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post #751 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 04:42 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tubut View Post
I recall somebody writing that the bolts at the U-joint near the differential should be slightly loosened (or not fully tightened after installation), then the car should be run (with the rear wheels off the ground), before fully tightening the bolts. Another thing I heard (probably from Jay) is that there are thin felt spacers (grease retainers?) in the U-joint that can dry out or get brittle and get lost, which then increases play and may lead to vibrations. Have you checked and/or replaced those?
I’ve always done the “self aligning” step on Alfas. In this case, I also added substantial weight to the trunk to obtain a better alignment, front to rear, before running the drive shaft with slightly loosened giubos.

I inspected the rear ujoint. Very nice condition. Freshly greased.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #752 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 05:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tubut View Post
I recall somebody writing that the bolts at the U-joint near the differential should be slightly loosened (or not fully tightened after installation), then the car should be run (with the rear wheels off the ground), before fully tightening the bolts.
Very interresting : what is the U-joint ? That ? :

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post #753 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 06:21 AM
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Originally Posted by PS70 View Post
Very interresting : what is the U-joint ? That ? :
Yes (it's short for "universal joint").

-Ruedi
[SIZE="1"]'63 2600 Touring Spider (AR 191437, the car that started the 2000/2600 International Register, reassembly in progress)
ex-'65 2600 SZ (AR 856043, the car in my avatar, sold as resto project to Austria)
Maintainer of a private 2600 SZ register (not the one in the Netherlands).[/SIZE]
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post #754 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 06:33 AM
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OK, thank you.
So I'll proceed to the “self aligning”. Is there a speed limit ?
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post #755 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 07:12 AM
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OK, thank you.
So I'll proceed to the “self aligning”. Is there a speed limit ?
Not if you plan to live eternally... Happy Easter
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post #756 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 08:22 AM Thread Starter
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I believe someone’s memory is faulty.

The u-joint at the rear should be firmly tightened before any operation. Both this joint and the yokes it mounts to are machined to very close tolerances. There is no ambiguity in its fit. Tighten it all the way before operation.

What is being referred to are the two rubber giubos. Uninformed mechanics might tighten each bolt as they are installed, leading to odd stresses being held into the joints. These joints should be installed with all bolts just snug, but not gripping. Then, one can simply rotate the shaft by hand while incrementally tightening each nut. Running it under power is not required. The goal is to have the joints as relaxed into position as possible when the bolts are tightened. This is why I weighted the rear end, in order to better align the drive shaft from front to rear. In my experience, perfection is not required, just some care.
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Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
DPeterson3 is online now  
post #757 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 09:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DPeterson3 View Post
I believe someone’s memory is faulty.

The u-joint at the rear should be firmly tightened before any operation. Both this joint and the yokes it mounts to are machined to very close tolerances. There is no ambiguity in its fit. Tighten it all the way before operation.
Yup, mulling this over for a moment, I came to the sane conclusion: Loosening the bolts at the U-joint would have the same effect as felt washers going bad, i.e. increasing play and therefore unbalance and vibrations, rather than decreasing them.

-Ruedi
[SIZE="1"]'63 2600 Touring Spider (AR 191437, the car that started the 2000/2600 International Register, reassembly in progress)
ex-'65 2600 SZ (AR 856043, the car in my avatar, sold as resto project to Austria)
Maintainer of a private 2600 SZ register (not the one in the Netherlands).[/SIZE]
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post #758 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-17-2019, 10:01 PM
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Are there washers underneath the nuts for the giubos? i know one the 105 cars there are and when I would have ones come in the had a vibration would usually have one or more of the washers missing. Without the washer when the nut is tightened it will twist the giubo some. having the washer eliminated that.

1969 1750 Spider Veloce w/dual webers, 1969 1750 Berlina, 1971 1750 Spider Veloce w/ dual webers, 1985 Spider Veloce 23,000 orig. miles, {Two} 1986 Spider Veloces, 1987 Spider Veloce bought new, 1988 Quadrifoglio, 1991 164S, Plus several more. I think they are breeding.
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I just got 2 more. Now I have a Matta. I must be crazy.
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post #759 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 07:44 PM Thread Starter
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New angle on the drive shaft problem

After several iterations and efforts with shims, I backed up and took another look.

I'm fairly certain that the centerline of my crankshaft is not aligned with the bore of the center driveshaft support bearing. The output of the trans results in the first section of the driveshaft hanging around an inch lower than it should be at the center support bearing.

This would result in the front 8-hole giubo doing a complete wobble-cycle every rotation. Whether this is the source of my vibration or not, it would likely result in an early failure of the front giubo. The solution is either shorter motor mounts or a taller gearbox cross-support.

I used the support that came with the project, although none of the driveline was installed when it arrived. As I discovered with the front exhaust pipe, it is possible that Robert sent along the wrong cross support, although his massive supply of old Alfa stuff doesn't actually have much 102 or 106 mixed in.

I have two spare cross supports. One I cleaned up and powdercoated for my display, and I used the taller of the two thinking it was for a 2600, and I'd never have a need for it. The other is still quite nasty with dead-squirrel remains, but appears to be about the same as the one in the car. It could also be very slightly taller.

I recall a thread in this forum discussing the variations of cross-members among the 102 and 106 cars, so I'll go take a look for that. Meanwhile, if any of you stalwarts happen to be under your cars and could measure from the bottom seam of your split-case transmission to the bottom of the cross member, that would give me a quick reference. I intend to push out 00072 tomorrow or Saturday and compare that measurement, but the 59 uses a slightly different cross member, and it's possible other components were changed when they shifted to the 1960 configuration. So, if any of you have a 60 or 61, the measurement would be most appreciated.

Received the replacement rear carpets. The interior looks a lot brighter with the black all covered up.

Johnny, the upholsterer, should be back from vacation on Monday.

I have now spent easily 2 hours looking for the bottom plug for 00072's gas tank. I know it's here. Alfastop appears to have one that will work, but at around $150+, I've decided to keep looking. Unless one of you have an unsalvageable gas tank with a serviceable plug....

Got fed up to the point I decided to go for a quick trip up to the Beacon restaurant on the south shore of Lake Tahoe. It's my favorite season. Cool, sunny, calm. Not a lot of tourons. No drunk jet-ski or boat idiots.

I had their fried calimari, which is quite nice. Answered questions from a pre-driving teenager who seemed to think flying up and landing on Lake Tahoe might be a cool thing to do.

It is.
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Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #760 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 08:15 PM
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All those Alfa things going on and you do fun stuff too.... :-) Thanks for sharing your story, complete with teenager, I appreciated it.

Cheers,

Carson, 4 Alfa's, 9 Cars, 4 Motorcycles
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post #761 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 08:21 PM Thread Starter
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All those Alfa things going on and you do fun stuff too.... :-) Thanks for sharing your story, complete with teenager, I appreciated it.

Cheers,
In all my years landing on Tahoe and going into a nearby restaurant, I've had only ONE lovely lady ask me for a ride. Her boyfriend quickly vetoed her request, which in my opinion would be plenty enough reason to dump him.

I did give a ride to a near-octegenarian lady who was at the Hyatt celebrating her very high-number wedding anniversary with her equally aged husband. He was too timid. She was hot to fly.

Maybe I need a sign hung on the airplane while I'm dining nearby:

Free rides:

Requirement:
Two X chromosomes
Single AND unencumbered
Over 18
Fire in the belly for flying an airplane
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Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...

Last edited by DPeterson3; 04-18-2019 at 09:03 PM.
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post #762 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 08:55 PM
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What a gorgeous weather!

From your description, I gather you might prefer two X chromosomes over just one.

-Ruedi
[SIZE="1"]'63 2600 Touring Spider (AR 191437, the car that started the 2000/2600 International Register, reassembly in progress)
ex-'65 2600 SZ (AR 856043, the car in my avatar, sold as resto project to Austria)
Maintainer of a private 2600 SZ register (not the one in the Netherlands).[/SIZE]
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post #763 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 09:02 PM Thread Starter
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What a gorgeous weather!

From your description, I gather you might prefer two X chromosomes over just one.
Ooops. Forgot my highschool biology.

Of course.

Edited.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
DPeterson3 is online now  
post #764 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-18-2019, 09:45 PM
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Great Don !

My #01234 Touring is a 1960.
I can go under the car and mesure what you need. But it will be easier for me with a drawing showing exactly what you need.
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post #765 of 918 (permalink) Old 04-19-2019, 08:10 AM
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Hi, Don,
I have a pair of Tourings, a 2000 and a 2600. I need some parts:
2600 seats or just the recline mechanisms
2600 driver's door panel

102 engine fan
aluminum engine mount brackets
exhaust manifolds
thermostat cover/neck
oil pan
transmission(?)
passenger door innards and window glass

Thank you for any help
Dean
TRAIL AUTO
(800)445-2532
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