what should I use between bell housing to gearbox - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
 
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post #1 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-11-2017, 10:07 AM Thread Starter
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what should I use between bell housing to gearbox

Hi, just had the gearbox back from rebuild. I didn't send the bell housing so need o bolt it back together. I have 3 questions.

a. should I used something as a gasket sealer between the 2. It doesn't appear it had anything previously.
b. does anyone know the torque settings for the bolts. I assume FT
c. roughly how much gear oil do I need. I will need some for my LSD and I believe redline do one for both. is that correct?

What do people recommend.

Many Thanks
Chris
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post #2 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-11-2017, 10:20 AM
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Nothing gasket-wise or sealer.

Tighten the bolts snug - don't break or strip them. Note that smaller bolts & nuts use a shorter wrench - that is to limit how much torque you apply. When using a ratchet wrench/socket hold it near the pivot - not the end of the handle. That will limit how much torque you apply.

This is from the Series 3 Spider manual. I suspect other versions are the same. Did your rebuilder specify what oil to use? Redline 75w-90NS is often recommended for the gearbox.
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Last edited by ghnl; 12-11-2017 at 10:24 AM.
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post #3 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-11-2017, 11:07 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by ghnl View Post
Nothing gasket-wise or sealer.

Tighten the bolts snug - don't break or strip them. Note that smaller bolts & nuts use a shorter wrench - that is to limit how much torque you apply. When using a ratchet wrench/socket hold it near the pivot - not the end of the handle. That will limit how much torque you apply.

This is from the Series 3 Spider manual. I suspect other versions are the same. Did your rebuilder specify what oil to use? Redline 75w-90NS is often recommended for the gearbox.


Excellent thx. He just said ep90 it was cloverleaf transmissions.


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post #4 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-11-2017, 11:28 AM
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should I used something as a gasket sealer between the 2. It doesn't appear it had anything previously.
I'm not sure I agree that there should be no sealant, though maybe this varies based on the year of the transmission. Isn't the input shaft seal in the back of the bellhousing, while the bearing is in the front of the transmission? So for the bearing to be lubricated, the bellhousing-transmission interface would have to be wet. Similarly for the O ring seals for the shift rods in early transmissions.

I would use something like Ultra Grey between the bellhousing and transmission case.

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post #5 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-11-2017, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
I would use something like Ultra Grey between the bellhousing and transmission case.
That is the best sealer for most purposes as it is a high torque sealant. The correct and only Lube for Alfa trans and LSDs is RedLine 75-90 NS.

Richard Jemison
RJR Racing

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post #6 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-15-2017, 12:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfanut1750 View Post
Hi, just had the gearbox back from rebuild. I didn't send the bell housing so need o bolt it back together. I have 3 questions.

a. should I used something as a gasket sealer between the 2. It doesn't appear it had anything previously.
b. does anyone know the torque settings for the bolts. I assume FT
c. roughly how much gear oil do I need. I will need some for my LSD and I believe redline do one for both. is that correct?

What do people recommend.

Many Thanks
Chris
Hi Chris,

Yes. Sealant between the assembled case halves and the bellhousing is required.

As mentioned previously, the input shaft seal is installed in the bellhousing face and gear oil can flow freely out of the case from a through hole, both bearings and the shift rod bores. I also recommend replacing the input shaft seal before re-installing the bell housing. Once the new seal is in place, it is advised to cover the splines on the input shaft with some kind of thin removable cover before sliding it into the new seal, as the rubber lips of the seal can easily be damaged by the shaft splines during installation.

As far as which sealant to use, Permatex Ultra Grey is a good all-around choice, but I prefer Permatex Anaerobic Sealant for this application.

The Alfa Romeo Shop Manual specifies the "Nuts securing the clutch bell housing to the half casings" are to be torqued to 17 thru 19 N-m, or 1.7 thru 1.9 Kg-m, or 12.5 thru 14 Ft-lb.

The first 3 photos show how I pushed the new seal into place without damaging the lips or outer flange by using a copper pipe fitting as an install tool. The large end of the pipe had the perfect diameter to fit between the seal lips and outer metal diameter, so it only put pressure on the flat metal base of the flange during install.

The last 2 photos show the gearbox before and after attaching the bell housing. Note the clear plastic covering I fabricated to protect the seal lips from the input shaft splines. The nice thing about Anaerobic sealant is that is does not cure until it is cut off from oxygen, so there is no need to hurry the assembly process.
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post #7 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-15-2017, 12:46 PM
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Holy Smokes, that is a TON of the anaerobic sealant!!! I use a tiny amount and spread it over the mating surfaces such that the surface looks red-tinted. The mating surfaces are machined so a little dab oughta do ya I think?

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post #8 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-15-2017, 02:38 PM
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Ha ha ha. Yeah. You're right Bob. That photo was taken the first time I used the stuff. Quite a bit squeezed out after I tightened the nuts, but it wiped off easily. The bottom line is I didn't have any leaks. I use a little less now.

Edward
'88 Quad - "Claudia"
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post #9 of 9 (permalink) Old 12-30-2017, 05:58 PM
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Beautiful photos of a quality job! And, yes, sealant is required at bell housing to box joint!

I'll just put in another plug for anaerobic sealant. Have found on our 105 tarmac rally cars over the years that Loctite 518 or other brands works perfectly on all machined, stiff, mating surfaces -including sump, gearbox halves, diff case etc. Definitely prefer a bead rather than smear, and a thin bead is fine, but make sure it includes all bolt hole circumferences and small areas that mate. Loctite can come in a syringe pack which is great.

Advantages include no silicone getting in to oil or water system (Loctite completely harmless internally), unlimited time before final assembly, very easy clean up externally--just wipe over with degreaser/turps rag, easy removal from surfaces next time.

Parts that have a gasket required can have the 518 smeared on them for a good seal. Only places that do not seem to work well in our experience have been the thermostat housing and the water passages at the inlet manifold/head face. Use a smear of silicon on the gasket here. Of course no sealant of any kind anywhere on head gasket, except perhaps a line at the back for those gaskets/heads that need it as per cautions on the relevant posts.
Cheers.
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