91 164 Front Passenger Running and Marker Light - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums
 
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post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-17-2014, 03:04 PM Thread Starter
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91 164 Front Passenger Running and Marker Light

Last week rain water got inside the front passenger-side turn signal lens and I had a fast blinker as well as a clicking sound when the lights were on that came from passenger foot area. The brake light as well as the (O) indicator adjacent to the park indicator are lit now also.

I replaced the bulb, but I only have turn signal - no running light or side marker light. Fuses are ok. Looking for troubleshooting steps.
Thanks
Nick

1991 164

Last edited by nicksorg; 04-17-2014 at 03:25 PM.
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post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-22-2014, 05:08 AM Thread Starter
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Update

Replaced 168 bulb in passenger side marker light so that is working. Front passenger running light still won't work. I tried new amber 1157 bulb and still only have turn signal. I'm going to order car disc today, but could use a wiring diagram for that lamp in the mean time to help troubleshoot the running light that won't work.
thanks
Nick

1991 164
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post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-22-2014, 06:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicksorg View Post
Replaced 168 bulb in passenger side marker light so that is working. Front passenger running light still won't work. I tried new amber 1157 bulb and still only have turn signal. I'm going to order car disc today, but could use a wiring diagram for that lamp in the mean time to help troubleshoot the running light that won't work.
thanks
Nick
So if you have side marker light and turn signal working you are started.

To have a turn signal working black ground wire to 1157 bulb socket must be good.

Do you have 12v power with key on and lights on to yellow-black wire terminal in black 3-wire socket connector that has spring retainer clip and clips to 1157 bulb socket?

Ciao, Alfisto Steve
Virginia Beach, VA
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Alfa Semi-Daily driver: USA model - BB2 1991 164S Black Beauty II ALFISTO [U]

[U] BB1 1991 164L w/S engine and A/T now excess to inventory [U]

Daily driver and parts hauler but not car hauler 2004 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4.7L H.O. V-8

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post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-22-2014, 11:23 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Alfisto Steve View Post
So if you have side marker light and turn signal working you are started.

To have a turn signal working black ground wire to 1157 bulb socket must be good.

Do you have 12v power with key on and lights on to yellow-black wire terminal in black 3-wire socket connector that has spring retainer clip and clips to 1157 bulb socket?
Hi Steve. With key on and lights on, I don't have 12v power to the yellow-black wire. I also have an empty relay socket that my owner's manual lists as head lamp washer relay. The middle receptacle of the empty relay socket has two yellow-black wires. I'm not sure if they are connected to the one in the running light socket. I tried moving headlamp relay into headlamp washer relay and the parking lights came on and stayed on even with key off. Subsequent searching showed a post where someone did the same and got the same results:

http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/164-...problem-2.html
so apparently that is a special relay for the washer.


1991 164

Last edited by nicksorg; 04-23-2014 at 03:17 AM.
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post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-23-2014, 04:56 AM
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Hi Steve. With key on and lights on, I don't have 12v power to the yellow-black wire. I also have an empty relay socket that my owner's manual lists as head lamp washer relay. The middle receptacle of the empty relay socket has two yellow-black wires. I'm not sure if they are connected to the one in the running light socket. I tried moving headlamp relay into headlamp washer relay and the parking lights came on and stayed on even with key off. Subsequent searching showed a post where someone did the same and got the same results:

http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/164-...problem-2.html
so apparently that is a special relay for the washer.

"With key on and lights on, I don't have 12v power to the yellow-black wire.


And yes that yellow-black power wire for parking lights also goes to headlight washer I19 pin 56 relay socket. The headlight washer relay socket pin 30 is hot at all times so since you are plugging in the headlight relay into washer relay socket you are jumping power from pin 30 to 56 and turning on parking lights. If you pull 20A fuse F17 (#7 fuse in fuse box - left fuse in second row) for H/L washer and Hazard lights the P/Ls will go out with H/L relay in washer relay socket.

Oh yes you do if right front side marker light is working because they both are powered by same yellow-black power wire. There is a three-wire splice of yellow-black power wire a few inches before R/F parking/turn signal socket connector with 2nd wire going to side marking in bumper and 3rd wire going to parking light bulb. Maybe you have issue from splice to light socket connector. Looks like a 4th wire near splice is going to H/L washer relay socket.

See wiring diagram on page 500 of 1991 wiring manual volume 1.

Ciao, Alfisto Steve
Virginia Beach, VA
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Alfa Semi-Daily driver: USA model - BB2 1991 164S Black Beauty II ALFISTO [U]

[U] BB1 1991 164L w/S engine and A/T now excess to inventory [U]

Daily driver and parts hauler but not car hauler 2004 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4.7L H.O. V-8

"A day without an Alfa whine is like a day without sunshine"

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post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-23-2014, 05:04 AM Thread Starter
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Correct, I don't have power at the socket pin with that particular wire.

1991 164
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post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-23-2014, 09:25 AM
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On all my Alfas, I eliminated the power going to the headlight washers, as they use too much fluid more importantly needed for the windshield, and I can easily wipe the headlights myself now and then.

Del

Seattle

1989 Milano, Shankle Sport
1991 164S, stock
1994 164LS (~Q)
1972 Morgan 27

previously owned since 1964:

62 Morris MiniMinor 850, 67 Austin 1275 Cooper S (Downton 3/4 race), 64 Giulia Sprint GT (1st red one made), 72 Fiat 128 Sedan, 75 Alfetta Sedan, 78 Alfetta Sedan, 78 GTV, 81 GTV6, 86 GTV6
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post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-24-2014, 04:33 AM Thread Starter
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How would you fix this?

So it turns out the wire was broken at the connector. It doesn't look like i can pull the female out of the socket to repair it.

I have another connector I can splice in, but wanted some opinions on how to best connect it leveraging the experience on the site. In the past I've soldered wires but often find the repairs are too brittle. Options:

1. twist each wire together and shrink tube over it.
2. Use butt connectors and wrap all of them with electrical tape
3. solder wires and shrink tube over each.



Thanks
Nick

1991 164
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post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-24-2014, 07:10 AM
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In this climate, here, I use some crimp connectors and some soldering. In your climate there, I'd never use crimp connectors. I'd solder and heat shrink.
BTW... the female should come out of that connector. Have you tried using a paper clip on the locking pin?

Red 1991 164S, Black 1991 164S, Red 1987 Milano, 1972 Berlina, 1973 Berlina rebuilding SPICA engine
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post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-24-2014, 09:51 AM
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Now aren't you glad that connector was included in the package?

Connect using butt connectors and heat shrink tubing but don't shrink it until you check out both turn and parking (postion) lights.

Solder if you have the proper equipment and use heat shrink However, COMMA do not just twist wires together.

Don't have any heat shrink large enough to go over butt connector then use electricsal tape over them.

There that is my 2.5 cents worth.

Ciao, Alfisto Steve
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Alfa Semi-Daily driver: USA model - BB2 1991 164S Black Beauty II ALFISTO [U]

[U] BB1 1991 164L w/S engine and A/T now excess to inventory [U]

Daily driver and parts hauler but not car hauler 2004 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland 4.7L H.O. V-8

"A day without an Alfa whine is like a day without sunshine"
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post #11 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-24-2014, 10:07 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Now aren't you glad that connector was included in the package?
Indeed I am! I actually took another look at the connector in the bright daylight and say how the female part of the connector was locked and was able to remove it. However, I'm never able get that inside crimp open on the female to place the wire back in...

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post #12 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-25-2014, 03:52 AM Thread Starter
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I was able to pop out the female connector and re-use the harness. Running light fixed. Thanks.

1991 164
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post #13 of 13 (permalink) Old 04-25-2014, 06:12 AM
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Nice...congratulations

Red 1991 164S, Black 1991 164S, Red 1987 Milano, 1972 Berlina, 1973 Berlina rebuilding SPICA engine
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