New Guy with a 164S - Page 6 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #76 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-17-2018, 06:40 AM Thread Starter
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As far as I know, the yellow adjustable Konis, which are the ones you would want to use, haven't been made for a few years by Koni, and people have pretty much sucked them all up everywhere, except for maybe one here or there. I bought the set for the LS quite a few years ago.

I do think you are better off using the original S shocks as they are now in default sport mode, checking the connections in the wheel wells if you want them to be capable of the auto mode. Might just be dirty or disconnected. The shock valves themselves are not a problem AFAIK.
Yeah I will say the car handled tight for the minimal maneuvers I was doing, so I can't say they are bad. I would like the modes to work so I will check that (connectors) first. I still do want to lower it just a tad but if the shocks/struts are fine that will make that less of an expense. I'm hoping to get it up in the air in the next month and get cracking. That said I will likely still remove, clean, paint, and replace any questionable rubber parts, may as well if I'm going to have it apart. The brakes work great too but I will probably do the same, clean things up, add some steel braided lines, paint the calipers (and rebuild them myself if needed), and just get everything tip top.

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
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post #77 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-17-2018, 07:04 AM
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If you find it hard to get the transmission in reverse; try putting it in 1st and rolling forward a few inches -then try again to select reverse. The idea is to get the gears to mesh; don't force it!

The 164 came with a Group 31 A/C Delco. My first one lasted 12 or more years! I now have a Group 31 Interstate battery. Both of these batteries have a vent nipple to attach the cars battery vent/drain hose.

Front seats (I'd make a lower offer: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Alfa-Romeo-...omeo+164&rt=nc

The Gray carpet often fades to yellow with UV/heat exposure.

There is an Alarm modification that I still plan to do. It allows you to still use a remote to lock and unlock the doors without activating the pesky alarm; although the batteries can be replaced so it functions properly.
https://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/164...arm-91s-3.html
When the car was new, the alarm rarely ever malfunctioned but with age, it becomes more unreliable to the point that it is a nuisance.

Regarding your trunk; open the lid slowly and close it gently. Since yours is a 1991 it probably has spring assist. My 92 has strut cartridges and the mounting points have been known to fail. If this happens, I believe it requires a weld repair and often paint and bodywork to fix the damage to the rear pillar.

These cars were prone to have leaky cigarette seals too (a big job). If the fluid leaking is red it could be power steering rack leaking, in which case Lucas Power Steering Stop-Leak may help stop a small leak.

The car looks good sitting in your driveway!

Mark
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post #78 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-17-2018, 07:50 AM Thread Starter
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If you find it hard to get the transmission in reverse; try putting it in 1st and rolling forward a few inches -then try again to select reverse. The idea is to get the gears to mesh; don't force it!

The 164 came with a Group 31 A/C Delco. My first one lasted 12 or more years! I now have a Group 31 Interstate battery. Both of these batteries have a vent nipple to attach the cars battery vent/drain hose.

Front seats (I'd make a lower offer: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Alfa-Romeo-...omeo+164&rt=nc

The Gray carpet often fades to yellow with UV/heat exposure.

There is an Alarm modification that I still plan to do. It allows you to still use a remote to lock and unlock the doors without activating the pesky alarm; although the batteries can be replaced so it functions properly.
https://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/164...arm-91s-3.html
When the car was new, the alarm rarely ever malfunctioned but with age, it becomes more unreliable to the point that it is a nuisance.

Regarding your trunk; open the lid slowly and close it gently. Since yours is a 1991 it probably has spring assist. My 92 has strut cartridges and the mounting points have been known to fail. If this happens, I believe it requires a weld repair and often paint and bodywork to fix the damage to the rear pillar.

These cars were prone to have leaky cigarette seals too (a big job). If the fluid leaking is red it could be power steering rack leaking, in which case Lucas Power Steering Stop-Leak may help stop a small leak.

The car looks good sitting in your driveway!

Mark
Interestingly enough there doesn't seem to be a reverse lockout on this car. My VW's for example you need to push the shifter down to get to reverse, my Camaro has an electronic lock. I know its not synchronized, but seemed to be more of a fight than many cars I've had to get in there.

For the battery I will probably go Optima Yellowtop, I use those batteries in any of my cars that tend to sit, otherwise I end up replacing batteries more often than not. While the battery is newer I think it drained all the way, so you know how that tends to mess up standard batteries. They are a bit expensive but pay for themselves in the fact if it does die it can be charged right back up with no damage.

Hmm for the cost of those seats I could probably have the upholstery shop re cover my fronts. Plus they are pickup only and kind of far. Is there any source for the stock carpet, or am I making something myself with some aftermarket carpet?

Thanks for the alarm mod, I will do that. I'm less concerned someone will steal it, just would like remote locking/unlocking.

My trunk does have what looks like a complicated spring setup to go up and down. I have been very gentle with it as I read about that.

Its definitely oil, the fluid is not power steering.

Thanks, thats actually my Dads house but it will be getting rotated in and out with the Mercedes once I get it on the road.

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
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post #79 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-17-2018, 09:38 AM
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I've used Costco standard size 27 batteries in my 91S since I bought it in 94, and they last about 10 years or more, no problems starting or whatever. The LS does have a Costco Interstate 31 right now (long story), but I don't think it is necessary unless you live in an area which gets terrible winters. These batteries from Costco (actually made by Interstate) have been satisfactory for years, even the couple of times I've accidentally let the LS battery go pretty flat (forgetting to pull the radio fuse, lol) from not being driven for weeks, without the super high costs of the others.

The earlier trunk lids with springs have no/zero problems with hinges, etc. Don't worry about that. It's the later ones with struts which do. That design is bad news. In fact, I changed my LS over to the earlier spring set up, as I did notice the start of hinge distortion and top of strut rubbing on the inside of the right rear fender.

One more thing to remember. Do not use the spoiler to lift or esp lower the lid, as it is relatively flexible, and the paint on it can crack if you use that (don't ask) especially if you are used to American cars where you generally slammed the lid closed. I have adjusted both 164 lids so that they shut and lock with a light touch, no force necessary.

Most who are concerned about the faded carpet just dye it in situ, and use a pad on it. I think it is probably a pain to remove and replace.

There IS a lockout for reverse in the mechanism which doesn't allow you to shift from 5th straight down to reverse. It moves the lever over to 4th instead when downshifting. The trick we've always used for getting into reverse (our Milano is particularly touchy sometimes about this) is to hold the lever lightly against the balking reverse position, and just barely let the clutch start to engage. This turns the gears slightly and allows the lever to drop into reverse quite nicely without any trouble. Most of the time this is never a problem. Both our S and the LS shift into reverse with ease from idle. Your car should get better with use and you gain experience with the gearbox. My wife's brother has a Jetta, where he is continually fighting to push that knob down to get into reverse. Hangs up or something. Hates that part of the car.

Del

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1989 Milano, Shankle Sport
1991 164S, stock
1994 164LS (~Q)
1972 Morgan 27

previously owned since 1964:

62 Morris MiniMinor 850, 67 Austin 1275 Cooper S (Downton 3/4 race), 64 Giulia Sprint GT (1st red one made), 72 Fiat 128 Sedan, 75 Alfetta Sedan, 78 Alfetta Sedan, 78 GTV, 81 GTV6, 86 GTV6

Last edited by Del; 07-17-2018 at 09:57 AM.
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post #80 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-17-2018, 09:49 AM Thread Starter
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@Del is the radio in this car like some of my prior VWs where the thing stays on unless you manually turn it off? Could explain why the aftermarket radio in the car doesn't work, likely radio fuse removed for some reason.

Removing carpet is definitely a pain, but the carpet in here is pretty nasty and worn. I'll try and vac/shampoo, then maybe its worth dying, otherwise I may well go about replacement.

Thanks for the tip on the lockout and trunklid.

So far I've only ordered a Bosch oil sender and a cabin air filter. Who knows when thats last been changed.

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
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post #81 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-17-2018, 10:05 AM
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More people are using the Sunpro (now Bosch) oil pressure sender, selling for about $15. Use a 22 ohm resister in line to correct the reading to pretty close at cruise rpm, ~3000 rpm. Have them in both 164.

I just go to the hardware store and buy a generic HEPA furnace filter, remove the frame, cut it to size and install that. Works fine, and saves money from the OEM.

The stock radio stays on even with the ignition turned off until you remove the key. One thing I discovered is that if the car isn't going to be driven for a while, several weeks, the way to keep the battery charged is to remove just the radio fuse (no stations lost). Simple and works as that is the only normal ignition off drain in these cars.

Out of curiosity, what oil was your uncle using in the car? Not going to recommend one, as that is your choice from many, with or without high levels of zddp additives. Lots of opinions about that subject. Just don't exceed the zddp level of ~1200-1400 ppm, as higher than that range is said by researchers to be somewhat corrosive, etc. Maybe read this: 540ratblog.wordpress.com/2013/06/20/motor-oil-wear-test-ranking/

I might also suggest you use the hand brake every time you park the car, even on the level. Continual use will help keeping it from freezing up due to inactivity. I've used it every time in every Alfa since when I bought the cars and have never had a problem with it either wearing or freezing. My opinion of course, lol. The parking brake in my 190k miles 91S is original and works just fine yet.

Basically speaking in general, inactivity can degrade/ruin these cars.

Del

Seattle

1989 Milano, Shankle Sport
1991 164S, stock
1994 164LS (~Q)
1972 Morgan 27

previously owned since 1964:

62 Morris MiniMinor 850, 67 Austin 1275 Cooper S (Downton 3/4 race), 64 Giulia Sprint GT (1st red one made), 72 Fiat 128 Sedan, 75 Alfetta Sedan, 78 Alfetta Sedan, 78 GTV, 81 GTV6, 86 GTV6

Last edited by Del; 07-17-2018 at 11:36 AM.
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post #82 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-17-2018, 10:58 AM Thread Starter
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Yeah thats the plan with the Bosch I ordered, I have resistors at home I should have the right one for it. I read the post here talking about needing to replace the OEM one often. Forget that, close enough is fine on the dash.

I got the cabin filter for like $8 and I had to order a bunch of other stuff for my other cars so was no big deal.

Thats how the ignition operates in most GM cars made after 1992. You'd figure key out it wouldn't be a problem. Anyway somewhere along the line the radio in mine stopped working and clearly my uncle didn't care (despite putting an aftermarket Sony radio in anyway?) . Will need to hunt this one down, hope the harness isn't cut. Haven't decided what I will do there, but nothing more than a new head unit and some speakers. Not putting amplifiers or anything like that in here.

I'm not sure what oil he was using, I will check with the Alfa shop he used when I get the service records they have. I was going to see what they use or maybe use Mobil 1, which the 5w-30 is about 900ppm. I buy that stuff by the case as the truck and Camaro take it. Race car uses Redline straight 50.

And yeah I always use the hand brake, I actually broke it in my Camaro last year, that was a fun job to fix.

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
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post #83 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-17-2018, 08:36 PM
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Remember that the 164 radio wiring is straight Chrysler, with basically just two multiwire plugs to deal with. Plenty of adapter connector kits out there for the Chrysler wiring. Also realize that the stock radio has pretty good specs, better than you can probably hear. the speakers make the difference, not the radio.

Del

Seattle

1989 Milano, Shankle Sport
1991 164S, stock
1994 164LS (~Q)
1972 Morgan 27

previously owned since 1964:

62 Morris MiniMinor 850, 67 Austin 1275 Cooper S (Downton 3/4 race), 64 Giulia Sprint GT (1st red one made), 72 Fiat 128 Sedan, 75 Alfetta Sedan, 78 Alfetta Sedan, 78 GTV, 81 GTV6, 86 GTV6
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post #84 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-18-2018, 06:43 AM Thread Starter
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Remember that the 164 radio wiring is straight Chrysler, with basically just two multiwire plugs to deal with. Plenty of adapter connector kits out there for the Chrysler wiring. Also realize that the stock radio has pretty good specs, better than you can probably hear. the speakers make the difference, not the radio.
In a former life I was a car stereo and alarm installer for about 4 years or so. You're right about factory radios, even on old cars they can be far better than sticking a low end aftermarket radio in there. In terms of new cars the Harman/Kardon system in mine and my wifes Benzes are excellent, the Boston Acoustics system in my Camaro was great too, until the rear speakers blew for no reason (I don't even play it loud! those days are over).

However my uncle seems to have put in some sort of Sony Xplod radio thats got to be at least 10-15 years old and doesn't power up. It has a proper dash kit, so my hope is on the install someone used the proper harness plugs as well. Funny enough I actually have a Chrysler harness kit already sitting in the basement that would have worked on this car. I guess we will find out. The radio is junk either way (my old store used to sell them - awful) so once I get it working I will replace it with an Alpine or Clarion or something, and some new speakers as well.

My main problem now is I found out my dad got rid of our large collection of capacitors, resistors, etc. So now, with no radio shack in existence, I need to source a 22ohm 1/2w resistor for the oil pressure sender.

Oh and one of thing that is somehow long gone. The stupid little nuts that hold the license plate on!

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)

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post #85 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-18-2018, 08:03 AM
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I need to source a 22ohm 1/2w resistor for the oil pressure sender.
I have several extra ones sitting in the parts bin. Send me a PM with your address and I'll drop it in the mail to you.

John Stewart
74 Spider
91 164S
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post #86 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-18-2018, 08:09 AM Thread Starter
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I have several extra ones sitting in the parts bin. Send me a PM with your address and I'll drop it in the mail to you.
Awesome, thanks!

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
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post #87 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-18-2018, 11:36 AM
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When you get the resistor attach a long orange streamer to it. I bought a 12 pack of them on Amazon figuring I'd get around to installing one at some point. Fast forward a year or two and I have absolutely no idea where I put them, I just know that I have a dozen of them somewhere.

Paul - 1972 Spider - (2)1991 164S's - 1983 308 - 2001 Discovery - 1997 F350
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post #88 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-18-2018, 12:19 PM Thread Starter
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When you get the resistor attach a long orange streamer to it. I bought a 12 pack of them on Amazon figuring I'd get around to installing one at some point. Fast forward a year or two and I have absolutely no idea where I put them, I just know that I have a dozen of them somewhere.
Ha I know that feeling, I've been tearing up the house looking for a box of CR2032 batteries I bought for our home alarm sensors. I replaced a bunch and then put the box in a "very safe place" because the batteries crap out every year. No idea where that place is.

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
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post #89 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-18-2018, 12:41 PM
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Alfa radio

The Alfa 164 radios were the same as the radios Chrysler (Mopar) used from 1989 to the mid 1990's on Chrysler New Yorkers, Dodge Dynasties, and their Minivans, and even on Jeep Grand Cherokees. If you make a visit and search around your local Pick-N-Pull or other self serve wrecking yard, you can even score a Chrysler radio that plays both cassette tapes and CDs. Some of the Chrysler radios from that era even came with a built in graphic equalizer. In order to fit the Chrysler radios into the Alfa console, you have to trim a little off the right side edge of the Chrysler radios, since their faceplates were a bit wider. All the Chrysler radios were Japanese made and have pretty good quality. The weak links in the Alfa 164 sound systems are the poor speakers in the doors and rear deck area. The cardboard/fabric in the speakers has perished by now, so you easily can upgrade your sound system immensely with all new speakers.
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post #90 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-18-2018, 01:11 PM Thread Starter
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The Alfa 164 radios were the same as the radios Chrysler (Mopar) used from 1989 to the mid 1990's on Chrysler New Yorkers, Dodge Dynasties, and their Minivans, and even on Jeep Grand Cherokees. If you make a visit and search around your local Pick-N-Pull or other self serve wrecking yard, you can even score a Chrysler radio that plays both cassette tapes and CDs. Some of the Chrysler radios from that era even came with a built in graphic equalizer. In order to fit the Chrysler radios into the Alfa console, you have to trim a little off the right side edge of the Chrysler radios, since their faceplates were a bit wider. All the Chrysler radios were Japanese made and have pretty good quality. The weak links in the Alfa 164 sound systems are the poor speakers in the doors and rear deck area. The cardboard/fabric in the speakers has perished by now, so you easily can upgrade your sound system immensely with all new speakers.
Thanks, I will likely stick with an aftermarket radio so I can have Bluetooth hands free on it, as well as Satellite radio. I'd like to take the family on road trips in the car once its up and running, and i hate regular radio, and the kid stations work well to calm the girls down. Nice to have it all in one unit instead of an external speaker and external satellite receiver. Of course new speakers too (I'm taking apart the interior anyway, may as well).

IIRC I know Alpine made some of those 1.5 DIN OEM radios. Eclipse was the OEM later on I don't remember the year but they may have made the Alfa radio. Delphi made the ones for GM.

My older daughter (who is only 2 right now) is obsessed with cars, so this will be a fun car to take her to european car shows and the like. The younger one is only 3 months so who knows what she likes, lol.

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
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