New Guy with a 164S - Page 4 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
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post #46 of 90 (permalink) Old 06-28-2018, 08:19 PM
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FWD Alfa? Pass. Do what you need to do to put the GTV in your garage. Value will go up. 164 value sinking sinking like a bag of bricks.
Nah, that's not going to happen! The more that disappear the more they will be sought after. I am already seeing it. A buddy of mine in Spain decided to keep his due to values going up there. Let's not bring down the FWD Alfa and go down the FWD alfa is not an alfa blah blah blah road. There is a HUGE 164 following that will never go away! Sorry! What's great about alfa is variety. 164 FWD highway cruiser to GTV6 to Milano to Giuila to the spider. Lots of choices for different people or lots of choices if you decide to buy all of them. All fun in their own ways.
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post #47 of 90 (permalink) Old 06-29-2018, 07:32 AM Thread Starter
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FWD Alfa? Pass. Do what you need to do to put the GTV in your garage. Value will go up. 164 value sinking sinking like a bag of bricks.
No thanks, shes keeping the GTV and if she wasn't I don't have $50k to drop on a toy. While I prefer RWD, I have had plenty of fun with FWD and I am taking this car because I always liked the styling, and the engine is sweet. Just a bonus that it is uber cheap. Its a passion project not an investment.

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
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post #48 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 03:08 PM Thread Starter
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So I finally saw it today. Tried to observe and photograph as much as I could.

- The electronic suspension seems to work. Light was lit green over AUTO, hit sport and it switched to sport. I am surprised didn't think that was gonna work.

- Turned on the A/C when the fan etc came on it made some weird noises, I am assuming thats that stepper motor problem that I saw.

- Has an aftermarket radio, it doesn't turn on.

- You will note in gauge pics there is no oil pressure and the light is on. If you rev the motor the needle moves a bit. In terms of actual running the motor runs smooth, sounds fine, no ticking or anything, so I tend to believe it does have oil pressure and there is some sensor issue. There are two pics of the gauges, one is right when I started it, the other is after about 30 seconds or so, all the lights turned off at that point except brake (because the ebrake was on). The car had been running for about 30 minutes prior.

- Factory alarm remotes may be gone. The alarm is definitely off because you can just lock and unlock the car with the key.

- The only real rust/rot I found was the passenger rear 1/4. You can see the hole, also the lump in the side and rot under the gas cap. This is clearly an issue, I am guessing I'll need a whole new 1/4 to truly repair this. Anyone got one?

- Otherwise suspension mounts seemed to be ok. See the pics. Car felt solid, jack points were good I used them to lift the car. There is a rot hole in the trunk where the spare goes (pictured)

- Clearly it has an oil leak as well. I didn't drive it, but keep in mind this car was serviced at a top Alfa mechanic in Baldwin, and they knew my uncle like family. I am gonna call them tomorrow to see if they can give me any service history on the car.

I think looking at everything its probably a worthy project starting point, thoughts?

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)

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post #49 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 03:17 PM Thread Starter
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-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
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post #50 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 03:30 PM
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I've got a rear quarter panel. To bad your not closer<img src="http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/images/smilies/frown.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Frown" class="inlineimg" />
Also, check for rust underneath just forward of the rear trailing arm mounting points. Tap that area with a hammer.
The oil pressure senders is obviously bad and the low oil pressure switch is likely going out as well.

Red 1991 164S, Black 1991 164S, Red 1987 Milano, 1972 Berlina, 1973 Berlina rebuilding SPICA engine

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post #51 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 04:29 PM
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You got some serious rust especially in the rear brake lines buyer beware. Been there done that but had a rust free parts car to rebuild my S. That is not a S for the faint of heart me thinks.

Ciao, Alfisto Steve
Lakeland, Florida
Virginia Beach, Virginia
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Alfa Semi-Daily driver: USA model - BB2 1991 164S Black Beauty II ALFISTO [U]

[U] BB1 1991 164L w/S engine and A/T now excess to inventory [U]

Daily driver and parts hauler but not car hauler 2004 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4.7L H.O. V-8

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post #52 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 04:31 PM
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Both of my rear quarters were worse than that, at least in pictures. They were rebuilt without new panels. That was the body mans choice. I asked if he wanted me to find steel to work with and he said no. Mine isnít 100% perfect, but he did pretty good. Hole in the drivers rear door jamb came out great. Pass rear quarter shows a little seam where he rebuilt with new metal. See what a body shop says.

Youíre subframes show worse wear and corrosion than what I had. Itís funny how the cars can wear differently. I would predict youíll have issues when you get around to removing fasteners in the suspension if it needs any work.

$3000 is high if thatís still the number youíre working with.

John
1991 Alfa Romeo 164L, 1993 Ford 5.0L Mustang
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post #53 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 04:37 PM
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Make sure AC noise isnít from the compressor.

John
1991 Alfa Romeo 164L, 1993 Ford 5.0L Mustang
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post #54 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 05:16 PM
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I agree, that car isn't worth $3000. I bought one for $1000 and another for $840 that we're in better shape.

Red 1991 164S, Black 1991 164S, Red 1987 Milano, 1972 Berlina, 1973 Berlina rebuilding SPICA engine
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post #55 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 05:19 PM Thread Starter
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@Richard2 - Do you have all the way to the rail in the door (where I have that huge rot hole)? I'd consider paying to ship it if you'd be willing to go through packing it. I jacked from the factory jack points and they were solid I was surprised. If you look close at the trailing arm mount though there is some real rust there. Thats something I may need to consider reinforcing

@Alfisto Steve - Not totally concerned with the brake lines, I'm not scared of bending myself new ones if need be. Unless there is something I should know about the brake lines on this vs another car? The rust is about normal for a car of its age up here. In fact I thought it was gonna be way worse. The factory Jack points are all solid. I hear what you are saying about not being for the faint of heart though, but in your opinion in its condition, parts car? Or worth fixing. Mind you I'm fully prepared for this to be a long term project.

@Spitfire - I think my body guy would probably tell me replace it based on other work I've brought him. New York car, the underside doesn't surprise me though. Noise was definitely interior, like the fan or something. If $3k is high what do you think realistically, or is it maybe too far gone

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
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post #56 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 06:07 PM
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Factoring in not pissing off your cousin and hoping the engine and clutch/trans are up to snuff, maybe $1500-$2000.

Nicer rust free (less rust) cars to the south and west don’t do us much good after $1200 or more to transport!

We’re in a crappy area for rust and cost of living!

There’s nothing there that doesn’t look like it can’t be saved, and you sound capable.

John
1991 Alfa Romeo 164L, 1993 Ford 5.0L Mustang

Last edited by Spitfire; 07-08-2018 at 06:22 PM. Reason: Changed can to can’t
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post #57 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 06:21 PM
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How were the seats and interior?

John
1991 Alfa Romeo 164L, 1993 Ford 5.0L Mustang
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post #58 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-08-2018, 07:55 PM Thread Starter
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Factoring in not pissing off your cousin and hoping the engine and clutch/trans are up to snuff, maybe $1500-$2000.

Nicer rust free (less rust) cars to the south and west donít do us much good after $1200 or more to transport!

Weíre in a crappy area for rust and cost of living!

Thereís nothing there that doesnít look like it canít be saved, and you sound capable.
Other than a clear oil leak (hey keeps the front end from rusting!), the engine/trans is likely good. My uncle was around 55 years old when he got this car (he was 80 when he passed last month), and I don't think has ever driven an automatic trans car in his life, so the clutch is probably like new. The whole car only has 81k miles.

I'm thinking if I can find a shell with better condition trailing arm mounts cut that rear floor out and weld the whole thing in this car. I can't weld but I have 3 friends whom do it professionally and are more than capable. We could also just clear out the bad stuff and weld in plate steel reinforcement back there. The rest of it was less concerning, I'm sure you know from living in this area theres a certain level of rust that may scare others that you see and its like "eh thats like new!"

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How were the seats and interior?
Interior is complete, drivers seat is worn but not ripped. I think I can clean up the rest pretty well. Dash looks great as do the door panels. The drivers seat I'd consider recovering and padding, there is a local interior shop. I just want to save the panel with the Alfa logo embossing of course, that was in fine shape. Forgot to take pics.

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)
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post #59 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-09-2018, 12:44 AM
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I would agree that 12-15 hundred max for this S in its current condition would be the max purchase price. I bought my friends Philly PA one for that and brought it back to its former glory but I had my daughter's wrecked rust free 164B, a 164L or two as donors plus lots of help and encouragement from our Ship of [164] Fools here on alfaBB.

Maybe TMI but here is my story board on my BB2 164S resurrection and then some on what you might expect is ahead of you:

https://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/164...eal-money.html

Ciao, Alfisto Steve
Lakeland, Florida
Virginia Beach, Virginia
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Alfa Semi-Daily driver: USA model - BB2 1991 164S Black Beauty II ALFISTO [U]

[U] BB1 1991 164L w/S engine and A/T now excess to inventory [U]

Daily driver and parts hauler but not car hauler 2004 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4.7L H.O. V-8

"A day without an Alfa whine is like a day without sunshine"

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post #60 of 90 (permalink) Old 07-09-2018, 12:52 PM Thread Starter
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I would agree that 12-15 hundred max for this S in its current condition would be the max purchase price. I bought my friends Philly PA one for that and brought it back to its former glory but I had my daughter's wrecked rust free 164B, a 164L or two as donors plus lots of help and encouragement from our Ship of [164] Fools here on alfaBB.

Maybe TMI but here is my story board on my BB2 164S resurrection and then some on what you might expect is ahead of you:

https://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/164...eal-money.html
Thanks for that, looks like I have my work cut out for me. I just contacted my cousin about doing $1500 for the car. We will see what she says, but I think she will be ok with that.

EDIT: She said yes of course, and she got the title today so I will have the car in the next week or so.

If you guys can let me know specific things I should photograph I will share them here so you can put me in the right direction on starting this project.

-RL; 1991 Alfa Romeo 164S, 2014 Mercedes Benz E350 4Matic, 2010 Chevrolet Camaro SS, 2008 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD, 1995 Volkswagen Golf (Race Car)

Last edited by Rogue Leader; 07-09-2018 at 01:50 PM.
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