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post #16 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-22-2019, 05:02 PM
Del
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Maybe bigger is more status?

Del

Seattle

1989 Milano, Shankle Sport
1991 164S, stock
1994 164LS (~Q)
1972 Morgan 27

previously owned since 1964:

62 Morris MiniMinor 850, 67 Austin 1275 Cooper S (Downton 3/4 race), 64 Giulia Sprint GT (1st red one made), 72 Fiat 128 Sedan, 75 Alfetta Sedan, 78 Alfetta Sedan, 78 GTV, 81 GTV6, 86 GTV6
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post #17 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-22-2019, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by howndog View Post
I agree. I recently sold our MB R350 6 passenger x-over and replaced with a FIAT 500X. I have 3 kids ages 8-15. We have no problem going out together.(wife included)

My brother has 2 kids ages 3-6 and went from a pathfinder to a 7 pass explorer....why?
I have a big family (5 kids), and used to have 2 Labradors and a cat. We owned a Toyota Tarago/Previa people mover. Was as uncool as but gee it was a good vehicle for moving people. We did 100k km's in that vehicle. It had a 2.2 litre 4 cylinder I think and was FWD only (we don't ever see snow). Later on we got a Nissan Dualis +2, again FWD and 4 cylinder only. This had an occasional 3rd seat row. Again was a great car, but not quite as much internal space as the Tarago.

The concept that you need big and inefficient, enormous engined SUV's is simply BS. Remember guys we are talking road cars, as long as it passes crash tests we are good to go. You do not need to win traffic light races, etc.


And if you think the size of your car relates to the size of your penis or status in this world, well .... come on, time to smell the roses and get a grip. Nobody else gives a toss, other than they might believe you have insecurity issues ...
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post #18 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-22-2019, 05:29 PM
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All the 'problems' discussed in this thread are the reason that Camrys and Suburbans exist...

I would like to see Alfa stay a niche builder, with a few special models and small-production volume - more art, less appliance.

We don't need another luxury builder with eleventeen different 'models' - all with some ugly slack-jawed grille posing as a 'driver's car'.
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post #19 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-22-2019, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by velocissimo View Post
All the 'problems' discussed in this thread are the reason that Camrys and Suburbans exist...

I would like to see Alfa stay a niche builder, with a few special models and small-production volume - more art, less appliance.

We don't need another luxury builder with eleventeen different 'models' - all with some ugly slack-jawed grille posing as a 'driver's car'.
Agree, but we don't actually need Suburbans. Try a Nissan Dualis and bring yourself into the post 2000's in vehicle design and fuel efficiency (and yeah I know Americans don't care about fuel economy, but they should because the earth is being screwed while we all suck oil out of it and do not ever repair the damage. Fracking should be illegal and prevented by the UN immediately by shooting anybody attempting to frack ...)

Pete
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Last edited by PSk; 01-22-2019 at 05:59 PM.
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post #20 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-22-2019, 05:54 PM
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Agree about fracking. Fracking ruins many millions of gallons of water per day and taints area aquifers.
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Del

Seattle

1989 Milano, Shankle Sport
1991 164S, stock
1994 164LS (~Q)
1972 Morgan 27

previously owned since 1964:

62 Morris MiniMinor 850, 67 Austin 1275 Cooper S (Downton 3/4 race), 64 Giulia Sprint GT (1st red one made), 72 Fiat 128 Sedan, 75 Alfetta Sedan, 78 Alfetta Sedan, 78 GTV, 81 GTV6, 86 GTV6
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post #21 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-22-2019, 08:29 PM
So let me get this straight:

Alfa designers are idiots
Americans are pigs
Having choice is bad
GM is the evil empire
All auto designs should be approved by the NZDWKB (New Zeeland Department of We Know Better)
Free market fuel pricing is obscene
Suburbans are phallic symbols
BMW Isetta - the new SUV

Did I miss anything?

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post #22 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-22-2019, 08:35 PM
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Relax, and have another brew, lol.

Del

Seattle

1989 Milano, Shankle Sport
1991 164S, stock
1994 164LS (~Q)
1972 Morgan 27

previously owned since 1964:

62 Morris MiniMinor 850, 67 Austin 1275 Cooper S (Downton 3/4 race), 64 Giulia Sprint GT (1st red one made), 72 Fiat 128 Sedan, 75 Alfetta Sedan, 78 Alfetta Sedan, 78 GTV, 81 GTV6, 86 GTV6
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post #23 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-22-2019, 09:11 PM
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Relax, and have another brew, lol.
Done!

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post #24 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-22-2019, 09:36 PM
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Gprocket,

Yep, you've got it 🙂
Pete
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post #25 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-23-2019, 03:01 AM
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They need to bring diesel engines over.
I think the stelvio is great. I prefer my 2010 Toaureg TDI instead and it's not really that big but slightly larger than the stelvio. Bullet proof, fits the kids and the dog and gets great gas (or diesel) mileage and is a performer. Fast, fun and handles great for a heavy SUV. More versatile than a Stelvio. That said, the touareg is much larger than the Stelvio and fully loaded I still need a box on top for more storage with the dog in the back. Of course I bought this before Alfa came back. Back in the days of delays! Alfa makes great diesel engines and if they brought over a high performance one, it could turn people on.

I think a stelvio with a diesel would be the answer. I don't like many SUV's at all. The touareg for me was just right and different enough to not blend in with everyone else. This could compete with the touareg TDI, the land rover diesel and F-Pace Diesel.


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1989 Spider Quad. Gone
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2010 Touareg TDI
2017 Giulia Ti Sport Q4, Trofeo, Leather package(red), Staggered.

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post #26 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-23-2019, 05:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Del View Post
Maybe bigger is more status?
Trucks, SUVs and crossovers sell two major illusions:

Go anywhere practicality, not.

Increased safety, most definitely not.

Women prefer them, which is very strange given the macho image surrounding this style of vehicle.

Buying a sedan with similar practicality to one of these strange aberrations delivers a vehicle substantially lighter and more efficient to operate.

Buying a coupe or convertible version of the same car is essentially just a fashion statement. Like buying an SUV is.

I checked: the old Giulia came in three versions all weighing within a 100 lbs or so of each other. The most intelligent purchase was always the Berlina version. For the US market the Spider was actually heavier than the Berlina.
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post #27 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-23-2019, 10:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Smith View Post
Trucks, SUVs and crossovers sell two major illusions:

Go anywhere practicality, not.

Increased safety, most definitely not.

Women prefer them, which is very strange given the macho image surrounding this style of vehicle.

Buying a sedan with similar practicality to one of these strange aberrations delivers a vehicle substantially lighter and more efficient to operate.

Buying a coupe or convertible version of the same car is essentially just a fashion statement. Like buying an SUV is.

I checked: the old Giulia came in three versions all weighing within a 100 lbs or so of each other. The most intelligent purchase was always the Berlina version. For the US market the Spider was actually heavier than the Berlina.
For the majority, yes, I agree.

I will use my own vehicle as an example.

"anywhere practicality" depends. I mean I really can't take the giulia camping (off-roading into the wilderness type) or anything else. Now this may be only 10-15% of it's use but the fact that I can use it for those things makes it practical. Same with the hardware store trips, or hauling parts to someone. Plus it's a true 4x4 system. Buying a Chevy tahoe, not practical, just big and a huge gas gussler. I opted for the Touareg based on lots of factors including it's fantastic road ability to Off-road ability. The diesel engine with it's amazing torque and power as well as MPG's. I also run B100 in it when I can. It really does do well on both, drives like a car and off-roads like mad. This vehicle has been very practical in every situation I have put it through.

"Increased safety, most definitely not. " Yes but again also depends. Crash test results for the touareg are top notch. I am not worried about rolling over and the NHTSA gives it 5 stars on everything and 4 stars on roll over. I think the 4 stars also depends on wheel package. 19" with rubber bands may not roll as much (still can though) as 17" with 255/65 tires (which I have). Also depends on quality and spec of tire used. Still they are higher so there is that chance.

"Women prefer them, which is very strange given the macho image surrounding this style of vehicle. "

They do. Let's not forget we live in a patriarchal society so women having this same mindset is common.

I agree on the rest. This is why we have the Giulia and the Touareg. Both serving different purposes of practicality!

Ciao!


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San Diego, CA
1989 Spider Quad. Gone
1991 White Alfa Romeo 164S Recaro, Siena, Zender.-GONE
2010 Touareg TDI
2017 Giulia Ti Sport Q4, Trofeo, Leather package(red), Staggered.

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post #28 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-23-2019, 11:43 AM
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Friend of mine, the one with the Tesla X, also had a Touareg that we rode around in for a weekend. I found that vehicle much more difficult to get in and out of, as it was a long step for me, the sill being too high beside being just a big vehicle. I ended up not liking it much. Not a decent replacement in my own opinion for say a Honda minivan, if you had to have one for kids and dogs, lol, which my nephew has for his two kids and dog. They go camping all the time, having no problems loading everything in, and going most places.

The diesel Alfa Giulietta we rented in Italy drove pretty well, with decent pickup, although I kept bouncing the engine revs off the limiter, lol. It had a nice 6 speed manual, although somewhat tall gearing (we almost never hit 6th). We did like the car, but it just wasn't quite the same fun as a gas powered version. Of course, now, the European governments are backing away from new diesels due to pollution concerns and the increased popularity of electric cars. So, I don't think you will see any new diesel powered vehicles here in the States in the future.

Del

Seattle

1989 Milano, Shankle Sport
1991 164S, stock
1994 164LS (~Q)
1972 Morgan 27

previously owned since 1964:

62 Morris MiniMinor 850, 67 Austin 1275 Cooper S (Downton 3/4 race), 64 Giulia Sprint GT (1st red one made), 72 Fiat 128 Sedan, 75 Alfetta Sedan, 78 Alfetta Sedan, 78 GTV, 81 GTV6, 86 GTV6

Last edited by Del; 01-23-2019 at 12:15 PM.
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post #29 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-23-2019, 06:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Del View Post
Friend of mine, the one with the Tesla X, also had a Touareg that we rode around in for a weekend. I found that vehicle much more difficult to get in and out of, as it was a long step for me, the sill being too high beside being just a big vehicle. I ended up not liking it much. Not a decent replacement in my own opinion for say a Honda minivan, if you had to have one for kids and dogs, lol, which my nephew has for his two kids and dog. They go camping all the time, having no problems loading everything in, and going most places.

The diesel Alfa Giulietta we rented in Italy drove pretty well, with decent pickup, although I kept bouncing the engine revs off the limiter, lol. It had a nice 6 speed manual, although somewhat tall gearing (we almost never hit 6th). We did like the car, but it just wasn't quite the same fun as a gas powered version. Of course, now, the European governments are backing away from new diesels due to pollution concerns and the increased popularity of electric cars. So, I don't think you will see any new diesel powered vehicles here in the States in the future.
Well as they say, to each their own.

No, doubt any diesels but if they re-worked them they can be fun. Alfa is fine where they are. They just need to bring in a V6 NA engine to fit in between the 4cyl and Quad. Maybe a nice 3.2 or 3.5L


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New: +1 619-209-0715
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San Diego, CA
1989 Spider Quad. Gone
1991 White Alfa Romeo 164S Recaro, Siena, Zender.-GONE
2010 Touareg TDI
2017 Giulia Ti Sport Q4, Trofeo, Leather package(red), Staggered.
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post #30 of 38 (permalink) Old 01-23-2019, 07:08 PM
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So, I don't think you will see any new diesel powered vehicles here in the States in the future.
Agree.

And yes takes a while to get used to lugging a diesel and accepting that they like it. When I first got our Mazda 6 diesel I thought it was horrendous, but about 1 month later I had started to adapt to keeping the revs well down, and then by 2 months I loved the thing. By then I left the lights, and a few seconds later it was in 6th gear and would just about drive up a cliff in that same gear ... the rev counter was on about 1000rpm (or something ridiculous for a petrol engine).


In regards to SUV's, I used to hate them and criticize people for buying them, and then I realized that to 99.99% of vehicle owners and users, CoG, ride height, cornering and braking well is not remotely a consideration. They also don't care about 0-60 times, lap speeds, how quickly the engine builds revs, the feel through the steering wheel, etc. They buy a vehicle to get them and their family/passengers from A to B.

The SUV is actually the perfect vehicle for the non-car interested person. And it is not about sitting high to feel like they are dominating the road and safe, it is simply that most SUV's you are getting in at the same height as your standing height. This makes it a million times easier for women (skirts and heels) and older people. Once seated in the car they have a great view of the scenery, etc.

So SUV's are here to stay. Manufacturers have now been able to make them drive well enough, i.e. not like trucks.

It is somewhat sad, but the world is full of compromises and this is another. Our Nissan Dualis (a small SUV) was actually a great drive, and also provided me some amusement because it's cornering grip was so low ... but that meant I could play at ~60 km/h, laughing all the way home.
Pete

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