Giulia updates? - Page 2 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
 16Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #16 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-22-2019, 11:59 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 24
Garage
Instead of pi**ing and moaning about a manual transmission which will NEVER happen, how about clamoring for this:

2UETTOTTANTA < Pininfarina
AROC5516 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #17 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-22-2019, 01:22 PM
PSk
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Tauranga New Zealand
Posts: 11,551
Send a message via AIM to PSk Send a message via Yahoo to PSk
Quote:
Originally Posted by AROC5516 View Post
Instead of pi**ing and moaning about a manual transmission which will NEVER happen, how about clamoring for this:

2UETTOTTANTA < Pininfarina
Why?, only the looks have changed. Looks are behind driving experience for me
Pete

'71 1750 Series 2 GTV:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
156 Series 1 v6 ... and remember it's all just opinions
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
PSk is online now  
post #18 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-22-2019, 02:43 PM
Senior Member
Gold Subscriber
 
Nakagtv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Mount Pleasant (Charleston), SC
Posts: 776
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by onethumb View Post
How many of the "I'd never buy it because it doesn't have a manual" crowd here actually are/were in the market for a car, and bought something different because of it?

What did you buy, and when?
I would definitely buy a manual QV and know of two others who would (both are manual M3 owners looking for a replacement with a manual gearbox). Instead, I LEASED a Stelvio.

A "word of mouth" advertisement a manual gearbox would create for a QV would be priceless for Alfa. They could have used some of the marketing $$ to offset the costs associated with a manual gearbox...

Zaza

Current Alfas:

2018 Stelvio Ti Sport
1987 Milano Verde
1970 Euro-spec GTV 1750

Refreshing 1750 GTV
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Nakagtv is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #19 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-22-2019, 03:42 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 24
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by PSk View Post
Why?, only the looks have changed. Looks are behind driving experience for me
Pete
The 2uettottanto was to have been an entirely new vehicle, not a re-styling of the old 105/115 series Spider. When the Mazda MX5 (Miata) platform proved to be too small, it became the Fiat 124 Spider instead albeit with much more conservative styling.
AROC5516 is offline  
post #20 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-23-2019, 10:39 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Albuquerque, NM
Posts: 24
Garage
With the notable exception of the NA market, a ZF S6-53 six-speed manual transmission is/was available as a no-cost option but only in left-hand drive QVs. Australia, India, Japan, South Africa, the UK, and other countries requiring right-hand drive vehicles receive only the ZF 8HP75 (2nd Generation) eight-speed automatic transmission (same as NA). The statistics for a manual transmission take-rate for the Giulia QV (where available) show a total of 160 cars for the combined 2017 and 2018 model years, only slightly more than 10% of total Giulia QV sales to date. FCA is in the business of designing, building, and selling vehicles to make money so they can continue to design, build, and sell more vehicles, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera ... I no longer have a dog in this fight as I've made my choice, i.e., a 2018 Giulia Ti Sport with the Q2 Performance Package, a vehicle with which I'm very pleased! [Note, I'm someone who since 1967 has personally owned eleven vehicles (of which six were/are ARs), all of which had manual transmissions; the last being a 2006 Audi A4 Avant (wagon) 3.2-V6 MT6 which was my DD for ten years yet my Giulia has been far more satisfying to drive despite having an AT8!]
alfamale44 and Max Pershyn like this.
AROC5516 is offline  
post #21 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-23-2019, 11:31 AM
Registered User
 
Vsix's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Helsinki,Finland
Posts: 758
Garage
that ZF is so good why you even think of manual, in old days when automatics were bad everyone in Europe wanted manual, but not anymore
JCDK likes this.

-Antti: --ex Alfas:155 2.0 8V '92,155 2.0 16V '96,156 V6 '98,156 V6 '02
http://carpix.1g.fi/kuvat/carpix/
Vsix is offline  
post #22 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-23-2019, 02:19 PM
Registered User
 
Sketchl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 680
Garage
Manual take-rate??

I still cannot understand AlfaBB members sprucing manual take-rates when manuals werenít even offered to the large sector of the global market, weíll never know (full stop)

One fact is that I didnít buy the new Giulia which means one less Giulia on the road and one less advocate talking about the new Giulia with people on a daily basis...... I donít think Iím the sole person in this situation so good luck FCA.

PS. Note that manuals were already built for the QVs and diesels so the additional investment is miniscul in the scheme of things and they would have tapped into new markets such as all the manual BMW drivers.
Nakagtv likes this.

1966 Giulia Sprint GT Veloce - slightly modified!
Sketchl is offline  
post #23 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-23-2019, 02:45 PM
Del
Senior Member
Gold Subscriber
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: seattle
Posts: 15,326
"why you even think of manual"

Not as much mechanical interaction with the machinery, and therefore, not as much fun for some of us. Simple as that. How fast shifting does an automatic transmission need to be for nonracers, anyway? Is this like spending thousands on the 99.9+% audio equipment, which you most likely can't hear anyway?

Recently drove my bro in law's Chevy (Holden) SS with the flappy paddles, and while the transmission in that car is great, as good as the Alfa based on my own driving experience now with both, it wasn't much fun compared to my 91S or 94LS manual transmission. Boring actually. Also got a good ride in his new 750 hp Corvette. Definitely not boring, a real spaceship, lol.

Still, ended up impressed with the SS. Quite fast, and with dealers most everywhere. Toss up between that, if and when he decides to sell it, and a Giulia I think.

Del

Seattle

1989 Milano, Shankle Sport
1991 164S, stock
1994 164LS (~Q)
1972 Morgan 27

previously owned since 1964:

62 Morris MiniMinor 850, 67 Austin 1275 Cooper S (Downton 3/4 race), 64 Giulia Sprint GT (1st red one made), 72 Fiat 128 Sedan, 75 Alfetta Sedan, 78 Alfetta Sedan, 78 GTV, 81 GTV6, 86 GTV6

Last edited by Del; 03-23-2019 at 03:38 PM.
Del is online now  
post #24 of 39 (permalink) Old 03-23-2019, 03:27 PM
Registered User
 
Vivace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: PNW
Posts: 1,987
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by AROC5516 View Post
The 2uettottanto was to have been an entirely new vehicle, not a re-styling of the old 105/115 series Spider. When the Mazda MX5 (Miata) platform proved to be too small, it became the Fiat 124 Spider instead albeit with much more conservative styling.
Exactly. I believe that elegant design (one of the best shapes to come out of Pininfarina in a long long time) was produced before the whole discussion with Mazda about a shared platform. Such a shame, and such a wasted opportunity.

1967 1600 Spider
Vivace is offline  
post #25 of 39 (permalink) Old 05-17-2019, 05:55 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 12
While I'd like to see a manual in the Quad, hasn't Chris Harris said it's not that great, and most agree the auto is finely tuned for this car?
coloradocarguy is offline  
post #26 of 39 (permalink) Old 05-17-2019, 06:00 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Calgary,Alberta,Canada
Posts: 2,701
Yes, although to be fair he was allowing for the fact that no manual RHD version was ever going to be available for the UK.

He makes the valid point though that the current state of electronics means the turbo engines can be optimized for pairing with an automatic in a way not possible with a manual gearbox. For the same reason paddleshifting a modern automatic does not usually improve performance of the drivetrain.

Manuals have aesthetic appeal only.

1991 Alfa Romeo 164L 5 spd
White on grey leather 230K km, owned from new
Michael Smith is offline  
post #27 of 39 (permalink) Old 05-17-2019, 06:14 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 12
I definitely understand the aesthetic appeal. While I'm no good at heel/toe downshifting, I like a good rev match with the manual. A manual really does make you feel more connected to the car.
coloradocarguy is offline  
post #28 of 39 (permalink) Old 05-17-2019, 07:03 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Calgary,Alberta,Canada
Posts: 2,701
Quote:
Originally Posted by coloradocarguy View Post
I definitely understand the aesthetic appeal. While I'm no good at heel/toe downshifting, I like a good rev match with the manual. A manual really does make you feel more connected to the car.
When I took a racing instruction in NZ on Australian V8 touring cars (racing slicks, huge brakes and a 400+ bhp Corvette V8 with 6 spd whatever, Tremec?) I was specifically instructed not to heel and toe downshift. I was instructed to let the synchromesh do the job. Rev matching yes, so as not to upset the chassis, but no heel and toe. That was at racing speeds on the A1 track at Taupo.

On the street you should not heel and toe but simply rev match the downshift. Heel and toe is totally unnecessary for a synchro box unless it is worn. Synchros are designed to exactly match the relative speeds of the dog gears and heel and toe rev matching can only produce heavier loads on the synchros unless perfectly executed.

The other aspect of rev matching using heel and toe is you are almost never braking hard enough on the street to warrant even trying to heel and toe. The brake pedal is not depressed far enough down to allow correct alignment of gas pedal and brake pedal.

I can do it, easily, but tend not to after receiving that advice.

1991 Alfa Romeo 164L 5 spd
White on grey leather 230K km, owned from new
Michael Smith is offline  
post #29 of 39 (permalink) Old 05-17-2019, 11:55 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 12
Agree, it is hard to use that much brake on the street to pull off heel/toe. I'd like to get better at it anyway.
coloradocarguy is offline  
post #30 of 39 (permalink) Old 05-18-2019, 07:02 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Calgary,Alberta,Canada
Posts: 2,701
Heel and toe is made much more difficult by the current practice of separating the brake and clutch pedals laterally in order for the car makers to be able to have their expert witnesses claim that it is impossible for the driver to operate the wrong pedal.

This is in response to the Audi unintended acceleration nonsense claims that nearly killed off that brand.

The only time you would "need" to brake and rev match simultaneously is when trail braking quite hard into the initial portion of the cornerand you require a downshift at the same time. The gear needs to be engaged while under brakes and you don't want the clutch pedal still depressed as you come off the brake pedal. This is a pretty rare condition on the street, to be frank. Far more often you never trail brake into a corner on the street because you just are nowhere near the limits of the car.



The other topic in this thread is the styling of the Giulia. It's a definite head turner. One of those cars you look back at as you leave it parked....
gregc57 likes this.

1991 Alfa Romeo 164L 5 spd
White on grey leather 230K km, owned from new

Last edited by Michael Smith; 05-18-2019 at 07:13 AM.
Michael Smith is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
For Sale: 1972 Giulia Super 1.3 Rodrick22gtv Alfa Romeo Cars For Sale & Wanted 10 04-15-2014 05:57 AM
Performance debate smsmith Spider - 105 & 115 Series (1966-1994) 25 11-26-2013 02:14 PM
Is there a list of model # designations somewhere? fiat128 Alfa Romeo Topics Not Covered Elsewhere 14 10-20-2010 04:46 AM
Convention Concours Thread Chi Si Dici CAROC - Chicago Alfa Romeo Owners Club 71 06-23-2008 07:15 PM
Fabbri models dretceterini Alfa Romeo Collectibles, Literature & Manuals For Sale & Wanted 2 12-25-2006 12:02 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome