Scans of Fusi's Production Numbers (from "Tutte le Vetture dal 1910") - Page 2 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #16 of 78 (permalink) Old 10-26-2006, 11:03 AM
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Ckd

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Originally Posted by gtv2000
G.d.= Guida destra= right hand drive
CKD= Car knocked down= assembled in an abroad factory (such as South Africa or Malaysia most probably) from a kit.
Thanks gtv2000..Read the South Africa Alfa thread..Answers all my questions...Nice one guys

V6 GTJ
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post #17 of 78 (permalink) Old 10-26-2006, 02:14 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by gtv2000
Well, if your point is to make note that there can be errors in Fusi, you're of course right. If with that you intend to play down his work, I have two observations: [snip]
I had no intention of playing down his work. In fact, I'm grateful the book exists. However, I do have a problem with the job the editors did: lousy proof-reading. There are so many errors in the production numbers that I see as being a result of transcription errors and typos, that they could (and should) have been weeded out by the time the 3rd Edition appeared.

With respect to completeness, I have no problesm accepting the fact that it only shows information that was available at the time and cannot contain information that was discovered later. This is the main reason why I suggested taking the information with a grain of salt and contacting the historical archive for the latest (and best) information about a specific car or model.

I heard about d'Amico & Tabucchi's book that there is/was a 3rd tome with corrections. However, I never saw it and therefore do not know if that information is correct. The new and revised edition is curently scheduled for publication in 2007, see here.

-Ruedi
[SIZE="1"]'63 2600 Touring Spider (AR 191437, the car that started the 2000/2600 International Register, reassembly in progress)
ex-'65 2600 SZ (AR 856043, the car in my avatar, sold as resto project to Austria)
Maintainer of a private 2600 SZ register (not the one in the Netherlands).[/SIZE]

Last edited by tubut; 10-26-2006 at 02:18 PM.
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post #18 of 78 (permalink) Old 10-26-2006, 03:05 PM
 
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Originally Posted by tubut
I had no intention of playing down his work. In fact, I'm grateful the book exists. However, I do have a problem with the job the editors did: lousy proof-reading. There are so many errors in the production numbers that I see as being a result of transcription errors and typos, that they could (and should) have been weeded out by the time the 3rd Edition appeared.

With respect to completeness, I have no problesm accepting the fact that it only shows information that was available at the time and cannot contain information that was discovered later. This is the main reason why I suggested taking the information with a grain of salt and contacting the historical archive for the latest (and best) information about a specific car or model.

I heard about d'Amico & Tabucchi's book that there is/was a 3rd tome with corrections. However, I never saw it and therefore do not know if that information is correct. The new and revised edition is curently scheduled for publication in 2007, see here.

As far as I am aware, the correction were only done as a small brochure, and was only obtainable through a direct request from the publisher. The book was first published in 1996, and the "adendum" circa 1998.

It is possible, however, that some of the last books from that production run had the brochures already inserted, as due to the high price, the first edition was available as late as 2001!!

I don't think a second edition was ever done of the two volume book.

Later (circa 2003), a fairly thin, single book, incomplete version was done at around $25-$30, and these can still be found on e-bay most of the time. IMO, this version doesn't have much worth..

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post #19 of 78 (permalink) Old 10-28-2006, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by dretceterini
As far as I am aware, the correction were only done as a small brochure, and was only obtainable through a direct request from the publisher. The book was first published in 1996, and the "adendum" circa 1998.
Ruedi and Stu: this is right: I got my version with a 16 pages errata inserted, but I seem to remember it was earlier than 1998. Yet, the huge errata was far from addressing all the many, many errors. Polemics arose also about the 16HP "Fiacre" type Darracq the authors included as an Alfa, while it was probably never produced as such, if at all.

All in all, Tabucchi's book is by far less reliable than Fusi. Yet it adds quite much documentation and material, but it counts among the missed occasions. I've heard about the revised edition, but I'll carefully rate how much new there is in: already in the 1996 version, hundreds of pages covered the cars then in the showroom next block...

And indeed, Fusi's typos and errors are most probably publishing ones: again, there was no such thing as a computer then, just figure out the work of manually typing or writing down with a pen all those figures... Errors were unavoidable, and yes, they shall have been corrected for the 1978 edition, if only someone competent enough had done the job of checking through them all.
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post #20 of 78 (permalink) Old 10-28-2006, 10:35 AM
 
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I think the Tabucchi book augments the Fusi book, but as GTV2000 said, doesn't replace it. I am waiting to see the new edition to see if it is worth buying. It's not cheap....
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post #21 of 78 (permalink) Old 10-29-2006, 09:36 AM
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I consider it a remarkable feat to complile 75+ years of production from "hand scribed books" into a single book. I have the first edition (grey cover) and the 2nd book (red/white). It is my belief that in the interest of saving time and effort, the publisher most likely just copied the plates over into the new book. I could imagine the angst of having to go back into the archives to compile revisions to the production numbers, especially considering Sr. Luigi Fusi's age at the time of the 2nd book.
I know for a fact that his restoration shops were to be torn down as he told me himself (ref. Alfa Romeo...die nestri segni), and his restoration projects for the museum were his highest priority. Sr. Fusi was also keeping up a lot of personal correspondence with Alfa owners around the world with prewar cars, trying to establish parts and drawings for many of them from the archives.
When Sr. Fusi retired from Alfa Romeo he had put in 50 years with the company starting at a very early age. He knew all of the drivers, and company managers through the years as he worked as an apprentice in the design department. That is how he was able to restore many of the cars that no longer existed, as he was able to go to the archives and pull the original blue prints. I could go on further but I would be digressing from the thread.

I also have the Amico e Tabucchi book. The presentation is exquisite. It takes the Fusi book foundation in to the present. The 2nd edition should be a nice revision and update to add to ones collection. The costs of printing in paper today should probably put the book in the $500 range to start is my estimate.
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post #22 of 78 (permalink) Old 10-29-2006, 06:12 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by velocedoc
I also have the Amico e Tabucchi book. The presentation is exquisite. It takes the Fusi book foundation in to the present. The 2nd edition should be a nice revision and update to add to ones collection. The costs of printing in paper today should probably put the book in the $500 range to start is my estimate.

Not quite that bad. Nada is publishing it and it is supposed to be out in 2007...

Alfa Romeo Le vetture di produzione (Production cars) 1910/2007 (Italian/English text) UNDER PREPARATION (2007) :::
Author/s: Stefano d'Amico - Maurizio Tabucchi
ISBN: 88-7911-322-4
Publishing date: 2007
Price €: 150.00
Size: 24,3x27 cms - Pages: approx. 1000 - Photos: over 2000 in b/w and in colour - Hardbound with jacket (two volumes in a slipcase) - Text: Italian/English

Revised and updated to 2007, Alfa Romeo: the Production Cars was first published in 1996, written by the authoritative experts on the Portello manufacturer, Stefano d'Amico and Maurizio Tabucchi. This fascinating story of Alfa Romeo cars is told model by model by a text that results from precise and carefully researched reconstruction of the facts, which has been enriched with detailed technical specifications (chassis numbering included) and rare archive illustrative material. All of Alfa recent production can also be found in this second edition of the book, starting with the 155, the car that ended the previous publication, the 156, 145, 146, 147, 166 and the recently announced Alfa Romeo GT. All of which has been brought together in two distinct volumes and contained in their own elegant slipcase.
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post #23 of 78 (permalink) Old 09-30-2007, 04:18 PM
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Strange engine number on my 1300 JZ

Quote:
Originally Posted by dretceterini View Post
The D'Amico & Tabucchi book (the original 2 volumes in a slipcase version) is being reissued, but will be expensive. The original is very difficult to find at less than $500; even more than a copy of Fusi. I believe it is a bit bit more accurate than Fusi, but still has any number of errors. The same problem with incorrect or incomplete record keeping exists with many Italian car companies, including Ferrari !

BTW, there are copies of Fusi available on CD Rom...
Hello dretceterini,

I agree with that. I use the Fusi bible as the prime source of reference whenever there is a question from my fellow Alfaholics in Holland. I than check the data in Maurizio Tabucchi's 'Guida all'identificazione Alfa Romeo' and in the D'Amico & Tabucchi book.

But still I can't figure out what is the matter with the engine number in my GT1300 Junior Zagato. My question is listed as a thread in the Limited production 1960 - 1977 section. Do you have any suggestions?

Thanks! Ciao, Olaf

Olaf Roeten a.k.a. Zagato_Olaf, Bussum, The Netherlands
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post #24 of 78 (permalink) Old 09-30-2007, 05:47 PM
 
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Hello dretceterini,

I agree with that. I use the Fusi bible as the prime source of reference whenever there is a question from my fellow Alfaholics in Holland. I than check the data in Maurizio Tabucchi's 'Guida all'identificazione Alfa Romeo' and in the D'Amico & Tabucchi book.

But still I can't figure out what is the matter with the engine number in my GT1300 Junior Zagato. My question is listed as a thread in the Limited production 1960 - 1977 section. Do you have any suggestions?

Thanks! Ciao, Olaf

I honestly don't know, but there ARE errors in BOTH Fusi and Tabucchi.
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post #25 of 78 (permalink) Old 10-10-2007, 05:44 PM
 
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One of the things that I have questioned for years is if some of the 6c2300Bs were actually never completed as such, and in fact became pre-war 6c2500s. One example is in regard to Fusi listing S?N 813810-813915 for the B Pescara PLUS S/N 815001-815101 for the B Mille Miglia. Other sources say there was only a total of 105 cars for BOTH types, not 205 as Fusi sates. Personally, I think some of the 6c2300B MM cars actually became pre-war 6c2500 Tipo 256 and 6c2500 cars. Calligaris, from the 6c2500 register says there were 19 Tipo 256s alone. Anselmi only shows a total of 17 Tipo 256 PLUS pre-war 6c2500SS. I think this lends some credence to my long standing theory that some 6c2300Bs were re-numbered and became actually became pre-war 6c2500s....thoughts please....
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post #26 of 78 (permalink) Old 01-27-2008, 09:19 AM
 
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A bit confused

If I come across has being thick, please do not judge me too fast !

We have a Kam Tail Spider 1971.

Our vin number is 1486553 and engine number 6553.

However that make my car a 105.62, which I think is a Boat tail cars.

Do I have a rare car ??
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post #27 of 78 (permalink) Old 01-27-2008, 05:11 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Gary and Janet View Post
If I come across has being thick, please do not judge me too fast !

We have a Kam Tail Spider 1971.

Our vin number is 1486553 and engine number 6553.

However that make my car a 105.62, which I think is a Boat tail cars.

Do I have a rare car ??
I don't know about the numbers (if you don't get a satisfactory answer here, you may want to post your question in the Spider 1966 and up forum) but to me, a Kamm tail is a Kamm tail and therefore not rare.

-Ruedi
[SIZE="1"]'63 2600 Touring Spider (AR 191437, the car that started the 2000/2600 International Register, reassembly in progress)
ex-'65 2600 SZ (AR 856043, the car in my avatar, sold as resto project to Austria)
Maintainer of a private 2600 SZ register (not the one in the Netherlands).[/SIZE]
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post #28 of 78 (permalink) Old 01-28-2008, 11:03 PM
 
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Had a reply from Alfa in Italy

World wide sales are has follows -

105.62 type “osso di seppia”.



1968 – 259

1969 – 1146





105.62 type “coda tronca”



1970 – 1426

1971 – 1211

1972 – 7

So not so rare, never mind I still love her
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post #29 of 78 (permalink) Old 03-08-2008, 09:57 AM
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Hello People,

I recently bought a (I believe) built Sept. 1974 regd. July 1975 in Germany GT Junior 1.6 Bertone.

The Chassis no. is AK * 220 * 1053 and Engine no. 00536 *S2663.

Am I correct in the car type?
Do these no.s match and lastly.. How many of that version were constructed?

I am humble in you company guys and appreciate any help.

Gordon

[B]Gordon[/B], [COLOR="YellowGreen"]Kildare[/COLOR] [COLOR="DarkOrange"]Ireland[/COLOR], [COLOR="SeaGreen"]Gittana di [/COLOR][COLOR="Red"][COLOR="SeaGreen"]Perledo[/COLOR] Italia[/COLOR]
[I]1973 GT 1600 Junior[/I]
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post #30 of 78 (permalink) Old 08-04-2008, 01:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary and Janet View Post
Had a reply from Alfa in Italy

World wide sales are has follows -

105.62 type “osso di seppia”.



1968 – 259

1969 – 1146





105.62 type “coda tronca”



1970 – 1426

1971 – 1211

1972 – 7

So not so rare, never mind I still love her
I don't know if the same apply to the US (10562) version, but the Euro (10557) version changed the prefix chassis no. ciffers from 141xxxx to 182xxxx when the Round Tail gave way for the Kamm Tail 1750, which incidently became the 1970 MY (1st. produced late '69).
Btw, Fusi says that 4039 10557s were produced, but counting the numbers it turns out to only 3036!!!!????
Erik
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