Crownwheel for LSD - Page 2 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #16 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-01-2019, 10:44 AM
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In North America "Alfetta" means pre-1980. Rest of the world had the 4 cylinder cars well up into the 90's and that might be where the confusion is coming from.
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84 Spider - Long gone, but started the addiction; 85 GTV6 - Current project, Supercharged, Mega Squirt; 88 Verde - "Milo" It has a name, must be a keeper
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post #17 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-01-2019, 11:03 AM
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transaxle

And to further confuse the topic not all V6 cars here where fitted with gearbox's with the larger crown wheel and pinion. That information is from people doing warranty work when the cars where new.
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post #18 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-01-2019, 02:08 PM
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Andy,
I have an affinity for 116 transaxles. The value of parts transmissions is in providing folks like me with low cost parts for rebuild. I find that with about three transmissions, I only need to buy a few bearings and seals to come up with one really good one. Verde and Platinum boxes are a premium for the LSD. Maybe $500 for a good core. Maybe $100 per for a standard or Alfetta. It would take a special person to find value in the automatic.
Automatic 75's in Australia came with LSD's. Lordy knows why, did the US auto Milano's come with an open diff?

Actually, now that I say that the LSD centre I put into my GTV6 came from an auto 2-litre Berlina. It didn't need any welding, but as I recall it did need a spacer of some sort which Vin Sharp made for me. Worked fine, I owned it for 10 years after the conversion and used it on road and track.

Alister
1973 105 GTV (Alfa #6 of 19 owned)
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post #19 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-02-2019, 04:14 AM
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@Mark_toro and @Aggie57 the automatic, and manual transaxles that I have access to came from USA Alfetta Sedans. Do either of you know what the final drive ratio is in the auto boxes? Could they be LSD?

ALFA ANDY
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post #20 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-02-2019, 02:33 PM
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@Mark_toro and @Aggie57 the automatic, and manual transaxles that I have access to came from USA Alfetta Sedans. Do either of you know what the final drive ratio is in the auto boxes? Could they be LSD?
Sorry, I'm not familiar with US spec Alfetta's. But there are plenty of threads and discussions about this both here and over on the Australian forum, like this one:

Gear Ration Spreadsheet

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1973 105 GTV (Alfa #6 of 19 owned)
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post #21 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-02-2019, 09:36 PM
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The crown wheel is interchangeable between 20 Alfetta's and the V6 cars but the Alfetta main shaft will not go into a V6 gearcase because the intermediate bearings the pinion bearing and the differential bearings are all of a larger diameter in the V6 transaxles So even though the crown wheels can be swapped it's matching main shaft and pinion cannot and the V6 differential will not fit a 20 transaxle case.

[QUOTE=GTVmike;8406124]Does the crownwheel from a standard differential fit on an LSD?........... YES

With other words; is it possible to fit an LSD from a 75 3.0 gearbox in an Alfetta 2.0 gearbox an keep the final drive from the Alfetta?...................NO

Glen 3.0 GTV6 2.0 156 JTS
EX 1.2 Alfasud. 1.8 and 2.0 Alfetta's 2.5 Alfa75
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post #22 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-03-2019, 12:33 PM Thread Starter
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[quote=sportiva;8408266]The crown wheel is interchangeable between 20 Alfetta's and the V6 cars but the Alfetta main shaft will not go into a V6 gearcase because the intermediate bearings the pinion bearing and the differential bearings are all of a larger diameter in the V6 transaxles So even though the crown wheels can be swapped it's matching main shaft and pinion cannot and the V6 differential will not fit a 20 transaxle case.

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Does the crownwheel from a standard differential fit on an LSD?........... YES

With other words; is it possible to fit an LSD from a 75 3.0 gearbox in an Alfetta 2.0 gearbox an keep the final drive from the Alfetta?...................NO


THANK YOU! This answers my question completely. I have an spare 2.0 gearbox and want to fit an LSD in it but keep my final drive.

I found a 3.0 LSD but now I know that I have to find an LSD from a 2.0 gearbox...


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post #23 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-04-2019, 07:11 PM
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Transaxle

pray for Jesus because nobody on earth can help some people.
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post #24 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-05-2019, 04:48 AM
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pray for Jesus because nobody on earth can help some people.
Why would you pray "for" Jesus? Don't people pray "to" Jesus?

ALFA ANDY
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post #25 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-05-2019, 02:11 PM
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Jesus won't help so to keep it real. GTVmike had an idea and it was dashed by those who know these transaxles. He has another idea that is to find an Alfetta LSD. An LSD was offered as an option in GT1.8 Alfetta's and dropped when the two 2.0 GTV was introduced. Finding an Alfetta LSD will next to impossible. In reality GTVmike a twin spark transaxle is your best option they have a 4.1 final drive and will need speedo and gear linkage shaft changes to work correctly all 2.5 manuals have 4.1 open diff's and most 3.0 manuals have 3.55 final drives so your choices are limited. If you have any more questions don't be afraid to ask

Cheers

Glen 3.0 GTV6 2.0 156 JTS
EX 1.2 Alfasud. 1.8 and 2.0 Alfetta's 2.5 Alfa75

Last edited by sportiva; 05-05-2019 at 02:14 PM.
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post #26 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-05-2019, 02:42 PM
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I'm going to throw a spanner into this - I checked back through my notes and in 1990/91 we definitely fitted a 105 LSD centre into the transaxle of an Alfetta GT we raced. We didn't change the crown wheel, we just used the same one and bolted it up to the LSD unit with a spacer so the overall width of was the same as the open carrier.

Some may recall the car, it was called Fang, we ran it for a few years in club events mainly in Victoria but a couple of times in NSW. Great car, rough in the body but lots of tweaks in the suspension department and handled as well as any GT/GTV I've had the pleasure of driving.

Sorry up front if this info causes some to say again 'not possible'....we spent many hours working through these sorts of problems with Vin (Sharp, a.k.a. PACE Engineering) and he always seemed to come up with a solution. In fact it was this conversion that needed us to source the GTV6 stub axles mentioned in my earlier post, not the subsequent one we did on my later GTV6. Cause obviously (I guess) it already had them....

So, I'm coming down on the side of 'yes, it can be done' because we did it......

Alister
1973 105 GTV (Alfa #6 of 19 owned)

Last edited by Aggie57; 05-05-2019 at 02:46 PM.
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post #27 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-05-2019, 04:50 PM
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It is possible to fit a 105 LSD into an Alfetta transaxle then put that into a gtv6. GTVmike will find it extremely difficult to fit a V6 LSD into an Alfetta diff casing but! if you have enough money you can have just about anything engineered.
The first photo shows the type of spacer you will need for a 105 diff modificatio.
The second photo shows the LSD option for Alfetta's.
Attached Images
  

Glen 3.0 GTV6 2.0 156 JTS
EX 1.2 Alfasud. 1.8 and 2.0 Alfetta's 2.5 Alfa75

Last edited by sportiva; 05-05-2019 at 04:53 PM.
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post #28 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-05-2019, 07:26 PM
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Or in other words, Mike doesn't need to find an Alfetta LSD, he just needs to find a 105 LSD and he's good to go .

Alister
1973 105 GTV (Alfa #6 of 19 owned)
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post #29 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-06-2019, 12:14 AM
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And then GTVmike will need an engineering shop that is Alfa smart and knows how to make the spacer of the right thickness for bearing end play, then dial in the pinion depth all for less than the price of a twinspark 4.1 LSD transaxle.
I will say this! for road use you don't need an LSD, On a rainy day a power? or weight transfer induced slide will be hard to catch with the very slow 3.5 turns of lock these cars have.

Glen 3.0 GTV6 2.0 156 JTS
EX 1.2 Alfasud. 1.8 and 2.0 Alfetta's 2.5 Alfa75

Last edited by sportiva; 05-06-2019 at 01:14 AM.
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post #30 of 31 (permalink) Old 05-06-2019, 12:48 PM Thread Starter
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And then GTVmike will need an engineering shop that is Alfa smart and knows how to make the spacer of the right thickness for bearing end play, then dial in the pinion depth all for less than the price of a twinspark 4.1 LSD transaxle.
I will say this! for road use you don't need an LSD, On a rainy day a power? or weight transfer induced slide will be hard to catch with the very slow 3.5 turns of lock these cars have.


Ok...I have an engineering shop with CNC milling machines and lathes. I use my Alfetta GTV both as an road car and trackday car. Mayby I will change the standard steering rack for a short 2.1 rack...

Feels like this thread got a bit out of hands...I only wanted to know if a crownwheel from a 2.0 gearbox fits on (#85 on the picture above) a LSD from a Milano Platinum 3.0 as I have the possibility to buy one for a reasonable price. I realize that I also wantsto know if the 2.0 output shafts (#105) fits to the side gears (#82) of the same LSD and if the bearing (#111) have the same outer diameter on the 2.0 and 3.0 differentials.

I don’t want any information about jesus or any other prophets, gods, mythical creatures or wizards...


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