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post #76 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-03-2018, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by esepodg View Post
Hey Don

about the condition of the push/pull switches that look crusty... I found a very interesting tread about a Frenchmen that is doing a beautiful restoration of a 102, he had the same problem but with a bit of polishing, applying some varnish he obtained a fantastic result. You can find this tread by following this link:
h**p://alfa-romeo-classique.forumactif.com/t17049p825-spider-2000-touring

It is about 3/4 down on the page, with pictures. In case you need any translation done, let me know and i will be happy to oblige. You have been an inspiration troughout my own restoration of a 102, and after 5 years I am finally seeing light at the end of the tunnel!
P.S. I also have "the dots" on my steering wheel, my car is a 61 version

Keep up the Alfa spirit, and i will be following your tread.

Best regards from Belgium

Fred
These are plated like every other ALfa that has them... that's the "crusty part" ... $15 apiece max. easy peesy.
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post #77 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-03-2018, 10:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by esepodg View Post
I found a very interesting tread about a Frenchmen that is doing a beautiful restoration of a 102, he had the same problem but with a bit of polishing, applying some varnish he obtained a fantastic result. You can find this tread by following this link:
h**p://alfa-romeo-classique.forumactif.com/t17049p825-spider-2000-touring
Hello Fred,

Happy to see that you follow the french (and more complete) version of my restoration

Spider 2000 Touring - Page 44

Serge
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post #78 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-08-2018, 08:29 PM Thread Starter
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Nearly dismantled

A good couple of days with the air ratchet and hammer. Everything above the floor pans is now removed, and the only things below are the front suspension, rear end, brake and fuel lines, pedals, and E-brake handle. That's just a couple of hours work. Then, on to building (another) rotisserie.

I had some trouble getting the right door off. I can't imagine what the PO was messing around with the doors for. The left was already removed when I got it, and the right was held in place by only the upper hinge pin. I temporarily put the lower pin back in place, and there's a bad misalignment. I suspect this was caused by someone yanking on the door, rather than something being wrong beforehand.

On they whole, there's very little evidence of any work being done on this car, except for the question mark about the doors, and the green paint found on a few things not normally painted as part of routine maintenance.

There were globs of putty covering the four nuts securing the four bolts securing the lower windshield trim strip. Leaks? Standard factory sealing?

There were two rubber strips on the inside upper corner of the door openings. Again, rain exclusion issues? Picture below.

Scraping away the floorboard sound-deadening mats turned out to be a great deal easier than I expected. Meanwhile, whenever paint/primer was pulled up, mostly it was bright steel underneath. Same in the trunk.

Steering wheel popped right off after putting in the heli-coils, heating patiently, and pulling with the puller.

Only damage I've found so far is the box-steel structure that runs fore and aft between the suspension cross member and the lower valence. This is otherwise referred to as the "parking lot concrete berm finder".

I expect to have the tub entirely dismantled by Wednesday evening, then on to the rotisserie.

I'm planning on using the same guy I used for my previous 102 for the stripping. He's got a new machine. No more baking soda. He now uses a variety of glass beads in a water slurry. I've seen pics of the results. Wow.
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Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...

Last edited by DPeterson3; 01-08-2018 at 08:57 PM.
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post #79 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-09-2018, 06:30 AM
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Don - I found the same rubber/foam strips in the door opening (your 2nd picture), mine were covered in paint from previous resprays so I assumed that they were original, presumably to keep the rain out.

The teardown phase is always fun, glad you're not finding much rust.

83 GTV6 (RHD), 60 Touring 2000 Spider and 59 Giulietta Spider race car
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post #80 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-09-2018, 07:18 AM Thread Starter
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Another change from the '59 is a drain tube that extends down from the bottom of the windshield side uprights through a dimpled hole in the plate that covers the upright attachment nuts. I don't know that I would have guessed a lot of water would accumulate in the area under the upright, but perhaps, by 1960, Touring was already receiving numerous complaints about factory-original rust and felt they needed to make a visible effort.

Nah. Probably not.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #81 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-09-2018, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardM View Post
Don - I found the same rubber/foam strips in the door opening (your 2nd picture), mine were covered in paint from previous resprays so I assumed that they were original, presumably to keep the rain out.
It's unlikely that the area where the rubber strips are placed would be prone to rain problems. I suspect rattling and/or wind noises may be the reason why they were installed.

-Ruedi
[SIZE="1"]'63 2600 Touring Spider (AR 191437, the car that started the 2000/2600 International Register, reassembly in progress)
ex-'65 2600 SZ (AR 856043, the car in my avatar, sold as resto project to Austria)
Maintainer of a private 2600 SZ register (not the one in the Netherlands).[/SIZE]
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post #82 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-09-2018, 01:52 PM
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Originally Posted by DPeterson3 View Post
Another change from the '59 is a drain tube that extends down from the bottom of the windshield side uprights through a dimpled hole in the plate that covers the upright attachment nuts.
The same system is present on the 2600

Quote:
Originally Posted by tubut View Post
It's unlikely that the area where the rubber strips are placed would be prone to rain problems. I suspect rattling and/or wind noises may be the reason why they were installed.
Agree with you.

Well done Don !
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post #83 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-09-2018, 01:58 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tubut View Post
It's unlikely that the area where the rubber strips are placed would be prone to rain problems. I suspect rattling and/or wind noises may be the reason why they were installed.
You may be right. But.... back in the late 60's and through the early 80's, something as simple as the front rubber door sealing strip would not have been easily found. I can imagine an owner of such an old and worthless car would have simply tried to stop the drip on his pants leg, without realizing where it was coming from, or what might have failed to allow it in.

Plus, Touring doors with good perimeter seals do not rattle.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #84 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-09-2018, 09:09 PM
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Coincidence or factory upgrade?
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______________________________
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'59 Touring Spider in (slow) progress
'87 Spider Veloce (former)
'68 BMW 1600
'02 BMW R1100S
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post #85 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-10-2018, 04:35 AM Thread Starter
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I'm beginning to think factory....

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #86 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-10-2018, 05:50 AM
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My car #836 had them from the factory....... Also, I confirmed I did not use an E-brake handle from a 105 for my 102 spider.
Looks like a very nice car Don... All the best
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post #87 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-10-2018, 08:23 AM Thread Starter
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I note that the picture above does not have the hole in the cover-plate for the drain tube. I vaguely recall that my car, 00072, has a third hole in the upper body panel, which I always wondered about, but no tube or hole in the cover plate.

I'm going to have a small batch of door hinge pins made. Let me know soon if you want any.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #88 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-10-2018, 06:29 PM Thread Starter
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Rear end removal. No honey. Not you. Put down the knife

I got all the stuff under the car in the rear out and onto the floor. It was momentarily exciting when I detached the two nuts, one holding the top of a shock and the other holding a piece of all-thread where the shock used to be. The springs still had quite a load, and as I had the rear end supported by my floor jack, the car jumped about 9" into the air, fortunately coming back down on the jack stands. Phew. A couple of inches left or right and it might have turned out differently.

The rear brakes do not appear to be self-adjusting, but they have that funny big knob just like the front. I have no idea what it does, or how it does it. Inside that knob is a pin that fits into a grooved pin. On first glance, it would seem to be more of a guide than anything that would adjust the clearances. Lots of meat left on the linings. Cylinders frozen, but oddly clean. I'll soak them in a variety of magical, holistic essential oils, and dangle a crystal over them. The California method.

The axles required both persuasion, and heating around the end of the housing to encourage looseness. The bearings finally got unstuck, along with the axles. Hopefully nothing got bent in the process.

The oil inside, presumably since at least the 70s, was a medium amber and clear-ish.

The backing plates left and right are identical to each other. As assembled, this means the cylinder and adjusting shaft are clocked differently from side to side. I doubt it matters, but will research whether that's correct or not. Should I have a left/right backing plate? Parts book research.

After cleaning everything up, I'll haul the axle housing over to the powder coater, and the pumpkin down to Larry for a good check. That's a long time just sitting.
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Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...

Last edited by DPeterson3; 01-10-2018 at 06:32 PM.
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post #89 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-10-2018, 06:43 PM Thread Starter
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I just checked the book. The rear backing plates should be different. This may be related to the right plate being painted green. According to the early 2600 manual (same rear brakes) the wheel cylinder should be behind the axle, hanging down at about 45 degrees. The crusty left brake assembly appears to match the book. The right assembly, oriented more or less vertically with the cylinder on the bottom, is incorrect.

Anyone have a late-version, right side backing plate? Oh. Wait a moment. I think I've got one on the entire rear end assembly out in the storage garage. I'd still need a replacement for that one, but at least I won't be held up.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
DPeterson3 is offline  
post #90 of 1015 (permalink) Old 01-10-2018, 07:16 PM
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Don,
You are a guiding light for those of us who are sitting on our projects; your activities, which are inspiring, infuses us with the activation energy to get up off the couch and make progress on our own projects. You make it look so easy, attesting to your expertise in these areas.
You stated that you are sending the axle housing for powder coating.
Do you believe that powder coating and painting produce the same result? I do not believe that any of the parts of these vintage Alfa Romeo cars were powder coated. I only ask this because I have started to Powder coat many of the parts that were originally painted satin black, because I believe that powder coating is better. eg. Plenum tube on the 2600. I have wondered if this is ok for concours. I realize that there have been many arguments on this forum about original vs owner preference, but you expressed that you were gonna sell this restoration and the highest awards go to originality.

Also, I do not understand the reference to the funny Big Knob-where is the FBK?
Clear-ish is good for gear juice.

Lastly, what is your Magical, Holistic essential oil, concoction? (for soaking the cylinders)

1964 Alfa 2600 Spider (undergoing restoration..), 1979 Jaguar XJ 12L, 1981 Ferrari 308 GTSi, 1986 Porsche Carrera (track car), 2002 Maserati Coupe, 2013 BMW X5 (daily driver)
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