May the circle remain unbroken - 10204 01488 - Page 17 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #241 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-05-2018, 06:09 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by xalfaracer View Post
So maybe I don't understand all this but it seems to me that the worker who was installing the plate dropped the first one and didn't want to bother taking anything apart so he(or she) just went and got another one???
I like this theory.

However, the car offers an unusual forensic trail. It is almost entirely original, and unmolested. But, they did a few things. Repainted the Giallo Paglierino to (ugh) Alfa Red. Did some unspecified work on the right front suspicion.

All of the tags are missing from the car, which may have been done prior to the repaint. I donít think they repainted the engine bay, however. But, since the Touring tags are gone, Iím guessing thatís when the ID plate would have been unscrewed and dropped into the void.

A nice piece to recover. Hopefully the others will peak out from somewhere as well.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #242 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-06-2018, 12:37 PM
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love to see pics of your own open rockers, be good to have perspective on what were dealing with

Peter Inshaw 59 Touring Spider 2.0, 63 Spider 1600, 67 GTV 1750, 67 Giulia Super Project, 73 Berlina TS, 91 Spider Veloce, 2018 Stelvio TI Sport
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post #243 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-06-2018, 02:47 PM Thread Starter
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I expect to be at the body shop in the next day or two, and will post pics.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #244 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-06-2018, 07:50 PM
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The I.D. plate has black spray paint overspray on it, except where the rivets were. That may indicate the plate was removed and dropped while the engine compartment was being repainted.

What is the engine number, Don?


Mark
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post #245 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-07-2018, 01:52 AM Thread Starter
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We don’t know the original engine number.

Bob, the PO, was the Alfa dealer in Austin for several years. A regular customer with a 2000 came in with a sick bottom end, and Bob sold him the lower half of the engine from 1488, plus the exchange of the sick engine. It was a perfectly reasonable deal at the time.

I’ll be installing the engine some of you have seen in my display case, as it’s apparently from the same year.

Perfection is the enemy of good enough.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
DPeterson3 is online now  
post #246 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-07-2018, 05:14 AM
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From the picture of the id plate. It almost looks like there is a engine number faintly stamped into it.
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1969 1750 Spider Veloce w/dual webers, 1969 1750 Berlina, 1971 1750 Spider Veloce w/ dual webers, 1985 Spider Veloce 23,000 orig. miles, {Two} 1986 Spider Veloces, 1987 Spider Veloce bought new, 1988 Quadrifoglio, 1991 164S, Plus several more. I think they are breeding.
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I just got 2 more. Now I have a Matta. I must be crazy.
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post #247 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-07-2018, 08:20 AM Thread Starter
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Post 1959, the Touring cars’ data plates contained just the motor “type”. In this case, it is 00204. If it were a 59 or earlier, the plate would be stamped something like 00204 01533, the latter grouping of numbers completing the serial number.

Replica Data plates can be arranged that look quite good. It’s just kinda nice to find the original, and it’s not all scratched and beaten up as they often are.

I spoke with Kelly yesterday. He’s got the rocker entirely replaced on one side, and should finish the other in the coming week. He took pics before closing things in, and I’ll get pics of the other side on Monday. He estimates he’ll be ready to apply color by the end of April. Picture me wagging my tail. Ok. Maybe not that...

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #248 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-07-2018, 08:44 AM
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Hi Don, do you have any pictures of your display case engine? It would be fun to see.
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post #249 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-07-2018, 09:10 AM Thread Starter
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Display engine

Quote:
Originally Posted by deepblue View Post
Hi Don, do you have any pictures of your display case engine? It would be fun to see.
Start at post #662, I think on page 45, of http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/1900...begins-45.html

I used 3Ē casters (I think), but this mother is heavy. Shoulda used 5Ē, at least. Iím torn between taking it out of the family room as is, or trying to bring my engine hoist down to the house, pulling the assembled unit out of the box, splitting the engine from the trans, and wheeling just the engine back up to the shop. Iíll probably battle the whole thing back up to the shop, as Iíll be putting my second spare engine back into the box, and could take the opportunity to upgrade the casters.

Based upon my research, the display engine is from the same year as 1488, so close as I can get. Bob seems to think thereís no hope of chasing down the original crankcase.
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Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
DPeterson3 is online now  
post #250 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-07-2018, 09:39 AM
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Thanks Don for the pictures, that is a beautiful motor and transmission! Good luck getting it up to the garage, I see what you are saying about the small castors. Really enjoying your build. I grew up with Alfa's. I still have my very first car, a 59 spider normal. My friends dad at the time drove a 102 spider as his daily driver. and his son still has it in his garage. Hopefully he can get on it and get it back on the road.

DJ
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post #251 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-07-2018, 10:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DPeterson3 View Post
Start at post #662, I think on page 45, of http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/1900...begins-45.html
Iíll probably battle the whole thing back up to the shop, as Iíll be putting my second spare engine back into the box, and could take the opportunity to upgrade the casters.

Based upon my research, the display engine is from the same year as 1488, so close as I can get.
The I.D. plate was definitely a nice find. It was very good that your body man recognized it as something of importance.

Putting your 'display' engine into 1488 may require more work but it is the logical thing to do.

Dragging the display motor out of your house with your engine lift does not sound like a good plan. Thresholds and steps would be a big impediment. Perhaps 5 or 6 of your grandson's buddies could make moving the display case easy -for pizza. Many hands make light work.

Why not install your display motor, complete with the display transmission? You could always rebuild 1488's tranny for the display case.

Mark
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post #252 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-07-2018, 10:16 AM Thread Starter
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The trans out of 1488, presumed to be original and relatively low time, is over with Larry jr at APE getting done now. The only holdup was having all of my hardware replated (black, of course), but that’s been delivered and I think Larry will be buttoning up the trans shortly.

If there was a timing roadblock, I would have used the display trans, which Larry already did. However, the current state of affairs includes several dozen parallel initiatives, hopefully all coalescing in my shop in about a month or two for assembly into and onto the body.

What could possibly go wrong?

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
DPeterson3 is online now  
post #253 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-07-2018, 10:25 AM
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If you don't have them on there. Get phenolic wheels for your cart. I have 9 or 10 wooden carts I've made with 350 pound rated 3 inch phenolic wheels on them and have no problem moving 1000 plus pound motors around.

All other caster wheels tend to flatten from sitting.

McMaster Carr has a get selection. I use their Cart-King Casters with Phenolic Wheels.

1969 1750 Spider Veloce w/dual webers, 1969 1750 Berlina, 1971 1750 Spider Veloce w/ dual webers, 1985 Spider Veloce 23,000 orig. miles, {Two} 1986 Spider Veloces, 1987 Spider Veloce bought new, 1988 Quadrifoglio, 1991 164S, Plus several more. I think they are breeding.
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I just got 2 more. Now I have a Matta. I must be crazy.
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post #254 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-07-2018, 10:25 AM Thread Starter
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I expect larger casters are going to require new mounting plates to be fabbed. Best to have the box in the shop for that.

The hard part with moving the box is, as you noted, the changes in continuity through doors. The box is too wide for the only grade-level door, so I’ve got to take it up a ramp through a dismounted sliding glass patio door which is about a foot higher than the floor. Going down the Jerry-rigged ramp was a real grunt. Going up..... bleh.

The top of the box is 1/2” plate glass. That is also heavy, but will be taken off before the move.

I assumed moving this box was going to be left to my heirs.
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Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
DPeterson3 is online now  
post #255 of 1042 (permalink) Old 04-07-2018, 10:28 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim G View Post
If you don't have them on there. Get phenolic wheels for your cart. I have 9 or 10 wooden carts I've made with 350 pound rated 3 inch phenolic wheels on them and have no problem moving 1000 plus pound motors around.

All other caster wheels tend to flatten from sitting.

McMaster Carr has a get selection. I use their Cart-King Casters with Phenolic Wheels.
I found a good source for casters, but will have to look up the name. Everything works ok on smooth concrete. This box had to come down, and will go back up, a typically bumpy asphalt driveway. Bigger is better for getting over peagravel and similar.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
DPeterson3 is online now  
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