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post #196 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-12-2018, 01:15 PM
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Originally Posted by DPeterson3 View Post
I've ordered a pair of 6005ZZ bearings to renew the smoothness. A total of about $14.50 ordered on Saturday morning with a promise to be delivered here tomorrow (Monday). Amazon is doing some amazing things.
Take care Don.
For me this bearing has a thickness of 12 mm.

That is the right thickness of the external ring.
But the thickness of the internal ring should be 14mm.

If you use this bearing, you will translate the steering wheel from 2 mm and you will increase the gap between the wheel and its support.

Personally, I have purchased 4 washers of 1 mm thickness to unlarge the internal ring :

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(I think on the whole globe, there are only 2 people who think to change these bearings)
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post #197 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-12-2018, 02:35 PM
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Regarding Jay's request:

I was able to order this corrugated heater duct from Christian Ondak at OKP about 20 years ago...it might be worth checking with him.

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And if you do order from AFRA please pick up FOR ME TOO as well as for yourself and the many others who need one of those cardboard seeming big" air circulation pipes [the one between heater and the "distributer", i.e. heat splitter you painted all fuzzy] listed as 102.04.57.102.00. For some reason these always seem to be missing or torn up on two liter spiders. The one on mine is ratty. The are weird size. The American 4" closedryer duct is too small, but the 6" is too big. It seems to be a 5" heat ducting that fits between. When I in Germany last May I thought I had found the solution in German 100mm and then 125mm common duct sizes. I knew the 100 too small, but the 125mm I brought home is too big by about 10mm. Car uses about 110mm (maybe 115) inside diameter. Don't know where Alfa got that but perhaps Italy has its own sizes.
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post #198 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-12-2018, 02:43 PM
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Back for just a moment to the fresh air duct hose. I highly recommend NOT ordering this part from AFRA. I ordered one and this (see below) is what I got. C'mon, it's not even black. OK, it was not all smashed up when I got it. That happened some time ago while residing at the bottom of my aluminum recycle bin. I then bought the McMaster Carr hose that Don recommended. Much better!
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post #199 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-14-2018, 07:31 PM Thread Starter
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I've exchanged emails with Christian at least three times in the last decade about this hose, the most recent being two weeks ago. He acts like he never heard of it.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #200 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-14-2018, 07:54 PM Thread Starter
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Day 61

I've retrieved the car from the blaster. Maybe not as wonderful as when he did my previous project, but I'm ok with it. Not cheap, but boy does it save time, and time is money, right?

I got it down to the body guy on Tuesday. I hope I don't eat my words, but I feel really good about this fellow. He's done work for me on both the Amphib and the Full Monty, and I was happy with both experiences. Fingers crossed. I'm sure he's not used to receiving a project already stripped, and mounted on an operational rotisserie. I think it actually motivated him to get busy, which was exactly my plan.

This phase is sort of schizophrenic. I have to manage the needs and emotional states of the body guy (Kelly), while moving 10,000 tiny details forward in close formation. The latter involves dismantling things, bagging the related bits that need to be kept together, restoring the primary piece, or sending them off to another contractor who may have some sort of psychotic departure midway through the process. I'm not far from shipping a large box of irreplaceable chrome up to Seattle.

The blasting revealed perhaps worse than my hopes, but better than my expectations.

The rockers are done. Thin, and perforated. One tiny breach in one floorboard, no more than 1/8" X 1/4". The bottoms of the sills look perfect, so I'm hoping the BIG OPENING doesn't reveal internal disaster. The channel along the bottom of the left door needs replacing, but the right appears OK. Might do it as well, on general principles, however.

The rear of the spare tire tub has issues. It could be easily cut out and patched, but we're debating installing an entire tub to avoid having a seam, or doing a high-quality patch that isn't visible. Decision not yet made.

Fore and aft valences are OK. The front "curb-finder" between the main cross member and the radiator support has, indeed, found several curbs over the years. It'll be reconstructed.

Otherwise, everything is remarkably good. I hope I don't regret saying that after we've torn the rockers off.

For humor...

I misconnected with Kelly in time to let him see any of the exposed areas of original paint, so we decided to just make that part up. Lo and behold, after getting it all to his shop, I spotted that I'd left one of the chrome guides installed on the rear jamb of a door, and upon removal, here was the best patch of Gallio Paglierino left on the car. He's busy matching that before doing anything else.

I didn't slow down to take pictures of the entire car after the blasting, but here's the stuff that shows the worst of it.
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Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #201 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-14-2018, 08:05 PM Thread Starter
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Day 61 etc

I got some stuff back from the coater today, so did some assembly. Exhaust pipe hanger bushings installed, and drive shaft pieced together.

I think I'm missing some of the center-bearing stuff. I've got all of the drive shaft, and the bracket that supports the center bearing, the bearing support rubber surround, but I haven't come across the aluminum support bearing housing bits, or whatever else there might be. Someone probably destroyed all that taking it apart 30 years ago.

I ran into something odd about the anti-sway bar links.

I installed four new bushings. Three from Classic Alfa appeared fine, but one had the steel bushing in the middle noticeably off center. I discovered I already had four new ones in stock due to a previous ordering mistake, so got all four installed.

One of the installed bushings has a center-opening of 14.26mm. The other three have exactly 14mm. Thus, the one will slide on easily, and rotate without resistance, whereas the other three will require being pressed on, and won't rotate between the metal-to-metal bits after installation. I checked the remaining four new bushings (including the off-center one), and discovered that three of them have the 14mm bore, and one has the 14.26mm bore.

The design of these links is interesting in that none of the bushings is retained by a circlip. Alfa decided that the 90 degree orientation of the bushing pairs, plus the length of the shaft, plus the friction, would keep each link from coming loose at any of its two connection points.

But, are the connection points intended to be press-fit, or rotational?

I doubt that a rubberized bushing is intended to have metal-to-metal rotation. This would call for lubrication of some sort, which isn't part of this design. Thus, they must be intended to be pressed into place with the correct orientation, such that the motion is absorbed by the rubber component of the bushing.

Anyone have any comments?
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Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...

Last edited by DPeterson3; 02-14-2018 at 09:25 PM.
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post #202 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-14-2018, 10:11 PM
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Don, I believe that your suspicion that the way bar links are press-fit is correct.

One photo above shows what appears to be new silent blocks installed in the transmission-mounted exhaust hanger. I purchased a pair of those and supplied them, along with the hanger to the shop that rebuilt my transmission. They were a bit confused why I supplied them with the correct 102 transmission mounts AND transmission mounts to some other AR model (105 maybe?). Anyway, it turns out that the exhaust silent blocks that were sold to me were actually transmission mounts. These are noticeably of higher durometer (stiffer) than the originals, and the inner holes are of incorrect diameter (larger). Anyway, the shop coincidentally needed a set of these alternate transmission mounts right at that very moment, so they used the ones I had in exchange for them ordering the correct ones for me. They ordered a pair of exhaust silent blocks from (I believe) Classic Alfa, and received a pair of......the same transmission mounts that I originally provided the shop. Resolution is still pending.

I am sharing this story because the I believe that you might have the same situation with your exhaust mounts as the inner hole diameters look large. Compare with the other half of the bracket to verify.

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'59 Touring Spider in (slow) progress
'87 Spider Veloce (former)
'68 BMW 1600
'02 BMW R1100S
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post #203 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-15-2018, 06:33 AM Thread Starter
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Steve,

Thanks. I’ll double check the exhaust mounts today.

The Alfa transmission and exhaust mounts are not remotely interchangeable. It’s possible the exhaust mounts have the wrong hole in the middle, but they’re not Alfa trans mounts.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
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post #204 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-15-2018, 10:17 AM Thread Starter
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I sent a note to Tom Bouet at CA this morning. Two notes, actually.

The hole in my exhaust silent blocks is 16mm. The intended bolts are 10mm. The catalog lists a "distance piece" which could be either an original steel insert into a plain rubber bushing (like used on the exhaust hangars), or an insertible bushing intended to reduce the 16mm down to 10mm. I normally keep EVERYTHING during a resto, but I seem to have tossed out the exhaust silent blocks that I removed, thinking "what could possibly go wrong with the replacements". I do not recall any insertible bushing, however.

We'll see what Tom says.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
DPeterson3 is online now  
post #205 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-16-2018, 12:33 PM
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I followed up with my mechanic today regarding the exhaust bushings. His claim is that these are actually from the earlier 1900 transmission. He is still investigating a solution to obtain a bushing with the correct dimensions and durometer.

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'59 Touring Spider in (slow) progress
'87 Spider Veloce (former)
'68 BMW 1600
'02 BMW R1100S
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post #206 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-16-2018, 03:16 PM
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Don - here's a picture of my exhaust mount bushings, which I believe to be original. It does have a tight fitting spacer in between the center cylinder of the bush and the bolt. The inside diameter of the bush is 16mm and the inside diameter of the spacer is 10.7mm. HTH
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83 GTV6 (RHD), 60 Touring 2000 Spider and 59 Giulietta Spider race car
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post #207 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-16-2018, 09:39 PM Thread Starter
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Richard,

That seems to indicate that our silent blocks are correct, and we’re missing the inner bushings. I seem to recall that being the case.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
DPeterson3 is online now  
post #208 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-17-2018, 05:41 AM
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Seems a simple solution to the silent block bushings might be a nylon or poly insert. The hanger isn't under any load.. more a vibration and sound damper that would not be compromised. Would save a lot of hand wringing IMO.
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post #209 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-17-2018, 06:52 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by divotandtralee View Post
Seems a simple solution to the silent block bushings might be a nylon or poly insert. The hanger isn't under any load.. more a vibration and sound damper that would not be compromised. Would save a lot of hand wringing IMO.
Yup. Iíll look around and see what bushings I may have in the ďwhatíre these?Ē box. Iíll probably stick to steel, though. Nylon and other stuff tends to deform and suffer over time.

Don P
Carson City, NV

Past Alfas...
59 102 Touring (first Alfa $500 running)
65 Sprint GT (2nd Alfa, $500 daily driver)
102 Sprint (never did anything with it, but wish I had)
74 Berlina (first new car - now certainly rusted into oblivion)
61 Giulietta Spider G-Prod Race Car (where is it now?)
84 Spider Veloce (rarely drove it, so sold it)
86 Quadrifoglio (Dull car - no more 115s for me)
1971 Montreal "The Full Monty". Fair winds and following seas

Current Alfas
59 102 Touring Roadster - restoration complete, enough Alfa for any rational man. Or irrational, for that matter
Oops. Add to the "present" list, 10204 01488, 2000 Touring Roadster project

And past...
Two 1946 Stampe SV4C (c/n 294 "Rocinante" - wife's favorite airplane. RIP), and c/n 235 "La Bon Temps Femme" (gone to a new home, but never forgotten)
Zlin 50LA (+9 -6 gees, titanium spar, 1200 lbs, 260HP rumored to now be in Brazil)
1946 Luscombe 8A
Starduster Too (recently spotted at the Nevada City, CA airport - over 20 years and an entire continent separating it from our stewardship in Binghamton, NY)
1955 Cessna 170B (wife taught me to fly tailwheel in this)

And present...
64 Mooney M20E ("Rambo". My faithful steed for over 40 years) Over 55 years old, and just returned from a trip to Argentina in him
Newest in the fleet
1967 Piper Super Cub on Wipline amphibious floats (a true "all terrain vehicle")
2010 Triumph Thunderbird


You can snap roll an Alfa only one time...
DPeterson3 is online now  
post #210 of 1036 (permalink) Old 02-17-2018, 07:07 AM
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In case you change your mind....you probably will have an account here. https://www.mcmaster.com/#spacers/=1blymkz "unthreaded spacers"
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