body may be potentially dangerous if I was to create a spark and putting the filler cap back on does not allow enough clearance. So issues

I have given up for the day, reinstalled the sender, put the drain plug and cap back on, until I am ready to have another go.

When I do have another go I am going to make the tank safe by the foillowing methods.

1. I have heard that opening all the portals of the tank and allowing dry ice pellets to sublimate (turn from a solid to a gas) in the tank will force the volitile petrol vapours out and replace them with inert CO2 from the dry ice (it's all to do with the differential in the densitity of the CO2 versus the density of the fuel vapour)

2 I will put one of those tempory rubber orange fuel tank caps on the the filler mouth, this will prevent a spark and the rubber cap is lower than the normal cap and is flexible .

Now what I need to know is this. Do I have to remove the rubber boot from around the neck of the filler pipe to get the tank out ? If yes, how the hell do you do that ? Or should I simply cut it off the neck of the pipe and accept that I have to buy a new one.

Ok assuming the rubber boot is now removed. How do you get the tank out, is it a two man job, with one underneath holding the tank up and one draging it across the boot/trunk? Or is there a trick to this ?

Any advice would be appreciated .

Phil

Phil
1961 MGA 1600 Roadster, British Racing Green
1966 Giulia Sprint GT ,Argento
1970 1750 GTV s2, Verde Olivo Metallica (AR213)
2005 Holden Rodeo LT Crew Cab, Fox Fire Red

{Oo==V==oO}

Previously owned
1983 Ford Laser KB, Beige
1985 Volvo 360 GLT Dark Mettalic Blue
1970 GT Junior stepnose Resprayed Red, Giallo Ochre
1923 Amilcar Sports, rusty
I may only own two ALFAs now, but the handle stays as I am always chasing another one.
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Threealfas is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-23-2007, 07:58 AM
Registered User
 
BlpltGTV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Napa Ca
Posts: 1,605
Garage
Send a message via AIM to BlpltGTV
Removing the tank is a huge p.i.t.a. It took me a couple of hours to pull mine, and an equal amount of time to put it back. If I remember correctly, the rubber boot is the last thing to remove. There really isn't a set technique to pulling the tank (that I know of). I had a friend help me, but I don't think its a 2 person job. There is no space, and it gets hung up everywhere it possibly can.

Will

1959 101.02 Sprint AR1493*20198 (project) 1969 Datsun 2000 roadster
1988 BMW E30 M3
BlpltGTV is offline  
post #3 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-23-2007, 03:32 PM
Moderator
Platinum SubscriberModerator
 
Alfajay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: San Juan Capistrano
Posts: 9,807
Sequence for gas tank removal

BlpltGTV had written: "If I remember correctly, the rubber boot is the last thing to remove."

Did you mean "to remove from the body (e.g., that plate behind the filler door)" or "remove from the filler neck on the tank"?

Or, when you are installing a tank, do you start by installing the boot on the body, thread the filler neck through its round hole, and then work the tank down into its mounting?

Threealfas: In my opinion, spark & explosion is a low risk. It's winter now in Australia, right? In cool weather, gasoline isn't very explosive - it just doesn't vaporize. Cool liquid gas isn't very flammable - gas fumes are VERY flammable, but modern gasoline doesn't vaporize easily. Cooling your tank with dry ice might reduce the risk from .0001 to .00001 (or whatever), but I don't think you need to worry all that much. Steel against steel doesn't readily create sparks - static electricity would be more likely to create a source of ignition than a steel-steel spark. So, perhaps grounding the tank to the body with a jumper wire while you are wrestling it would be a worthwhile precaution. This is all my opinion - maybe I've just been lucky - I'm sure that anyone who disagrees will chime in!

And, while you are struggling with that tank, you may wish for an explosion to end your misery.

Good Luck!

Jay Mackro
San Juan Capistrano, CA

'65 Guilia Sprint GT
'67 Duetto
'91 164L
Alfajay is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 17 (permalink) Old 06-25-2007, 03:27 AM
Registered User
 
Colin P's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Posts: 157
Hi again Phil,

Are you and I living in a parallel universe as well as the same city?

I have to agree with Will on this one - removing the fuel tank is a right pain. I'm sure by now you agree as well.
Considering how easy it looks, it can take some effort and I ended up manhandling mine out.

It's possible to get your tank out alone, but you'll find that the aid of a friend for five minutes will make it much easier. One can manoeuvre and hold the tank in place while the other lifts/pushes.

To start with, try sliding the rubber boot right down filler neck to the top of the tank. It's probably not a bad idea to leave the fuel sender assembly in the tank to prevent crud falling in and contaminating the tank.

My tank also jammed when I was trying to get it out. For some reason that I don't understand, these things just don't come through the hole easily. Unfortunately, I was alone at the time and didn't have my tools so my technique of removing the tank was born out of using what was handy at the time (mixed with impatience),more than it was from well measured and carefully considered problem solving.

I ended up sliding underneath and pushing the tank upwards. When the tank was about halfway out it jammed solid, just as you've experienced. Oddly the lower walls of the tank were seemingly wider than the hole. Not by much, but enough to still cause a good solid jam.
I didn't want to hit it with a rubber mallet and risk denting a pristine tank, so I got a short length of timber that I propped vertically underneath the tank, then I simply pushed down hard on the body of the car and that pushed the tank through the hole surprisingly easy.
The length of timber was an inch or two longer than the height of the tank from the ground, which lifted the car slightly on it's suspension and made the task of pushing down easier as gravity worked in my favour.
Being paranoid of denting the tank, I protected it by nailing a broad piece of plywood to the top of the piece of timber to spread the pressure on surface of the tank.

If I'd had a trolley jack handy at the time, I probably would have used that instead, but I didn't. Similarly, if I'd had someone to help this would definitlely have been easier and possibly unnecessary, but again I didn't. But it worked and my tank is still straight

As for the spark issue, caution is always best.
Jay makes some good points, but in the end you're the one with your head in the boot with the tank, so take whatever precautions make you feel comfortable.
No-one will call you a fool for NOT setting yourself or your car on fire!
However I will be first in line to offer to buy your cache of parts if you set your 105 alight

Interestingly though, I saw an episode of Myth Busters where they were throwing lit cigarettes into pools of petrol to see if they could start a fire like you see in the movies. They weren't able to achieve ignition at all with a cigarette. They needed an actual open flame like that from a lighter or a burning piece of paper to get the petrol to ignite. But still, I don't think you can be too careful.

Cheers,
-Col-

I love this car, but I'm pretty sure this car hates me!
Colin P is offline  
post #5 of 17 (permalink) Old 07-21-2007, 07:43 AM
Member
Gold Subscriber
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Melbourne Australia
Posts: 42
Hi There from Tassie,
Probably a bit late with this but I've had a fair bit of experience with ths one recently. During Targa Tasmania I had a fuel tank leak in the 2ltr and had to remove it very quickly and get a borrowed one in. since then I've done it twice more to return the tank and refit mine etc.
First re the danger. I don't think there is any real prospect of trouble caused by a spark. There is just not enough air(oxygen) in the tank for it to explode while there is still some fuel in it. The danger comes when you think the tank is completely empty once it is out and you have flushed it with water etc. Then there might be just about the right mix for trouble. Anyway ,if you want to be ultra careful just connect a wire from the tank to the car body and keep it concted throughout the removal. That will stop any possibility of a spark.
Secondly I didn't have any trouble getting it out. Just take off the pipe and gauge connection and then free the rubber filler tube moulding from the body channels and push it down the filler neck. Also push the fuel pipe right out through the hole on the boot floor to get it right out of the way of removal.
Then push the tank up from the bottom to unstick it from the seating rubber.
Get enough clearance to remove the filler tube moulding noting that the overflow pipe in it is in a hole and needs to be pulled out.
With the moulding off it should be possible to lift the tank from inside the boot and slide it across for removal through the boot access. It is not difficult but just seems like that until you get the right combination of movements. Just take it slowly and it will be out in a minute! Really!
When it's out you might want to have a good look at the seating flage in the body. Mine was severely cracked in several places. It was quite easily fixed with some light angle and pop Water tends to collect there.
If you need to get the tank welded/soldered I would not try it myself. The tank repair people tell me that they fill the tank with exhaust gas before operating on it, but I'm not confident to try it!
paul b is offline  
post #6 of 17 (permalink) Old 07-21-2007, 08:57 AM
Registered User
 
alfarestore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Half Moon Bay, CA
Posts: 216
For what it's worth you might want to consider modifying the tank for both ease of installation/removal and when your actually putting gas in the tank at the pump. I always cut a section of the filler neck off the tank and install a proper rubber section in place of the removed piece. This will give you the ability of place the filler opening at a better angle or position to accept the modern gas nozzles, and at the same time the tank will be easily removed in the future.
Attached Images
  

Jeff Mc Neill
Half Moon Bay, CA
1966 GT junior (sold)
1974 GTV (sold)

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
alfarestore is offline  
post #7 of 17 (permalink) Old 07-22-2007, 11:56 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 12
I have a related question that you or someone else may know. I removed the tank from my '74 GTV and found that the tank sits on some type of gasket that insulates it from direct contact with the body of the car. Can anyone tell me what this "gasket" is made of? and how best to go about getting a replacement (since the old material came off in pieces). Thanks, Ken
focusa is offline  
post #8 of 17 (permalink) Old 07-22-2007, 04:42 PM
Registered User
 
Colin P's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Brisbane, QLD, Australia
Posts: 157
The original seal is made of rubber, hence the deterioration.

I replaced mine with closed-cell Neoprene strip. You can buy it from hardware stores and rubber suppliers. You buy it by length, so you'll need to run a tape measure around your tank first.

The advantage of closed-cell Neoprene is that it is water proof and air tight, and if it's a good quality one it should be acid and oil (fuel) proof too.

The Neoprene strip usually comes with adhesive on one side. The adhesive is a little weak and mine kept letting go when I put the tank in, so I ended up brushing on some contact adhesive first to hold the seal firmly in place.

By the way, Jeff. For a while now I've been toying with the idea of cutting my fuel tank filler neck and putting in a rubber section to get better placement, but I wasn't sure how it would look. Having seen your pics I think it looks fine, so cheers.

I'm going downstairs to find my hacksaw.

-Col-

I love this car, but I'm pretty sure this car hates me!
Colin P is offline  
post #9 of 17 (permalink) Old 07-23-2007, 07:06 AM
Darth Moderator
Platinum SubscriberModerator
 
AlfistiSA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Port Elizabeth, South Africa
Posts: 3,363
Phil

That %$#@ tank will only come out ONE way, it's a PITA, but once you get the hang of it, you can pull them out quite quickly.

For the gasket, Colin is spot on - go with the closed cell neoprene !!

Get a new rubber boot for the neck from one of the UK suppliers, the old ones go hard & are a real PITA to try re-install, plus they inevitably don't fit tight & let fuel spills seep into the boot.

I like Jeff's filler neck idea - a neat solution to a pesky problem - it would make fitting of the rubber boot a real cinch.

Regards
Greig
AlfistiSA is offline  
post #10 of 17 (permalink) Old 07-23-2007, 08:19 AM
Senior Member
Gold Subscriber
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posts: 217
Quote:
Originally Posted by focusa View Post
I have a related question that you or someone else may know. I removed the tank from my '74 GTV and found that the tank sits on some type of gasket that insulates it from direct contact with the body of the car. Can anyone tell me what this "gasket" is made of? and how best to go about getting a replacement (since the old material came off in pieces). Thanks, Ken
Ken...I used a strip of closed cell foam from one of the home improvement stores. I chose one that was a bit firmer than most...I believe it was meant to be used on a pickup truck (USA) to seat a cap on the bed. It worked beautifully.

I also took the tank to a radiator shop and had the inside coated and the outside painted. I looks like new and performs better than new due to the coating.

Pat Padden
'74 GTV - owned since '92
Pat Padden is offline  
post #11 of 17 (permalink) Old 07-23-2007, 09:31 AM
Registered User
 
Dale's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Summerville, South Carolina
Posts: 458
Quote:
Originally Posted by alfarestore View Post
...and install a proper rubber section in place of the removed piece.
Jeff,

Where can I get the proper size fuel hose for the neck? I checked all the local auto parts places and only found one that could get it, and that was $53!!!

Any advice on where to get the proper stuff much appreciated.

Dale Thomas - 1969 1750 GTV
Summerville, South Carolina
Dale is offline  
post #12 of 17 (permalink) Old 07-23-2007, 07:58 PM
Registered User
 
alfarestore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Half Moon Bay, CA
Posts: 216
Dale,

The proper hose for a fuel application can be pricey. I've picked it up a local heavy truck parts store, it's not cheap by any means. I bought 2 pieces, one for the smaller size necks and one for the larger. Each piece is about 36" long and will do about 8 cars and they run about $60-$75 each. If you can't find it I'll be happy to send you a section. I would just need to know the size of the neck that you have on your car.

Jeff

Jeff Mc Neill
Half Moon Bay, CA
1966 GT junior (sold)
1974 GTV (sold)

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
alfarestore is offline  
post #13 of 17 (permalink) Old 12-22-2007, 04:31 PM
Registered User
 
alfa_chan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Long Beach, CA
Posts: 1,284
Garage
Just for the record.

On my 73 GTV Spica - the gas tank seal is about 7/8" x 3/8" x 76"
Not sure if it was the original seal, but it was what i had.

115.01 73 GTV 2000 SPICA
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
alfa_chan is offline  
post #14 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-22-2015, 08:19 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 15
I had a friend come over to tackle the tank removal, we were expecting several hours of struggling but by putting a jack under the tank in the right spot it took less than 15 mins to remove. It's just a matter of wiggling it into the right position and using some force after the initial jacking.
gtveloce1750 is offline  
post #15 of 17 (permalink) Old 02-23-2015, 09:39 AM
Moderator
Platinum SubscriberModerator
 
Alfajay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: San Juan Capistrano
Posts: 9,807
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dale View Post
Where can I get the proper size fuel hose for the neck? I checked all the local auto parts places and only found one that could get it, and that was $53!!!
My experience was different. I brought my filler neck into my local NAPA store, told them what I needed, they went into the back and sawed off 2" or so of tubing, and charged me about $8. Yes, that adds up to about $50/foot, but they didn't make me buy more than I needed.

You might try a wider range of suppliers.

Jay Mackro
San Juan Capistrano, CA

'65 Guilia Sprint GT
'67 Duetto
'91 164L
Alfajay is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome