1995 164Q steering judder - Page 2 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #16 of 21 (permalink) Old 05-16-2019, 06:26 AM
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Nice one! Problems identified, its back on the road. $140 is not a bad price for that kind of result and knowledge.

164LS 1994
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post #17 of 21 (permalink) Old 05-16-2019, 06:29 AM
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Find yourself a good alloy wheel repair shop. I'm very surprised the Porsche guys you used didn't refer you to the one they use!

For around $100 you can get your bent wheel straightened. Alloy wheel repair wasn't possible many years ago. Nowadays it is a very simple and economical process.

In fact, you might be amazed at some of the before and after pictures showing just how badly a wheel can be damaged and still repaired.

1991 Alfa Romeo 164L 5 spd
White on grey leather 230K km, owned from new
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post #18 of 21 (permalink) Old 05-16-2019, 07:36 AM
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Find yourself a good alloy wheel repair shop. I'm very surprised the Porsche guys you used didn't refer you to the one they use!

For around $100 you can get your bent wheel straightened. Alloy wheel repair wasn't possible many years ago. Nowadays it is a very simple and economical process.

In fact, you might be amazed at some of the before and after pictures showing just how badly a wheel can be damaged and still repaired.
+1 I have had 2 of the 20inch wheels on my Camaro repaired like this and they came out perfect.

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
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post #19 of 21 (permalink) Old 05-16-2019, 08:18 AM Thread Starter
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Find yourself a good alloy wheel repair shop...you might be amazed at some of the before and after pictures showing just how badly a wheel can be damaged and still repaired.
Hmm okay, I will look for one. Thanks, sounds like you trust this process.

-Richard
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post #20 of 21 (permalink) Old 05-16-2019, 09:36 AM
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So...I took the car to Status Auto in Menlo Park, CA - they do good business adding bigger wheels and exhausts to Porsches and other german cars - but also have the latest Hunter alignment and wheel balancing equipment and were happy to take a look at my "rad Italian" car.

They took all the weights off first (applied by the tire-fitters a few months back when the tires were first fitted) - the balancing machine and process are great to watch - an excellent step-by-step widescreen user-interface shows exactly what's going on.

2 of the wheels (btw they're 16" Speedline Mistrals) just needed regular balance weights, i.e. the road-force measurement found no anomaly - for balancing the machine rotates and draws a laser line at the midpoint of where the weight should be attached and how many weights - it does that twice, one for inner and one for outer rims. All these weights were being applied in radically different spots to where the tire-fitters had put them - I was hopeful.

But on two it found a road-force problem - the good pair had road-force readings around 6 or 7. These two were around 23-26 and lit up red, with warning messages. Then it tells him to measure rim runout - so an arm folds out and is held against the inside of the outer rim edge while it rotates - after which it draws two more lines (laser) - one on the tire which he marks in grease-pen, then rotates for a 2nd mark on the wheel. Then off to the tire-fitting machine - break both beads, grab the tire, machine rotates the wheel until the lines meet up - then back to the balancer.

One of them then dropped to 5 on the road-force measurement so was cured - then balanced as above with weights.

But one of them stayed around 23. That rim is bent - and it was visibly bent when spinning up for the measurement - not good. But he re-balanced it anyway. We agreed that "at least now I know" and put the wheels back on, the bad one was from the rear-right and we left it there. $140 total and I was there at least 90 minutes. I'll be going back to this place.

Then the 40 mile drive home and...the problem is gone, pretty much. If I get up to about 65 and hold the wheel with fingertips, maybe, just maybe I can feel something, but it's hugely better and really pretty good for at least one slightly bent wheel. The roads are so bad in the Bay Area that I won't notice - 80 feels like 70 used to. I bet it uses less gas too!

I could buy a set of wheels for it, but 1995, 222,000 miles, 80 mile daily drive roundtrip and now I can't feel it? probably not. There are places that can "straighten" bent wheels - but I'm not sure I trust in the process, or what it changes in the metal's properties.

Thanks for all the suggestions above - he felt for tie-rod play before he removed the wheels and he couldn't feel what I mention above - all wheel bearings are good and all bushings in good shape. Time to drive.

-Richard
I would not worry about the straightening of the wheels. A small bend wont be much work. I have done it on my zender Siena wheels. Came out fine. No issues for 15 years after.

I use Nuwheel in Tucson AZ or there should be plenty of places up by you.

Might want to throw that wheel on the back of there is any noticeable vibration.

https://www.moderntiredealer.com/art...ity-is-the-key

“The majority of what is getting repaired today are slight bends. A lot of them can be softly put back into place by applying a little bit of heat and little bit of pressure to the bent area.”

If it's just the outer lip and not much of a bend, it can easily be repaired and not be a worry.


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Last edited by Alfissimo Int.; 05-16-2019 at 09:40 AM.
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post #21 of 21 (permalink) Old 05-16-2019, 04:00 PM
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The advent of precise lathe type machinery allowed alloy wheel repair using a combination of heat and pressure. Cold repairs used to weaken the casting. A little heat and controlled pressure allows the bend to be straightened by flowing the warmed alloy rather than just bending it back. Cold repair of aluminum alloys could induce fatigue stress leading to cracks. Modern equipment straightens the aluminum with heat as well as pressure which relieves the casting of internal stress as the original profile is recreated. For big bends and missing chunks new alloy is actually welded in and the wheel is then turned down on a lathe to reproduce the correct profile.

The results are reliable enough up be guaranteed safe and are really quite incredible to see.
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1991 Alfa Romeo 164L 5 spd
White on grey leather 230K km, owned from new
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