88 Spider Veloce starting anomalies!

iracema1 · #1 (**permalink**) 07-28-2009, 07:13 AM

Hi Everyone:
My 1988 has had an intermittent starting problem that has suddenly become constant! After sitting a few days, the car would crank and crank (just fine, both battery and starter are relatively new), but wouldn't start. Then (if I am at home), I put it on a battery charger, and after 45 minutes or so, it starts up right on the first crank! Recently the problem is such that even if the car just sits overnight I have this issue (and not always a convenient slow charger for the battery).
Is this an ECU issue that is requiring an optimal charge in order to send the right messages for fuel and spark? Otherwise I cannot understand why putting the car on a charger "cures" the issue so effectively. Any similar experiences out there?
Best
Andy

**ghnl** · #2 (**permalink**) 07-28-2009, 08:31 AM

I'd look for a small electrical drain somewhere that draws the battery down. The computers must see >10.3V to wake up and send the spark/fuel signals. The engine may crank over with seemingly good effort but if the available voltage drops during cranking, no start.

A common source for such a drain is one of the footwell lights. The cover acts as its switch - one way is automatic (with door open/close) moved the other way is always on.

phil c · #3 (**permalink**) 07-28-2009, 05:24 PM

Maybe that's why my footwell lamps are never on....Not a big issue, but I like to have everything working. It took me a year and this forum to realize that the trunk lights don't work unless the parking lamps are on. DOH!

iracema1 · #4 (**permalink**) 07-30-2009, 08:38 PM

Updates: pulled plug wire and attached extra plug, had friend crank car and no spark on plug. Seems pretty definitively a sparking issue. Going to chase down bad connections and ECU unit and report back later
Thanks
Andy

iracema1 · #5 (**permalink**) 07-30-2009, 09:15 PM

turned car to "on" position and checked for voltage at coil positive terminal and none! Where would you look next?

**SamW** · #6 (**permalink**) 07-31-2009, 04:26 AM

The number 7 fuse, check there first.

iracema1 · #7 (**permalink**) 07-31-2009, 01:51 PM

In the regular fusebox? That sounds too easy but crossing fingers it is. Are there other inline fuses or resisitors in front of the coil?

**papajam** · #8 (**permalink**) 07-31-2009, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iracema1

Are there other inline fuses or resisitors in front of the coil?

iracema1 · #9 (**permalink**) 08-04-2009, 06:51 PM

Cannot find my CD Rom guide!
Could I ask some kind lister to provide me pages showing the ignition ECU, ignition switch and few of the other parts in question? I have been searching the house for a couple of days but cannot find my CD ROM. Thanks in advance
Best
Andy

**ghnl** · #10 (**permalink**) 08-04-2009, 07:29 PM

What exactly are you looking for?

iracema1 · #11 (**permalink**) 08-04-2009, 09:25 PM

Thanks for that! But, is there a picture of the ECU itself?

**Tifosi** · #12 (**permalink**) 08-04-2009, 11:28 PM

ECU (injection): silver box, dark colored multiconnector, right side, under the cargo panel behind the seats. Can't miss it.

ICU (ignition): silver box, light colored multiconnector, right side, behind vertical carpet 'side lining' below the tops hinge point. Will likely have a sticker on it that says 'Motronic'

Clicking the link in ghnl's or my sig line for the spider diagnostics page will take you to a place where there's a photo of an ECU in location along with a schematic of the location for the ICU.

iracema1 · #13 (**permalink**) 08-05-2009, 04:07 PM

you guys are the best!
Thanks
Andy

iracema1 · #14 (**permalink**) 08-05-2009, 08:51 PM

Updates: Battery checks at 12v. Opened ignition ICU and voltage supply test: 12v. Primary circuit check: 12v. Then starting signal, (test to be done while cranking), barely 5-6v where guide says should be between 6-10.5. Perhaps an "Aha" moment, as this indicates something faulty between the ECU and contact 50 in the IGNITION SWITCH. So, will do some checks there and report back. Couldn't have got this far without the kinda assistance of the folks on the list!
Best
Andy

**ghnl** · #15 (**permalink**) 08-06-2009, 07:18 AM

Connect your voltmeter to the battery. Tell us what it measures during cranking. A marginal battery can make it sound like the engine is cranking over OK but if the available voltage drops below ~ 10.3V the computers will not wake up and go to work.