Spider Engine rebuild

[Roadtrip]

Compression testing is a pretty basic operation. I'd recommend that you go to the library and look in some old Chilton or Glenns Manuals. They have sections on basic troubleshooting like that. Don't use one of those el-cheapo push-in type compression testers. Get one that screws in.

Bring the engine to operating temp. Remove the fuel pump fuse to disable the fuel supply pump. Disconnect the long rod on a SPICA injected car. Remove all spark plugs and install the compression tester. Fully open the throttle butterflies and crank the engine over to get about 7-8 compression strokes. Note how the compression builds and note the highest reading. A healthy engine will give you a very good compression bumps on first couple of strokes, then build slowly to max. Weak compression rings will be anemic and slow build to a low reading. Repeat the test after pouring about a tsp of engine oil in the cylinder. Note the difference in compression between the wet and dry test. If the wet readings are signifcantly higher, the rings are weak.

Good serviceable (normal compression pistons) engine - 140-160 psi
Weak 120-140 psi
Bad less than 120 psi
All cylinders within 10% of each other.

Very high readings might indicate high compression pistons are installed or there's a ton of carbon buildup on the piston crown.

[gvisconty]

My last engine rebuild (also my first) drank oil to the tune of 1 qt per 200-300 miles. I had to clean the plugs every 100 miles or less, since they would foul to the point of not firing. Sounds very similar to yours?

Wes Ingram's diagnosis was that I had a "wet engine", the rings never seated because of my break-in procedure. In retrospect, I allowed the engine to idle way too much after first firing it up, and I tried to break it in by commuting to work everyday in heavy traffic (lots more idling). After about 800 miles, I gave up on the rings ever seating and rebuilt it again. Wes said that it would be OK to hone the cylinders and just replace the rings, but I went for a complete replacement instead. My second attempt at breaking it in seems to have been successful, this time I read a few posts on the alfabb about engine break in procedures.

BTW : when my engine was sucking oil, the compression test showed no problems (good compression equal on all cylinders). Also, both Wes Ingram and the Alfa dealer in town drove it and commented on how much power the engine was producing.

[jrflyboyVP2]

Thanks for the reply! Your experience (gvisconty) sounds just like what my engine is like. Plenty of power at all RPMS, idles well and pulls smoothly(thanks to John Stewarts excellent Spica Posts and emails along with Wes Ingrams book) as long as plugs aren't fouled. Starts easy now that the CSS is adjusted correctly. I don't really see much blue smoke in the rear mirror any more, but can smell that oil smell, and the exhaust pipe is wet with oil. The #1 is the main culprit based on plugs.

What I plan on doing is just driving it for a little while to see if it gets better (I don't expect so, since I used the old rings) and start on the rest of the car suspension (bushings, ball joints, shocks). I will have to get a compression tester and do the wet/dry thing. If after 800 to 1000 miles the oil consumption doesn't abate, I will order a liner kit. I will try doing the liners/pistons with the engine in the car, but if that proves too difficult, I will bolt the head back on with the old gasket, torque it up to 60lbs and pull the engine/trany out and redo it on the bench (hey I figure its worth a shot to try the liner piston in the car trick).

I don't have an engine hoist, and believe it or not, I pulled the engine the first time by stripping it down to just the block (no FI, head, starter, alternator, water pump, exhaust, trany). I used heavy nylon rope run down the sides and around the engine mounts either side, as well as one in the front around the front pully, and at the rear to stabilize it. I put a 2x6 across two step ladders on either side of car, and used a come-along. Raised the engine up as high a possible, let some air out of tires, and had my son and his girlfriend sit on each fender, than rolled the car out from under it. I did say I am an amature, didn't I! Borrowed a hoist to replace engine.

John

[Ianc]

Again, no need to replace liners and piston unless they are oval, and you can check that. Alfas run cold (usually) and very seldom damage piston skirts. But you MUST cross-hatch the cylinder walls when you hone, and you MUST replace rings. Once you take rings out of the holes, you have to replace them. Given all you've done, do a compression test. First, dry. Remove all plugs, open the throttle wide (has to have air to compress) test each hole (three revs for each reading) , record reading. Now squirt oil into the holes (about 10 cc's in each) and turn the engine over several revs. Now test compression again. If the compression goes up 10 lbs on any cylinder, the rings are bad. One hole with a bad set of rings (10 lb change) is not terrible. If you get a 20 lb change on any hole, or a total of 40 lbs total on all four, replace the rings.

[jrflyboyVP2]

Thanks Ian, I did Cross hatch the liners with a hone, but reused the old rings. I did not check for oval or taper. The Pistons were in great shape with very little scuffing on skirt, however I didn't check the ring groove clearance or ring gap. I have been researching and reading up on engine overhauls since I did mine, and realize I was quite sloppy in my actions. I will do the compression dry/wet test.

John

[jrflyboyVP2]

One other thing! What brand of rings do you recommend? Centerline recommends Hastings rings. Are they really the best.

John

[Ianc]

I certainly used to use them when I was wrenching sports cars. They were as good as any, and easy to get. Now - well, I've been out of the business for 30 years. Someone?

[Gary Williams]

Just saw this post while researching my own 2 liter oil burning issue that sounds very much like yours -- except I get oil on the number 1 and 2 plugs.

If you haven't taken the head off yet and plan to do so, you should search AlfaBB under "Reinz head gasket problem" or something similar. The Reinz head gaskets have caused problems for many of us, especially those of us with the older 2 liter motors, the ones with oil galleys at the back of the block. Reinz, in its infinite wisdom (or cheapness) now leaves off the sealant that used to be there to seal around the back oil gallies.

You need to add it yourself or you stand a strong chance of leaking oil into your coolant. Jon Norman, of Alfa Parts, has given me permission to post the diagram he sends out when he sells Reinz head gaskets. I will post it tonight or tomorrow night at www.greend.com.

Gary Williams