Transmission Fluid for '92 164s 3.0 12v - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
 2Likes
  • 1 Post By Remelo
  • 1 Post By IRONBLOCK
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-17-2018, 09:41 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 7
Transmission Fluid for '92 164s 3.0 12v

First, let's make thins clear. I own a '92 164s 3.0 12v with a manual transmission.
I have been very confused by the type of fluid that is supposed to go in the MANUAL transmission. I just did my first trans fluid change and I did it with Castrol Dexron VI ATF, which is which is compatible with II which is what the factory service manual says to use for the manual trans. It seemed odd, but that's what the manual specified so I bought it. When I drained the fluid that came with the car when I bought it, it was a thicker gear oil.
What is the right choice to make and is it safe to use what I used.
I know I seem naive, but I just want to make sure I didn't mess it up big time.

Thanks for the comments and help -Remelo

1992 164s Portland Oregon, Ryan Wesel
Remelo is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-18-2018, 01:42 PM
Senior Member
Platinum Subscriber
 
Alfisto Steve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: VB, VA
Posts: 26,494
Garage
I use ATF A/T fluid in my 164 5-speed manual transaxles. ATF VI full- synthetic is backward compatible according to my research:

https://www.valvoline.com/our-produc.../dexron-vi-atf

OBTW my 164B 5-speed I bought new in 91 came with gear oil which I changed at 130k to ATF II when input shaft ball bearing failed. I replaced it with 164S overload version roller bearing. Was still going strong with ATF at 210k when I sold it.

Ciao, Alfisto Steve
Virginia Beach, VA
AROC 164 Tech Advisor

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

My Maintenance Sticky:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Alfa Semi-Daily driver: USA model - BB2 1991 164S Black Beauty II ALFISTO [U]

[U] BB1 1991 164L w/S engine and A/T now excess to inventory [U]

Daily driver and parts hauler but not car hauler 2004 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4.7L H.O. V-8

"A day without an Alfa whine is like a day without sunshine"

Last edited by Alfisto Steve; 10-18-2018 at 01:49 PM.
Alfisto Steve is offline  
post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-18-2018, 04:17 PM
Senior Member
Gold Subscriber
 
pinino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: woodstock ny
Posts: 2,163
My 1992 164S came to me with 47k with AFT (brand unknown). At 52k I changed to Royal Purple synthetic (=Dextron II), but didn't like it, feeling a little "edginess" going into 2nd. At 65k I carefully flushed out the AFT, used a Valvoline 75-90 GL5 as a transition oil for a week, then changed to Motul 300 75-90 ester. This, so far, I like the best for my climate (Northeast).

white '92 164 S (71K)
pinino is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-18-2018, 08:41 PM
Senior Member
Platinum Subscriber
 
Alfissimo Int.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: San Diego
Posts: 9,544
Either ATF or Gear Oil. I prefer gear oil. If ATF in there and you want to use Gear oil. Drain it as best as possible and throw in gear oil. ATF used in US only, Gear oil for the rest of the world. Either or.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Jason Minos


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


New: +1 619-209-0715
e-mail:admin at alfissimo.com
San Diego, CA
1989 Spider Quad. Gone
1991 White Alfa Romeo 164S Recaro, Siena, Zender.-GONE
2010 Touareg TDI
2017 Giulia Ti Sport Q4, Trofeo, Leather package(red), 19X8, 19X9.
Alfissimo Int. is offline  
post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-21-2018, 03:16 PM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 7
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfissimo Int. View Post
Either ATF or Gear Oil. I prefer gear oil. If ATF in there and you want to use Gear oil. Drain it as best as possible and throw in gear oil. ATF used in US only, Gear oil for the rest of the world. Either or.
Thanks for the clarification, I have a US spec car. I will most likely run ATF for a couple thousand miles and then change it out for gear oil.
Alfissimo Int. likes this.

1992 164s Portland Oregon, Ryan Wesel
Remelo is offline  
post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-22-2018, 08:10 AM
Registered User
 
IRONBLOCK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Georgia
Posts: 3,528
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by Remelo View Post
Thanks for the clarification, I have a US spec car. I will most likely run ATF for a couple thousand miles and then change it out for gear oil.
Remelo, I've had a 1992, 164-S since it was new. The local dealer (PSA) changed the trans fluid to 90 weight gear lube at the 36K service and it was very difficult to shift when cold. Within a week I changed it back to Redline MTL 75W80 that I previously installed at ~20K miles. It now has over 130K miles and the transmission shifted beautifully until the TOB came apart.

I can vouch for Redline; could not stand the dealer installed gear lube as it would have surely ruined the synchros in short order with our cooler weather.

Mark
Alfissimo Int. likes this.
IRONBLOCK is offline  
post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 10-22-2018, 11:03 AM
Senior Member
Platinum Subscriber
 
Alfissimo Int.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: San Diego
Posts: 9,544
I use Motul Gear 300 75W-90 (full synthetic)and it shifts well in all weather. We get cold here too. <40˚F in day in winter. Depends on what gear lube you use. I recommend Motul. Box is spec'd for mineral oil though. So you can choose between the 300 or the motul mineral oil 75W-90. Both are stellar. Redline is another option as well.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Jason Minos


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


New: +1 619-209-0715
e-mail:admin at alfissimo.com
San Diego, CA
1989 Spider Quad. Gone
1991 White Alfa Romeo 164S Recaro, Siena, Zender.-GONE
2010 Touareg TDI
2017 Giulia Ti Sport Q4, Trofeo, Leather package(red), 19X8, 19X9.
Alfissimo Int. is offline  
post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 06-17-2019, 09:01 AM
Registered User
 
Rogue Leader's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 280
I have a couple bottles of Redline 75w90 that I plan on using to do mine. About how many quarts are needed to refill the transmission? What port are you using to fill it?

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
Rogue Leader is offline  
post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 06-17-2019, 10:20 AM
Senior Member
Platinum Subscriber
 
Alfisto Steve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: VB, VA
Posts: 26,494
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogue Leader View Post
I have a couple bottles of Redline 75w90 that I plan on using to do mine. About how many quarts are needed to refill the transmission? What port are you using to fill it?
It takes 2 quarts. On the 12v models I remove hex plug or allen head plug from tranny case located near clutch release pivot arm upper bushing and use a A/T long thin funnel. You can remove reverse light switch or even the 1-2 gear switch (S model) or even the hidden dip stick on differential top but much harder to get to and get a funnel in these three choices.

Ciao, Alfisto Steve
Virginia Beach, VA
AROC 164 Tech Advisor

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

My Maintenance Sticky:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Alfa Semi-Daily driver: USA model - BB2 1991 164S Black Beauty II ALFISTO [U]

[U] BB1 1991 164L w/S engine and A/T now excess to inventory [U]

Daily driver and parts hauler but not car hauler 2004 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4.7L H.O. V-8

"A day without an Alfa whine is like a day without sunshine"
Alfisto Steve is offline  
post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 06-17-2019, 10:33 AM
Del
Senior Member
Gold Subscriber
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: seattle
Posts: 15,106
Two qts, and at either the Allen wrench plug under the slave cylinder, if you can get it out (I cannot in my 91S), or the reverse gear back up light sensor located further to the left (car left) and back at the top of the gear case (this location is what I use). I use a long skinny hose and a funnel.

Is the 75W-90 the NS or regular? Richard Jemison strongly recommend using the NS version. I do use it in my 94LS to quiet the gear noise down a little (it's a 1995 Q transmission, and the the gears, esp 3rd, were a little noisy on partial throttle), and it seems to work just fine (so far).

My 91S has Royal Purple ATF in it, which works ok, but don't know how it will work when the temps drop low next winter. When I had the clutch replaced in that car a couple of years ago, Carlo put in Kendall ATF (as he usually does I guess), but the transmission was pretty darn balky and stiff when the temperature was in the 30s and 40s until the fluid warmed a little. Didn't like that, and don't remember it being that way before.

I had been running the Redline 75W-90NS for a short while before the clutch change, and when he asked me what was in the transmission, and I told him, he was not all that happy with the gear oil, telling me that Alfa had said not to use gear oil because it was too stiff when cold, not getting to all the bearings quickly enough. I mentioned that the rest of the world seemed to use gear oil, and he didn't say anything. We changed the subject. So... I do not know.

Del

Seattle

1989 Milano, Shankle Sport
1991 164S, stock
1994 164LS (~Q)
1972 Morgan 27

previously owned since 1964:

62 Morris MiniMinor 850, 67 Austin 1275 Cooper S (Downton 3/4 race), 64 Giulia Sprint GT (1st red one made), 72 Fiat 128 Sedan, 75 Alfetta Sedan, 78 Alfetta Sedan, 78 GTV, 81 GTV6, 86 GTV6
Del is offline  
post #11 of 14 (permalink) Old 06-17-2019, 01:20 PM
Registered User
 
Rogue Leader's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 280
not sure if its NS. I know I have some bottles of 75w90 and 75w140 I used to use in my old race car (was the only stuff that would keep the transmission from blowing up). They are a few years old but i have no other use for them (new race car has a Kaaz clutched diff which needs specific fluid). NS is only different in that it lacks friction modifiers to allow for some slipperiness, which is helpful for very old transmissions, far older than our cars. Apparently it would work with my Kaaz diff as well as it says its good for racing type clutched diffs.

I noticed the reverse gear sensor and figured that may be a good spot. I do have a funnel with a flexible tip which may help. Also everything is removed right now so it should all be easy to get to.

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
Rogue Leader is offline  
post #12 of 14 (permalink) Old 06-17-2019, 04:03 PM
Senior Member
Platinum Subscriber
 
Alfissimo Int.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: San Diego
Posts: 9,544
I think NS but of course I don't use redline products. I used Motul Gear 300 (75W-90) in my box.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Jason Minos


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


New: +1 619-209-0715
e-mail:admin at alfissimo.com
San Diego, CA
1989 Spider Quad. Gone
1991 White Alfa Romeo 164S Recaro, Siena, Zender.-GONE
2010 Touareg TDI
2017 Giulia Ti Sport Q4, Trofeo, Leather package(red), 19X8, 19X9.
Alfissimo Int. is offline  
post #13 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-01-2019, 11:14 AM
Registered User
 
Rogue Leader's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 280
Anyone know what size the Allen for the drain plug is. Of course anything I have near that size has walked away from my tool box, so I want to just buy the size I need to get the job done instead of tearing my shed apart (assuming they are even there... ugh)

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
Rogue Leader is offline  
post #14 of 14 (permalink) Old 07-01-2019, 04:16 PM
Senior Member
Platinum Subscriber
 
Alfissimo Int.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: San Diego
Posts: 9,544
Quote:
Originally Posted by Remelo View Post
First, let's make thins clear. I own a '92 164s 3.0 12v with a manual transmission.
I have been very confused by the type of fluid that is supposed to go in the MANUAL transmission. I just did my first trans fluid change and I did it with Castrol Dexron VI ATF, which is which is compatible with II which is what the factory service manual says to use for the manual trans. It seemed odd, but that's what the manual specified so I bought it. When I drained the fluid that came with the car when I bought it, it was a thicker gear oil.
What is the right choice to make and is it safe to use what I used.
I know I seem naive, but I just want to make sure I didn't mess it up big time.

Thanks for the comments and help -Remelo
Both ATF and Gear oil are correct. I prefer gear. Motul Gear 300 75W-90.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Jason Minos


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


New: +1 619-209-0715
e-mail:admin at alfissimo.com
San Diego, CA
1989 Spider Quad. Gone
1991 White Alfa Romeo 164S Recaro, Siena, Zender.-GONE
2010 Touareg TDI
2017 Giulia Ti Sport Q4, Trofeo, Leather package(red), 19X8, 19X9.
Alfissimo Int. is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome