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post #61 of 1042 (permalink) Old 12-30-2017, 05:56 PM Thread Starter
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Mark,

If these lights were clearly much newer, I'd never give it a second thought. Welding up the dash and front bumper couldn't be that hard. As it is, they look very much in-period, although they are not pictured on your referenced page. I'm going to think about it, but leaning toward keeping them. Their performance as driving lights would certainly be better than the built in "fog lights".

Headed out to shop for an hour or so....

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #62 of 1042 (permalink) Old 12-30-2017, 09:44 PM Thread Starter
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I'd rather go blind

My regular followers will acknowledge the lack of straight lines in my life's narrative. So it is with Alfas and women, but I repeat myself.


Another 4 hours spent with the air ratchet and impact wrench. Much accomplished, a few mysteries solved, more uncovered, and women still one of the unsolved.

The engine bay is now largely empty, except for the funky bracket, and the front suspension and steering bits. I'm going to have to drill out the bracket bolts. A clear testament to Alfa's rust proofing as compared to American hardware bolts.

I kept finding a green paint on things. The front exhaust bracket, hubs of brake drums, a few underbody hidden spots, etc. It looked like it could have been applied during assembly. However, the right rear brake drum clearly shows blow-through green paint suggesting the drum hub was painted green with the three drum securing screws left out. It's a great job of masking, if that's where they had the drum when they painted it.

The right front wheel well is very nicely finished, with the "frame" section in silver and rest of the wheel well in well-applied undercoating. OK. What happened here?

Steering wheel won't budge. Stripped the other hole, but I'm out of 8mm X 1.25 helicoils. NAPA when I get back.

When I get back?

I'm headed to a regional duplicate bridge tournament tomorrow with a good friend. My possibly ex-wife will suspect hanky-panky, but there isn't. They are friends as well. Why would my wife think I'd step out with one of her friends? I'm not really a dumbass.

We're flying over to Monterey in the Mooney, with a quick stop to take a look at another 102 project. What am I? An idiot or just a glutton for self-inflicted wounds? Uh. Well maybe all of the above.

There is some evidence that Longstone Tyre has been scolded and instructed to defer Pirelli purchases to Lucas Tire, who might have slightly lowered their prices. Also, there is now a Borrani USA distributor. Who knew? Their nascent website hints that some research and quality translation might have been undertaken. I might place my order in the next week or two.

Oh. The bumpers have no holes drilled in them, except for those ugly overriders. I found two holes in the nose panel, located behind the bumpers, for what were probably "L" brackets to accept the driving lights. OK, since I don't have to get the bumpers welded, what is the call? I'm still leaning towards including the lights. They were definitely in-period, but commonly available used now. Gotta think about this one. I don't see any conflict between a 102 Roadster and nipples.

I'm leaning more toward red vinyl interior. The original paint simply has to be Grigio biacca, although I've not heard from Museo yet. Everything I pull off the car reveals that creamy "ivory" white I've already got on my other car.

Bunch of pics to follow. Always a good reference to check back on.
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Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...

Last edited by DPeterson3; 12-30-2017 at 10:04 PM.
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post #63 of 1042 (permalink) Old 12-30-2017, 09:49 PM Thread Starter
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Steering wheel hub, in full resist mode.

The dots around the rim of the hub are like those on another thread with a wooden rim. These dots are not present on my 59 car, or any other that I've seen. A flaw? A result of over polishing?

I'm still finding far more that indicates low-mileage, and put away in dry storage, than otherwise. I'm curious what we might find in the right front, hinted at by a repainted right front wheel well.

Three of the brakes show lots of meat left on the linings. The right rear appears a bit less, but there's dust filling the rivet holes that I need to blow clear. All of the drums except one will need the lightest of skim cuts. The fourth has a thin area at the inside that suggests a poor alignment setting on the shoes. Ham fisted, unthinking adjustments can do that.

I'm still not finding any significant rust. Bob bought this car carefully. I feel fortunate to follow him.

Off to bed. No further posts for about a week.

Good night Gracie.
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Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...

Last edited by DPeterson3; 12-30-2017 at 09:55 PM.
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post #64 of 1042 (permalink) Old 12-31-2017, 06:41 AM
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Don, I had a nice set of the under-dash levers for the 2000 but it and other parts are with my old 2600 which has been sold again and is now in Switzerland. I am following your posts with envy and thanks for entertaining us with details.
Larry Bono

1962 Alfa 2600 Spider, bought in 1970, sold in 2016.
1969 Porsche 912 Coupe owned since new.
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post #65 of 1042 (permalink) Old 12-31-2017, 07:12 AM Thread Starter
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Good morning Larry,

The levers function ok. I'm a bit baffled by their crustiness, as mostly, apart from dirt, the overall condition of the car is well preserved. It may be that some sort of cleaning will bring them back, but I'm not hopeful.

There are several inflection points in these odysseys. When the tub is completely stripped, I can shift to constructing the rotisserie. That's always fun, and takes about a week, including sourcing the material. That leads (hopefully) to shipping off the tub to the body shop. I'm still interviewing for that service. Then, a major resorting of the already loosely sorted parts into piles to be shipped to chromer, powder coater, etc. then the tedious stretch of my work on such things as brakes, steering box, suspension, etc.

It's going to be a busy year. I still hope to do this one in a year. Will I be punished for uttering that hubristic goal?

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #66 of 1042 (permalink) Old 12-31-2017, 12:37 PM
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Don, as anyone that knows anything about these cars knows, that is a pretty lofty goal, and you have provided to all of us that are monitoring your progress an easy date to keep track. However, I don't think you will receive any grief from anyone on this site, no matter how long it takes you to finish. I bet folks are actually hoping it takes you much longer due to the information and entertainment value you provide. Best of luck!
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Steve
'59 Touring Spider in (slow) progress
'87 Spider Veloce (former)
'68 BMW 1600
'02 BMW R1100S
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post #67 of 1042 (permalink) Old 12-31-2017, 01:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DPeterson3 View Post
Steering wheel hub, in full resist mode.
The picture shows the nut securing the steering wheel is still in place. I presume you did loosen or completely remove it before applying the puller?

The car looks like a great project, BTW.

-Ruedi
[SIZE="1"]'63 2600 Touring Spider (AR 191437, the car that started the 2000/2600 International Register, reassembly in progress)
ex-'65 2600 SZ (AR 856043, the car in my avatar, sold as resto project to Austria)
Maintainer of a private 2600 SZ register (not the one in the Netherlands).[/SIZE]
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post #68 of 1042 (permalink) Old 12-31-2017, 02:01 PM
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Regarding the running lights here is a picture of a Giulietta from the general time frame with two running lights up front. Different model but one can sorta get a general image from the picture.

Beyond that, I will mention, with greatest trepidation, a method for removing the stuck steering wheel. It involves upward pressure on the wheel while applying a solid whack to the upper end of the steering column. I've seen this done and have personally had success with the process. Basically, one person sits in the drivers seat(gas can, apple crate, whatever) and pulls strongly up on the wheel. An assistant then applies a jolt to the end of the steering column with a heavy hammer.Two requirements are obvious. 1, use an aluminum drift or block of hardwood to protect the threads and upper end of the steering column, and 2, wisely choose your assistant who must have a good aim and no grudges against you.
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post #69 of 1042 (permalink) Old 12-31-2017, 04:37 PM Thread Starter
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I've pulled any number of Alfa steering wheels. It takes patience+force.

The nut is loosened by about 1/16". Once the wheel pops loose, the rest is easy. Having the nut in place, but loosened, gives me a surface to press on that won't deform the hollow end of the shaft, and keeps the wheel from shooting across the floor when it pops loose. I use a thick steel chunk with a dimple in it for the puller to press on. I also use an air impact wrench set on lowish torque to drive the ram, which transmits a vibration to the shaft.

PS.... I looked at another 102 project today. I'll post a report another day.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #70 of 1042 (permalink) Old 12-31-2017, 11:21 PM
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Happy New Year. Love your writing(s). Funny what the shenanigans of a woman will drive a man to undertake. Again, Happy New Year. Ciao, chris

Maintaining my tenuous strain on reality.
89 164 2l Twin Spark, 2011 Tonka Dump

Recently added: an 89 75 (Milano) 1.6 litre w/44K on the klok.

Past loves:
79 Alfetta GTV w/Spica, my 1st Alfa

An 88 Graduate. Not really love but interesting nonetheless.

A 68 BMW 1602 - man do I regret letting that one go!

79 Scirroco, ex plowed into an illegally parked house with it...
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post #71 of 1042 (permalink) Old 01-01-2018, 12:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DPeterson3 View Post

The dots around the rim of the hub are like those on another thread with a wooden rim. These dots are not present on my 59 car, or any other that I've seen.
I am fairly sure that those "dots" around the rim of the hub were a part of the normal manufacturing process on my wheel. Maybe they are just not very visible on a polished wheel hub. Also age and humidity may have etched the different aluminum materials used in the hub and the rivets to make them more visible.

Once I had a Two-Liter steering wheel similarly 'welded' onto the shaft; I believe Richard (skinthin) has it now. When I attempted to remove it from the shaft the wheel puller yanked out both sets of threaded bolt holes. At the time, I did not have a gas torch but I do now. When I tried to remove the steering wheel from the Montreal, I heated the aluminum hub (not excessively) with the hub puller installed and pretty fully loaded -with the nut on but loose. It came off with a loud 'BANG'. I used a similar technique on the Montreal exhaust system to loosen two stuck pipes after the clamp was removed. At first the heat did nothing, then after cooling about 15 minutes, I heard one exhaust section rotate and fall.

If you were planning to keep this Touring Roadster, I would have no opinion about the driving lights but with resale considerations, I'd leave them off for the next owner to decide.

One more thing, the bolts that anchored the steering box on my Montreal had a very similar green paint applied; I suspect to indicate that they were properly torqued to spec.

Regarding women -just listen and empathize, don't try to fix...

Mark
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post #72 of 1042 (permalink) Old 01-02-2018, 05:50 AM
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The dots.. Ironblock is on the right trail. They are the remnants of screws sandwiching the hub parts together... The heads were never intended to be used again so they were ground flush with the head still doing the job. .

Steering wheel.. same principle of removing a ball joint... shock... ever watched a mechanic do it? whack up side the joint with a hammer and they pop off. Same here... put tension on the puller ..then shock ( create mini-vibration) to the shaft by whacking the hex top of the puller with a hammer ... don't want to mushroom shaft so a sctrap tool steel mini plate would help.. About the same effort as driving a framing nail. a tiny bit of heat and lube might be required. Another method that works is no puller .. one person pulls with two hands the the other whacks the end of the shaft.

Last edited by divotandtralee; 01-02-2018 at 05:52 AM.
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post #73 of 1042 (permalink) Old 01-02-2018, 07:28 AM Thread Starter
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So far, I've used several versions of whacking, plus careful application of heat, all while puller kept tension on things. I've got a few more tricks up my sleeve, one of which is an entire steering column and already-removed wheel. What I need out of this column is the turn signal switch.

Something I've used in other applications is to carefully heat the aluminum hub, then spray the steel shaft (inside) with cold freon or ether spray. There are other, potentially less exciting, chilling sprays as well.

It'll work out.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #74 of 1042 (permalink) Old 01-02-2018, 10:39 AM
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Hey Don

about the condition of the push/pull switches that look crusty... I found a very interesting tread about a Frenchmen that is doing a beautiful restoration of a 102, he had the same problem but with a bit of polishing, applying some varnish he obtained a fantastic result. You can find this tread by following this link:
h**p://alfa-romeo-classique.forumactif.com/t17049p825-spider-2000-touring

It is about 3/4 down on the page, with pictures. In case you need any translation done, let me know and i will be happy to oblige. You have been an inspiration troughout my own restoration of a 102, and after 5 years I am finally seeing light at the end of the tunnel!
P.S. I also have "the dots" on my steering wheel, my car is a 61 version

Keep up the Alfa spirit, and i will be following your tread.

Best regards from Belgium

Fred
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Last edited by esepodg; 01-02-2018 at 12:32 PM. Reason: forgot something
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post #75 of 1042 (permalink) Old 01-02-2018, 02:08 PM Thread Starter
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Fred,

That would be two, or three things we have in common...

An Alfa 102
A long love affair with a Belgian-designed airplane
A huge admiration for Belgian cooking. French fries with a heaping glob of wonderous mayonnaise. Good enough it could have been invented in Texas.

Post pictures of your car, please!

Oh, by the way. 1488 was sold to an American via a Belgian dealer.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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