MAGNAFLOW - Open House / Dyno Day - Page 2 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #16 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-01-2004, 02:24 PM
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Unhappy

Bummer... looks like I'm not going to be able to make it after all.
I'm stuck working tomorrow and there's no way I can make it up there in time for the Magnaflow event.

I was really looking forward to seeing what all the other monster Alfas were putting out too.

Chip Mutza

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post #17 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-03-2004, 07:43 PM
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So... how did it go? I'm bummed I had to miss it.

Chip Mutza

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post #18 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-03-2004, 10:34 PM
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Most Alfas on the dyno were 4 cyl. My general feeling was that many recorded less than expected. Although mine was the highest output Alfa I was a bit disappointed with the measured 146 hp and 158 ft-lbs at wheels. I did watch that the boost went as planned, but didn't really have time to check everything beforehand as my 2-year old kept my busy (didn't like the noise of some of the louder cars). Though, he was very excited about all the Alfas in one place out front

I was really looking forward to seeing Chip's 24v and a 24v GTV6 that had signed up, but both cancelled

Jes

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post #19 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-04-2004, 12:30 AM
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That does seem low, I would have expected your car to come close to 190hp to the rear wheels. Maybe the dyno was calibrated incorrectly or something?

My old "warmed-up" 12v 3.0L put down 171hp & 169 ft-lbs on a DynoJet in HOT HOT HOT weather.

Do you have the dyno plot for your car? Should be interesting to see the torque curve on your turbo car compared to my NA engine.

Chip Mutza

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post #20 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-04-2004, 07:57 AM
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some photos - more to come...
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post #21 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-04-2004, 07:59 AM
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post #22 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-04-2004, 08:02 AM
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post #23 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-04-2004, 10:11 AM
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I wish I could of gone!!!

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post #24 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-04-2004, 10:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AR4me
... My general feeling was that many recorded less than expected...
I thought the same that the numbers seemed on the low side. However, what is the typical loss of hp and torque from the engine to the rear wheels? As an example, if your engine puts out (or you think it puts out) 140hp but at the rear wheels it comes up with 97hp, would that be a typical loss?

Steven Leth
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post #25 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-04-2004, 11:53 AM
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My 65 Spider Veloce curve was almost identical to the 1965 issue of Road & Track - actually a little higher. 94+ horses at the wheels is approx. (+/-)130 at the flywheel. Max torque just under 90 was around 4500 rpm. MPH in 4th at dyno red line was 104. Sound was smoooooth awesome.

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post #26 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-04-2004, 02:49 PM
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MagnaFlow Dyno Accuracy

I suspect the dyno was fairly close to right. The relative humidity was a bit high (this reduces air density) but air temp and atmospheric pressure were reasonable. My stock twinspark engine in a rear drive car hit 112 bhp @ 5600 rpm. My guess is that the rear drive nets a loss of 30 to 35 bhp. So, let's say it was a loss of 35 bhp; that, plus the 112 measured would be 147 bhp at the flywheel. That's darn close to the "advertised" 148 bhp @ 5800 rpm.

I think what we are seeing here is a just an example of how small seat-of-the-pants (SOP) horsepower are compared when with dyno (SAE) horsepower. It looks like it takes about 1.3 SOP horses to equal 1 SAE horse.

Now I must admit, I'm not immune to the SOP hp problem. I had expected my twinspark race engine to be showing something like 140 to 145 bhp. It didn't even get close. However, it was spitting some good sized bits of muffler baffle out the tail pipe which I'm guessing became partially blocked. Guess I should get a MagnaFlow installed!

Bruce Colby - Street = '69 1750 GTV/TS; Track = '65 SGT/TS, '89 E30, '72 914/6
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post #27 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-04-2004, 04:22 PM
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Did you all get the corresponding A/F values graphed against bhp & rpm? That would be extremely useful.
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post #28 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-04-2004, 05:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 75evo
Did you all get the corresponding A/F values graphed against bhp & rpm? That would be extremely useful.
Can't get A/F on the Motronic twinspark because there's no O2 Sensor. It seems there wasn't much unleaded fuel in Europe in the mid to late 80's when the 75 TS was in production. Hence, Motronic wo/O2 sensor feedback to control A/F. I assume it's a nonaddaptive 4.x Motronic system. Interesting isn't it? I wonder if the ECU is coded to take O2 sensor input but that it's just not used on the European engines of that time frame. Any thoughts?

Bruce Colby - Street = '69 1750 GTV/TS; Track = '65 SGT/TS, '89 E30, '72 914/6
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post #29 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-04-2004, 07:34 PM
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At WOT, the Motronic will ignore the O2 sensor and will run on a given map in the ECU. But what's important is the A/F given by the wideband O2 sensor.

Did they use a wideband O2 sensor during dyno?

Its useful because then you can figure out where your car is running lean and where it is running rich. Then you can start tweaking the ECU a little.

For max power, I was told, 12.7:1 A/F is good. Actually using a Lambda value is better.
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post #30 of 69 (permalink) Old 10-04-2004, 07:35 PM
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Gee Bruce, you constantly amaze me. I had no idea you were fluent in Alfabonics.

Norm Silverman
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