Can a Car be Art? The 8C on Top Gear - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
 
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post #1 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-14-2008, 06:23 PM Thread Starter
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Can a Car be Art? The 8C on Top Gear

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"Buying this car for it's dynamic abilities is like buying a porn film for it's plot."


Don - '85 GTV6 (sold)/'98 V70 XC
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post #2 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-15-2008, 09:39 PM
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Awesome.

Sounds like the 8C may be likened to the Montreal. Dynamically flawed, but who cares when it looks beautiful and sounds incredible.

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post #3 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-17-2008, 11:46 AM
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Awesome.

Sounds like the 8C may be likened to the Montreal. Dynamically flawed, but who cares when it looks beautiful and sounds incredible.
Depends who you ask. Take a look at the new EVO magazine on stands now. They give it 4.5 out of 5 stars and say the dynamics are near perfect with a little more body roll than expected. Steering is nailed down and the balance front to back is great with load of traction. I think Clarkson is commenting on the body roll and trying to create great television.

Top Gear is more entertainment than real car reviews.

We'll see when it shows up :-)
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post #4 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-17-2008, 11:34 PM
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Depends who you ask. Take a look at the new EVO magazine on stands now. They give it 4.5 out of 5 stars and say the dynamics are near perfect with a little more body roll than expected. Steering is nailed down and the balance front to back is great with load of traction. I think Clarkson is commenting on the body roll and trying to create great television.

Top Gear is more entertainment than real car reviews.

We'll see when it shows up :-)
But at the same rate Clarkson has no reason to lie. Actually i've read its balance is rather good in many magazines, but somethings up with the steering. Its not the mechanics because on early cars they supposidly had some of the best steering around, but somewhere between 06 and 08 someone decided it would be a great idea to kill all the steering feedback. My theory is that the final production model came out as such because Mr. Domenico Martino (final tuner) either has arthritis or gets nervous when the steering gives feedback.

Either that or the lack of steering feel is a strategic choice so that people who already own 8Cs will want the hardcore version if/when such comes out.

I wouldn't worry about it though, the way i look at it is that if you really wanted to fix the steering it would probably be much much much easier, possible,and cheaper then trying to design a car that beautiful. And anyways most great Italian cars and bikes have a history of being a little incomplete from the factory, just weeds out all the non-deserving costumers

NOTE: As a huge JC fan, his reference towards "feeling like a mustang" probably meant it felt a little under-dampened by his own standards, might be worth fact checking in some other articles.

Last edited by Ottobon; 07-17-2008 at 11:41 PM.
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post #5 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-17-2008, 11:39 PM
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Good point.

Also, I don't think the paddle shifter gearbox helped its cause at all, (I understand it is available with a manual too.)

- Luke -
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post #6 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-18-2008, 08:53 AM
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But at the same rate Clarkson has no reason to lie. Actually i've read its balance is rather good in many magazines, but somethings up with the steering. Its not the mechanics because on early cars they supposidly had some of the best steering around, but somewhere between 06 and 08 someone decided it would be a great idea to kill all the steering feedback. My theory is that the final production model came out as such because Mr. Domenico Martino (final tuner) either has arthritis or gets nervous when the steering gives feedback.

Either that or the lack of steering feel is a strategic choice so that people who already own 8Cs will want the hardcore version if/when such comes out.

I wouldn't worry about it though, the way i look at it is that if you really wanted to fix the steering it would probably be much much much easier, possible,and cheaper then trying to design a car that beautiful. And anyways most great Italian cars and bikes have a history of being a little incomplete from the factory, just weeds out all the non-deserving costumers

NOTE: As a huge JC fan, his reference towards "feeling like a mustang" probably meant it felt a little under-dampened by his own standards, might be worth fact checking in some other articles.

Don't get me wrong... I am a huge JC and TG fan. Watch every episode within hours of its airing (which is not easy in the US).

But JC has admitted publicly and most recently in interviews here in the US as they start to work on the US version of TG (which I am sure will be horrible), that TG is about entertainment not car reviews. Hence the language that is usually over the top when describing cars (something that is good about a car is AMAZING and something that is a little off is TERRIBLE). And they do stage certain scenes for dramatic effect such as the Caravan episode etc - I won't touch the races that seems to set him off recently.

Out here is made a statement along the lines of... if you want a car review read a magazine... if you want to be entertained and see some beautiful car footage watch Top Gear.

Irrespective... I am always drawn towards beautiful cars with flaws... Don't know why... The perfect cars are usually too clinical and boring. We will see what happens but right now I am hoping the car is closer to how it is described in Winding Road, MotorTrend, Car, EVO, Road and Track, AutoWeek, and AutoExpress...
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post #7 of 8 (permalink) Old 07-18-2008, 07:53 PM
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Don't get me wrong... I am a huge JC and TG fan. Watch every episode within hours of its airing (which is not easy in the US).

But JC has admitted publicly and most recently in interviews here in the US as they start to work on the US version of TG (which I am sure will be horrible), that TG is about entertainment not car reviews. Hence the language that is usually over the top when describing cars (something that is good about a car is AMAZING and something that is a little off is TERRIBLE). And they do stage certain scenes for dramatic effect such as the Caravan episode etc - I won't touch the races that seems to set him off recently.

Out here is made a statement along the lines of... if you want a car review read a magazine... if you want to be entertained and see some beautiful car footage watch Top Gear.

Irrespective... I am always drawn towards beautiful cars with flaws... Don't know why... The perfect cars are usually too clinical and boring. We will see what happens but right now I am hoping the car is closer to how it is described in Winding Road, MotorTrend, Car, EVO, Road and Track, AutoWeek, and AutoExpress...
If theirs that many mags that said it was good in some particular way then I'm sure it is so.

Its also worth noting that one week he'll call the Boxster a terrible joke, and the next week he'll say that the RS60 is so good it should be Italian. Part of this is, as he himself has admitted, that he likes to change his mind, for no particular reason.

What i'm saying is I'm sure he had at least a little reason to say some of what he said, but your absolutely right in that he likes to exaggerated the good and the bad. In particular i notice that (i read all his columns, because i'm a fanboi ) he is extremely harsh on any sporty car that isn't as sporty as it could be (unless of course its a Aston or a Jag), but when a sedan comes along that handles 1/2 as good as said sporty car he goes on and on about how great it handles, so that could be apart of it too. He was also probably harsh on the handling as it would make his "Cars as Art" argument more plausible.


Anyways, what makes up the 8C is almost all the stuff i would want in a car as a human being, stuff i never choosed to like, i just happen to for some mysterious reason. Sure it would be nice if their was more luggage room, but after being turned onto Alfas i really don't care because they hit the mark where so many other cars completely fail. So even if its a bit flawed there is no doubt in my mind that its already a Classic.

Point is, don't loose sleep over any of it. Even the best car ever made in the world could be joyless if the person driving it was too preoccupied with confidence issues.

Last edited by Ottobon; 07-18-2008 at 08:15 PM.
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