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View Poll Results: Which is better?
The Stock Ignition. 6 40.00%
MSD 7AL-2, even with its price... 3 20.00%
Jacobs Pro-Street Kit, just 15mj shy of the MSD, but is digital! 6 40.00%
Voters: 15. You may not vote on this poll

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  #46 (permalink)  
Old 10-05-2007, 11:21 PM
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Zunige Zunige is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ddouglas77 View Post
This older, but unused system came with instructions on reprogramming the fuel map along with fuel injector wiring harness's this system is PRE Mr Gasket, which is why it came with all of the goodies I loved about jacobs to begin with-anti theft, anti car jacking, full throttle switch-included, etc...
You can take that system as is - no need to re-program anything - and hook it up to your Spider, per their instructions, and it will work very nicely... (You could hook it up to my Spider, and it would work very nicely, as well. )

Best regards,
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  #47 (permalink)  
Old 10-05-2007, 11:27 PM
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Originally Posted by msiert View Post
Real pretty equipment David, It's very shiny. Murray likes shinny things.
LOL, I know, I believe someone was talking about Ding Dong wrappers and your engine compartment
We all know John M is king of bling on here I'm hoping I don't have your experience with the MSD on this system, I'll find a nice cool home for it, somewhere, need to pick up some tek screws from work tomorrow.
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  #48 (permalink)  
Old 10-05-2007, 11:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zunige View Post
You can take that system as is - no need to re-program anything - and hook it up to your Spider, per their instructions, and it will work very nicely... (You could hook it up to my Spider, and it would work very nicely, as well. )

Best regards,
Yes, I know that Enrique, I just didn't know that they had that set up in 1998, I was just looking for a new-Pre-Mr Gasket system, but apparantly this one came with all the bells and whistles of ???? car...I'm intrigued on this! I decided not to add the coil today/tomorrow, I'll do the whole kit and kaboodle on my days off (yes I actually got 2 of them in a row coming up!!!) Wednesday and Thursday. Of course, I won't show where I'm hiding the anti theft features, but everything else will be well documentated and pictured-it really is easy, I remember doing this on my old 69 Camaro, back in 98 as well...Sentimental value I suppose, now that I'm doing it again with another system being made in 1998...
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1990 Alfa Camaro Spider Super Sport Special American/Italian Edition. Pizza Burner with Pizzaz!
1974 Chevrolet Camaro

Last edited by ddouglas77; 10-05-2007 at 11:49 PM.
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  #49 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2007, 12:07 AM
mflugel mflugel is offline
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I don't know, but I run the stock ignition that came with my '85 spider. It has never let me down. Speed limits on the interstates are 70 mph here in the south and I just got back from a trip running the twisties in North Carolina and Tennessee spending a week running the Blue Ridge Parkway and the Smoky Mountain National Park. I ran "The Tail of the Dragon" which is something like 340 curves in 11 miles with a 5000 feet elevation change as well as route 28 in North carolina which is aptly named "hellbender. Never had a problem and my ignition never cost a me a dime other than the price i paid for it rolled up in the original purchase price of the car in 1985. The car seems to run fine as designed by the factory and DEFINITELY puts a smile on my face with the stock specifications. Well almost stock, I did invest in an upgraded stereo so that i could hear the music with the top down. For me, it seems a waste to invest a lot of money eeking out minor horsepower gains in a car that was designed from the "git-go" to deliver fun in its stock configuration. JMHO.
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  #50 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2007, 12:13 AM
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Originally Posted by mflugel View Post
Well almost stock, I did invest in an upgraded stereo so that i could hear the music with the top down. For me, it seems a waste to invest a lot of money eeking out minor horsepower gains in a car that was designed from the "git-go" to deliver fun in its stock configuration. JMHO.
That is what it is all about, designing the car around the driver...What kind of stereo do you have? I'm running the Kenwood KDC-MP832U, yes when the top is down, volume is of importance-agreed 100%!!! There are those of us, even Enrique-who has multiple personalities (100% stock or 100% modified) that like to tweak things a little differently and report those results back, which is what I like about this site, it eliminates the trial and error 99% of the time. My investment in eeking out any extra power was a grand total of $220, the bright side of "discontinued items" I suppose.
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1990 Alfa Camaro Spider Super Sport Special American/Italian Edition. Pizza Burner with Pizzaz!
1974 Chevrolet Camaro

Last edited by ddouglas77; 10-06-2007 at 12:30 AM.
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  #51 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2007, 12:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mflugel View Post
I don't know, but I run the stock ignition that came with my '85 spider. It has never let me down. Speed limits on the interstates are 70 mph here in the south and I just got back from a trip running the twisties in North Carolina and Tennessee spending a week running the Blue Ridge Parkway and the Smoky Mountain National Park. I ran "The Tail of the Dragon" which is something like 340 curves in 11 miles with a 5000 feet elevation change as well as route 28 in North carolina which is aptly named "hellbender. Never had a problem and my ignition never cost a me a dime other than the price i paid for it rolled up in the original purchase price of the car in 1985. The car seems to run fine as designed by the factory and DEFINITELY puts a smile on my face with the stock specifications. Well almost stock, I did invest in an upgraded stereo so that i could hear the music with the top down. For me, it seems a waste to invest a lot of money eeking out minor horsepower gains in a car that was designed from the "git-go" to deliver fun in its stock configuration. JMHO.
Been to the dragon. Thats a bunch of turning. I think the best application for the CD ignitions is of course of the older cars. Mine is utilized on my 78....originally a points setup. And it certainly was not up to the task to keep the plugs clean. These ignitions makes a huge difference in startability and throttle response. Don't know on the HP though.....but probably a little upper end. Stock Ljet or motronic is certainly up to the task.....of course for a stock car. When you start modifying the internals, the Ljet and the motronic can only take you so far before you are beyond their ability to tune for the upgrades. Murray's car for example is very modified and the stock unit could not be adapted for the task. The cars are nice in stock configuration for a cruiser. But they are extremely slow, body roll all over the place, shake like they are coming apart when you hit a bump, and not particularly as good as they should be at taking curves. On the positive they are relatively light, an advanced motor design, unique and very attractive. They are fantastic cars with a totally different character when upgraded both for performance beneath the hood and suspension so they can take curves effortlessly. The car comes to life with just suspension upgrades. The stock motor is free reving enough to make it very fun to drive in the twisties if you have the suspension working in your favor. Chasis stiffener is a big improvement. A proper alignment for handling. Then you take power and add it into the equation. Not just an ignition system...but high compression forged pistons, big valves and p&p head work, aluminum flywheel, balanced, blueprinted, port matching, headers, etc. If you are smiling now in stock config and enjoyed the dragon, you'll be smiling so much more with a performance setup that your face will hurt. Now you could go my route and keep one relatively stock...your 85.... and buy another to tinker with.

To David...once you get that car fixed, you'll have to come with Enrique to an autocross and we'll make you the baby seal meat for the day. You can get some experience as to what we have been up to with the cars. With your history of tinkering, and add some autocrossing, I am confident we can have you bitten by the bug and modifying your car for track events. You have been adding some nice parts here and there. Perhaps we could get you going full steam to build your own monster.

Best Regards,
John M
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1978 AR Spider Veloce 2000.....the first and still here
1984 AR Spider Veloce............the second & gone to the parts bin
1992 AR Spider Veloce............the third and still here
1991 AR 164L........................traded on the SS
1965 AR Sprint Speciale..........in boxes.
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  #52 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2007, 12:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John M View Post
To David...once you get that car fixed, you'll have to come with Enrique to an autocross and we'll make you the baby seal meat for the day.
John M
No John, no matter how enticingly you wave that stick around, I'm not going to bite on it so you can break my neck!!!! LOL
Seriously though, I'm built to think in straight lines (the shortest distance between point A to B). I want instaneous results that can be seen within 10 seconds of a "race", nothing more, but less than that would nice as well!!!!
Lets keep this going in the direction of the ignition system at hand, I do believe Murray has found his new "precious" LOL
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  #53 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2007, 01:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John M View Post
These ignitions makes a huge difference in startability and throttle response. Don't know on the HP though.....but probably a little upper end.
John M
Here I go again I suppose...Cardisc shows I only lose 18 ft/lbs of torque between 4200RPM and 5800RPM, any less torque loss after 5252RPM=Alot more "Hp". Some say torque is about "bottom end" as far as Horsepower goes, but it really is not. You are trading "bottom end" torque for a broader range in torque in which it can be used in higher RPMs. "Torque Converters-High Stall" would mean absolutely nothing if the torque wasn't being multiplied at higher ends which is exatcly what happens after 5252RPM, the available torque is multiplied into "HP"...This is important considering everything we already know about our engines, ignitions, fuel delivery etc...
Oh Holy Hell, I've just become baby seal meat haven't I? Please someone say they understood what I wrote!
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Last edited by ddouglas77; 10-06-2007 at 01:18 AM.
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  #54 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2007, 01:21 AM
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Originally Posted by ddouglas77 View Post
Please someone say they understood what I wrote!
After 5252rpms, torque is no longer 1:1 with horsepower, the more torque you have a greater amount of horsepower will follow-simple math!
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  #55 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2007, 01:23 AM
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After 5252rpms, torque is no longer 1:1 with horsepower, the more torque you have a greater amount of horsepower will follow-simple math!
Thank you!
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  #56 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2007, 05:59 AM
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David, we agree that more of a good thing isn't necessarily good when it comes to ignition advance. But I would argue that the same logic applies to most people putting the latest, hottest electronic ignition system on their car. Depending on what you have to start with, more amps won't necessarily offer any benefit. And let's not forget, the multiple sparks on these system are only provided at relatively low rpm. They are only providing single-sparks once you get into the "sporting" rpm range.

I'm not arguing against the benefits of a good electronic ignition, but I see over and over again posts from people (not you) who seem to believe that a few more milli-amps are going to give them more usable power. It just doesn't happen unless the original system is not working properly.

Erik



Quote:
Originally Posted by ddouglas77 View Post
Thank you Erik, yes, if the car is running a little retarded, advancing it back to normal or a little higher will definetly benefit the engine, it is when someone thinks 2-4 degrees advanced gives better benefits, that they too may think 6-8 degrees advanced will help even more, the whole, more is better thing. I already have electronic ignition, which is stock on my motronic, but I was looking for multiple sparks and the most amperage (hotter spark) that the plugs could get.
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  #57 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2007, 06:39 AM
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Originally Posted by ddouglas77 View Post
Hell, he could drive it to me and drink my beer while I install it, not very hard to do and the benefits so out weigh the time to do it!!! You have too much car work, that is proably why he'll never show up at your garage, I was lucky enough to be on a timed schedule, otherwise you'd have tricked me with all of that Mt. Dew you had...lol
Oh puleeese!! If I had to show up at Johns garage I would have to bring a trailer of SS parts to him.....