07-19-2009, 09:19 AM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 300
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It is very simple - don't feed the trolls...
__________________
Darryl
'81 Autodelta Turbo Alfetta (perpetual project)
'91 75 Twinspark (not so daily driver)
'88 Jaguar XJ40 Sovereign (worthless but still nice)
'07 Subaru Liberty (Legacy) Blitzen 3.0 (now if it just had some Alfa style...)
Cannondale road bike (daily peddler)
Colnago road bike - old, Italian, steel, and not much rust 
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07-19-2009, 11:00 AM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 1,649
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At least the heat got Van to delete his most offending words. [notice all the edits in the thread]. It is disingenuous for him to claim innocence after the fact, but such is the nature of trolls. As a car thread, its now just boring.
Robert
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07-19-2009, 11:42 AM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: BOYNTON BEACH, FL
Posts: 614
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Personally I'm against censorship in any form. I had assumed that a "forum" offered people a venue to express whatever opinions they might have. I'm often mildly irritated when words and/or entire postings are deleted by whoever has 'ordained' him/herself to be the arbiter of what We can or cannot read or write.
If so-and-so thinks Alfas are "junk" fine, I think he's a nit-wit but so what? I think that most of Us are adults & can deal w/the opinions or insults that are occasionally 'voiced' in these threads! Censoring(IMO) is not the answer. If you come upon a thread that insults or offends your own mindset or sense of fairness: either deal w/it, ignore it, respond to it, or move on! It has been my experience, through-out my 65 years, that when you come up against someone who's values or opinions are polar-opposites to yours neither of 'you' are going to change the 'others' mind!
Regards.
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07-19-2009, 05:29 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: May 2003
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 4,073
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 Quote:
Originally Posted by italcarnut
I agree with Paul. Lighten up! Alfa engines have been used in non Alfa cars for many years. Brabham used a flat 12 Alfa in there F1 cars for years. I've seen a Montreal engine in a cooper racer once. Fiat Topolinos have been used for years as hot rods. Cars are put on this earth to put a smile on our faces. In whatever shape they come. For me its a '79 Alfetta GTV.
Regards,
Ruben
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My problem is with people buying Alfa Romeo road cars with the sole intension (ie. before purchase) of replacing the engine with another marque, because they believe BEFORE purchase that Alfa Romeo cannot design engines. This is insulting to Alfa Romeo as I believe the engine is the soul of a car. If Nissan, Honda, BMW, etc. engines make you grin, then please buy one of those cars, and enjoy them to the fillest.
Now some general comments:
Alfa Romeo are not about pretty cars, they are about soul ... if you don't get that then Alfa Romeos are not for you. Fair enough.
BTW: Brabham designed that car 100% to use the Autodelta Alfa flat 12 ... ie. Alfa Romeo via Autodelta were the engine suppliers. No hacking after the event here.
We have to remember that the Alfa Nord engine is a very old engine, heck the whole car is ... and if you don't like it or believe a more modern engine is better, great! ... you are NOT an old car person, accept that and move on, because nearly all old car people think the engine is wonderful for its time (and that is the point that old car people understand!).
Hot rod cr@p like GM/Holden, Ford (but not Lotus or early Cosworth ones) or other mass produced cars ...
Quote:
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Originally Posted by alfahaka
It is very simple - don't feed the trolls...
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We are not only talking about offending posts but a relatively rare car is being destroyed in the process. I've been an Alfa Romeo enthusiast for like 30 years ... it's very upsetting to witness, and more importantly sit back and watch so many so called Alfisti support and encourage this destruction!
Pete
__________________
ps: Remember it's all just opinions
'71 1750 Series 2 GTV: http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/showthread.php?p=208078
Last edited by PSk; 07-19-2009 at 05:34 PM.
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07-22-2009, 12:02 PM
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Alfanumeric Member, Senor
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Join Date: May 2006
Location: NW Or & SW Wa
Posts: 765
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How about a show of hands: Any SNO directors commenting about the bad? Just wondering out loud.
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Todays toy count: 73 Alfa spider, 72 Alfa Spider, 78 Fiat Spider, Royal Enfield 500 Spyder
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07-22-2009, 12:28 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: BOYNTON BEACH, FL
Posts: 614
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RC Hiatt
How about a show of hands: Any SNO directors commenting about the bad? Just wondering out loud.
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What's an "SNO"?
Regards.
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07-22-2009, 02:00 PM
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Alfanumeric Member, Senor
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Join Date: May 2006
Location: NW Or & SW Wa
Posts: 765
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slam105
What's an "SNO"?
Regards.
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How To Join Scuderia Non Originale
__________________
Todays toy count: 73 Alfa spider, 72 Alfa Spider, 78 Fiat Spider, Royal Enfield 500 Spyder
Last edited by RC Hiatt; 07-22-2009 at 02:07 PM.
Reason: While I have no affiliation yet, I would consider it!
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07-22-2009, 02:56 PM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 1,649
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RC Hiatt
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Robert
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07-24-2009, 12:10 PM
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Grosse Pointe, MI
Posts: 1,707
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Boy I hate to jump in here since I was in there stirring the pot on Van's thread. But never one for letting common sense get in the way...
I started posting in a somewhat good natured way about Van's style decisions and politely suggesting that he tone down the attitude. When the attitude got out of control I found myself lowered to that level and I am not proud of that. I will state my position thusly:
1) I am not opposed to modifying Alfas. Some I like, some I don't. I have seen some really tastefully done conversions and some absolute abortions. But I can say the EXACT same thing for "sensitive" restorations as well. If I ran the world, any modification would need to be submitted to me in writing for approval. But I don't run the world and I would rather err on the side of personal freedom.
2) I can't stand big egos, bellicose claims, belittling others' taste, and a total disregard for grammar and punctuation - even when it's me doing it...
3) I am not a fan of censorship but I am an advocate for self rule. I do not like seeing threads reduced to childish name calling and personal insults. I have gone on other forums to ask a simple question (try a computer related forum...) and if someone responds it's usually with some smart remark ala "Nick the Computer Repair Guy" skirts on SNL. It just gets tiresome, not amusing and ultimately the forum withers. It would be a huge tragedy if this forum were to fall in to that trap so I find it hard to sit by idly and see it happen.
That was my intent when I began commenting on the subject thread. But as things devolved into bad behavior on everyone's part, Papajam (as an example of what's right about this forum) stepped in as referee and told everyone to knock it off. Several of us deleted our posts and I can only speak for myself in saying that it wasn't because I changed my mind but because I felt that it wasn't helping the forum. I guess Van edited his as well - good for him. ( I suggested he delete the whole thread and start over but that's his business.) The point is that the moderator didn't have to come in and clean house. We should be mature enough to do this ourselves...
__________________
- Rich D.
I like Alfas
Last edited by gprocket; 07-24-2009 at 12:13 PM.
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07-24-2009, 02:40 PM
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Alfanumeric Member, Senor
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Join Date: May 2006
Location: NW Or & SW Wa
Posts: 765
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gprocket
We should be mature enough to do this ourselves...
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__________________
Todays toy count: 73 Alfa spider, 72 Alfa Spider, 78 Fiat Spider, Royal Enfield 500 Spyder
Last edited by RC Hiatt; 07-25-2009 at 05:06 PM.
Reason: Yup - 1 day later the road to portland is washed out.
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07-24-2009, 02:59 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Dexter, Michigan USA
Posts: 3,371
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Bad Thread Needs Deleting
Quote:
Originally Posted by gprocket
...( I suggested he delete the whole thread and start over but that's his business.) The point is that the moderator didn't have to come in and clean house. We should be mature enough to do this ourselves...
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I agree we should all be mature enough to monitor ourselves and our posts; however, what normally occurs in a heated thread is that if one person edits their post they need the help of others to do the same or the thread no longer makes sense or one person ends up looking like they were off in la-la land or worse. When the moderator edits he tries to maintain the integrity of the thread and the information while removing the objectionable comments or abusive verbiage.
I am not a proponent of censorship but in some cases there is simply no other choice in a public forum when you cannot get agreement from all parties involved to edit their posts and to lower the threshold. As I've indicated previously, Simon has always had my permission to edit, delete, change, etc. any of my posts as he feels appropriate to the discussion and the general welfare of the bb.
__________________
Cheryl
(Not an authority nor SME
on anything, just PATSYF)
Last edited by Pat Braden; 07-24-2009 at 03:01 PM.
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07-26-2009, 06:01 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: May 2003
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 4,073
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat Braden
... Simon has always had my permission to edit, delete, change, etc. any of my posts as he feels appropriate to the discussion and the general welfare of the bb.
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Some sites do it, when somebody wants to stick a Chev in a Jaguar XJ6 ... immediately the thread is deleted. Just like if somebody posts a pornographic thread ... stops the arguing straight away whether somebody likes conversions or not (or pornography or not).
As with pornography there are plenty of hot rod sites ...
Pete
__________________
ps: Remember it's all just opinions
'71 1750 Series 2 GTV: http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/showthread.php?p=208078
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07-26-2009, 07:44 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: BOYNTON BEACH, FL
Posts: 614
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PSk
Agree, and he should simply delete engine conversion threads/posts when they are started ... then we would never have this drama in the first place.
Some sites do it, when somebody wants to stick a Chev in a Jaguar XJ6 ... immediately the thread is deleted.....
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Regards.
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07-26-2009, 08:34 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: May 2003
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 4,073
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slam105
Ridiculous! Maybe we can have the Ayatollah censor all the threads! How about we 'delete' any thread that contains a BLUE Alfa??? I thought this was America...
Regards.
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 . BTW: I have visited a couple of times . Good trips, thanks.
Ridiculous to you maybe, but if Simon did this we would not have this debate happening ... would have been sorted before it even started.
Oh and we already have censorship on this site ...
Pete
__________________
ps: Remember it's all just opinions
'71 1750 Series 2 GTV: http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/showthread.php?p=208078
Last edited by PSk; 07-26-2009 at 08:39 PM.
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07-26-2009, 08:54 PM
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Registered User
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: BOYNTON BEACH, FL
Posts: 614
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PSk
BTW: I don't live in America. Actually quite a few of the world don't . BTW: I have visited a couple of times . Good trips, thanks.
Ridiculous to you maybe, but if Simon did this we would not have this debate happening ... would have been sorted before it even started.
Oh and we already have censorship on this site ...
Pete |
Regards,
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