1984 Maratona "Ran when parked..." - Page 74 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
 785Likes
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1096 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-22-2019, 02:23 PM
PSk
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Tauranga New Zealand
Posts: 11,471
Send a message via AIM to PSk Send a message via Yahoo to PSk
Back when I was a teenager my father's garage had a 280Z Datsun dropped in because an auto-electrician had given up trying to resolve a fault. This fault was random and would just stop the car. My job was the test driver ... lots of fun but this was before mobile phones and we had no idea when and where it was going to cut out, so lots of walking back to the shop.

Eventually we worked out that acceleration or braking could cause the issue, and low and behold around the water pump area we found a wire that had a small bit of bare wire showing and if and when it touched the engine block or water pump the engine would stop. Took days to find but a simple fix in the end.

I wonder if you have something like this, due to an old wire somewhere?
Pete
horsewidower likes this.

'71 1750 Series 2 GTV:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
156 Series 1 v6 ... and remember it's all just opinions
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
PSk is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #1097 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-22-2019, 03:12 PM Thread Starter
Senior Member
Gold Subscriber
 
horsewidower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Wilton Ca
Posts: 2,350
Pete, the one thing this this car has in abundance is "fubar'd" wiring. At least the ignition circuit is generally well defined. So I just need to do a rigorous inspection.

I'll probably go out there and find out I didn't get the connection together securely, or that I didn't tighten the nut well enough.

Everyday is a school day. Learning something new all the time

View my '74 GTV restoration at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


View my '91 164s adventure at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


But wait there's more: View my 164LS thread, now parts car status:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You're kidding, another one?! 1984 GTV6 Maratona
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You didn't...oh yes I did. '73 Berlina graduate course in rust repair. No thread yet, don't want to piss off the GTV

You didn't...oh yes I did II. 1995 164LS 5 speed, awesome when it runs!!!

Musings on shop related items:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
horsewidower is offline  
post #1098 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-22-2019, 03:28 PM
Del
Senior Member
Gold Subscriber
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: seattle
Posts: 15,288
My 86 GTV6 would every once in a long while suddenly have the engine die. Turns out the multiwire plug to the AFM didn't quite match up, and so was always slightly ajar when connected, causing it to lose contact at weird times.

Del

Seattle

1989 Milano, Shankle Sport
1991 164S, stock
1994 164LS (~Q)
1972 Morgan 27

previously owned since 1964:

62 Morris MiniMinor 850, 67 Austin 1275 Cooper S (Downton 3/4 race), 64 Giulia Sprint GT (1st red one made), 72 Fiat 128 Sedan, 75 Alfetta Sedan, 78 Alfetta Sedan, 78 GTV, 81 GTV6, 86 GTV6

Last edited by Del; 08-22-2019 at 06:14 PM.
Del is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #1099 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-22-2019, 04:43 PM Thread Starter
Senior Member
Gold Subscriber
 
horsewidower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Wilton Ca
Posts: 2,350
Abruptly cut out three times on the way home. Definitely ignition as you can smell unburnt fuel as it just as abruptly cuts back in. Took the slow lane all the way, just in case I needed to turn out.

I'll clean all the connections and test wiring this weekend. Taking the Acura tomorrow. Del, I'll definitely look at that.

Everyday is a school day. Learning something new all the time

View my '74 GTV restoration at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


View my '91 164s adventure at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


But wait there's more: View my 164LS thread, now parts car status:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You're kidding, another one?! 1984 GTV6 Maratona
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You didn't...oh yes I did. '73 Berlina graduate course in rust repair. No thread yet, don't want to piss off the GTV

You didn't...oh yes I did II. 1995 164LS 5 speed, awesome when it runs!!!

Musings on shop related items:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
horsewidower is offline  
post #1100 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 10:19 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
Gold Subscriber
 
horsewidower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Wilton Ca
Posts: 2,350
I clearly don't understand how the tail lights work. Using the powerprobe, all I could find were grounds, no power. Yet, some of the lights work, some of them don't.

Also, the wiring diagram I was working on showed one double filament per lens, while there are three behind it.

A buddy helped me try and diagnose the issue, and we think the problem is at the switch, not the tail light. It sure makes sense to start from the source and then move back to the light. I was just hoping there was a simple explanation without having to crawl under the dash and take off the steering wheel...again. I had planned on doing that this last weekend...but the weekend got away from me.
Attached Images
     

Everyday is a school day. Learning something new all the time

View my '74 GTV restoration at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


View my '91 164s adventure at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


But wait there's more: View my 164LS thread, now parts car status:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You're kidding, another one?! 1984 GTV6 Maratona
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You didn't...oh yes I did. '73 Berlina graduate course in rust repair. No thread yet, don't want to piss off the GTV

You didn't...oh yes I did II. 1995 164LS 5 speed, awesome when it runs!!!

Musings on shop related items:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by horsewidower; 08-27-2019 at 10:23 AM.
horsewidower is offline  
post #1101 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 10:56 AM
Registered User
 
alfaloco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Lexington, Kentucky USA
Posts: 2,122
Garage
Bob, I got to ask... do you have a good clean solid bare-metal ground at that G63 point, where all the black leads terminate? That's critical.
Are all the bulb sockets and contact tips clean?
What about the little finger connections onto the PCB's? We used contact enhancer on both PCB's at each copper contact point, and we used tweezers to squeeze the little contact fingers on the connectors together, to put more pressure onto the PCB.

alfaloco
Lexington, KY USA
alfaloco is online now  
post #1102 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 11:08 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
Gold Subscriber
 
horsewidower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Wilton Ca
Posts: 2,350
Yes on the ground point, no on this light's connector and pcb. My exploration was to see if I was getting any signal to the connector, for the tail lights. I do have turn signal and brake lights. And I think I have one back up. Full tail light construct needs R&R.

I was expecting to see power in either the yellow or yellow/black when the headlights were switched on. The headlights light, but nothing from the tail lights. (how many times can you use lights in a sentence and still have it comprehensible???)

So if I get power from the switch, turning the head lights on, then where is the disconnection that renders the tail lights dark? Sounds like a fuse block dive, as I expect that the power splits there.
alfaloco likes this.

Everyday is a school day. Learning something new all the time

View my '74 GTV restoration at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


View my '91 164s adventure at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


But wait there's more: View my 164LS thread, now parts car status:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You're kidding, another one?! 1984 GTV6 Maratona
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You didn't...oh yes I did. '73 Berlina graduate course in rust repair. No thread yet, don't want to piss off the GTV

You didn't...oh yes I did II. 1995 164LS 5 speed, awesome when it runs!!!

Musings on shop related items:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
horsewidower is offline  
post #1103 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 11:09 AM
Registered User
 
alfaloco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Lexington, Kentucky USA
Posts: 2,122
Garage
As I recall, there's only one 1157 double filament bulb used per side, and that's in the location noted stop/tail light. I would remove any others, and ensure the sockets are clean and bright. We used conductive grease on the bulbs, also Bob.

alfaloco
Lexington, KY USA
alfaloco is online now  
post #1104 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 11:20 AM
Registered User
 
alfaloco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Lexington, Kentucky USA
Posts: 2,122
Garage
Yes on the fuse block check... don't pull the steering wheel yet! Fuse 9 and 10. Now-- on the wiring diagram (which I keep here at work on pdf's), I see that the yellow lead runs through the right side REAR marker light, and the license plate lights, THEN to the RS tail light. Might want to trace that out!
horsewidower likes this.

alfaloco
Lexington, KY USA
alfaloco is online now  
post #1105 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 11:30 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
Gold Subscriber
 
horsewidower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Wilton Ca
Posts: 2,350
Yep, they are there, clear as day. And...wait for it...don't work.

As a matter of eliminating problems, I'll clean and grease those also.

However, and this is why I'm puzzled, shouldn't I see a power on the yellow and yellow/black when I turn on the headlights? I'm getting a ground. Does power only flow from one of the red wires in each circuit? Perhaps I'm beating my head against the wall until I find the connection at the fuse block and can show power flowing to the mentioned wires.

I'd rather do bodywork than wiring. I just seem to have a mental block.
alfaloco likes this.

Everyday is a school day. Learning something new all the time

View my '74 GTV restoration at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


View my '91 164s adventure at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


But wait there's more: View my 164LS thread, now parts car status:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You're kidding, another one?! 1984 GTV6 Maratona
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You didn't...oh yes I did. '73 Berlina graduate course in rust repair. No thread yet, don't want to piss off the GTV

You didn't...oh yes I did II. 1995 164LS 5 speed, awesome when it runs!!!

Musings on shop related items:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
horsewidower is offline  
post #1106 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 11:34 AM
Registered User
 
NMMilano's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Albuquerque
Posts: 1,982
Quote:
Originally Posted by horsewidower View Post
Abruptly cut out three times on the way home. Definitely ignition as you can smell unburnt fuel as it just as abruptly cuts back in. Took the slow lane all the way, just in case I needed to turn out.

I'll clean all the connections and test wiring this weekend. Taking the Acura tomorrow. Del, I'll definitely look at that.
On my Milano this problem was in the ignition switch itself. You could jiggle the key and it would catch. Try that next time it dies.
horsewidower likes this.

87 Milano Platinum
76 Alfetta GT race car
70 Fulvia 1.3 Rally S
68 Fiat 850
NMMilano is offline  
post #1107 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 11:39 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
Gold Subscriber
 
horsewidower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Wilton Ca
Posts: 2,350
Hmmm, that's interesting. Part of the mystery is that the tach doesn't die when it happens. Most instances that I'm aware of, when the glitch occurs the tach takes a dive.

Everyday is a school day. Learning something new all the time

View my '74 GTV restoration at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


View my '91 164s adventure at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


But wait there's more: View my 164LS thread, now parts car status:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You're kidding, another one?! 1984 GTV6 Maratona
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You didn't...oh yes I did. '73 Berlina graduate course in rust repair. No thread yet, don't want to piss off the GTV

You didn't...oh yes I did II. 1995 164LS 5 speed, awesome when it runs!!!

Musings on shop related items:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
horsewidower is offline  
post #1108 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 11:45 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
Gold Subscriber
 
horsewidower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Wilton Ca
Posts: 2,350
Quote:
Originally Posted by alfaloco View Post
As I recall, there's only one 1157 double filament bulb used per side, and that's in the location noted stop/tail light. I would remove any others, and ensure the sockets are clean and bright. We used conductive grease on the bulbs, also Bob.
That's what the diagram says. However, these sockets are clearly 1157's as they have the offset posts. But, they only have one contact at the bottom. At least on the left lens. I didn't pull off the right.

Everyday is a school day. Learning something new all the time

View my '74 GTV restoration at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


View my '91 164s adventure at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


But wait there's more: View my 164LS thread, now parts car status:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You're kidding, another one?! 1984 GTV6 Maratona
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You didn't...oh yes I did. '73 Berlina graduate course in rust repair. No thread yet, don't want to piss off the GTV

You didn't...oh yes I did II. 1995 164LS 5 speed, awesome when it runs!!!

Musings on shop related items:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
horsewidower is offline  
post #1109 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 12:06 PM
Registered User
 
alfaloco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Lexington, Kentucky USA
Posts: 2,122
Garage
Maybe those extra 1157 sockets were for the European required rear fog lamps?? And simply not utilized in the NA market cars. I don't clearly remember that from Mike's car, but at my station in life that doesn't mean much!!

Anyway, I hear what you're saying about power feed from the yellow and yellow/black wires. It's either there, or it's not.

As we received it in 2014, Mike's car had supplemental wiring spliced in for the tail lights, and according to e-mails I have, it was done by Greg Gordon's father long ago. Allegedly to overcome some of the known gremlins in this wiring and PCB connectors. He soldered directly to the PCB's and tapped in to improve the connection integrity.
horsewidower likes this.

alfaloco
Lexington, KY USA
alfaloco is online now  
post #1110 of 1147 (permalink) Old 08-27-2019, 12:08 PM Thread Starter
Senior Member
Gold Subscriber
 
horsewidower's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Wilton Ca
Posts: 2,350
Quote:
Originally Posted by alfaloco View Post
I don't clearly remember that from Mike's car, but at my station in life that doesn't mean much!!
Good to know we have more in common, Alfas and "CRS syndrome".
alfaloco likes this.

Everyday is a school day. Learning something new all the time

View my '74 GTV restoration at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


View my '91 164s adventure at:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


But wait there's more: View my 164LS thread, now parts car status:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You're kidding, another one?! 1984 GTV6 Maratona
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


You didn't...oh yes I did. '73 Berlina graduate course in rust repair. No thread yet, don't want to piss off the GTV

You didn't...oh yes I did II. 1995 164LS 5 speed, awesome when it runs!!!

Musings on shop related items:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
horsewidower is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome