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Super getting some localized bodywork

147K views 2K replies 82 participants last post by  Andrew 
#1 ·
When I got my Super 15 years ago, it was nasty looking with dents, some bondo, a really nasty RR door, and poor paint, but luckily not much rust. I had the body done by a place in San Rafael in 2003 (now out of business, as seems to be the case with most body shops). They stripped it to bare metal, replaced the RR door with one I found in LA, sorted the brazing/bondo in the LF fender, dealt with the local rust, and painted it. Looked great. I saw it in bare metal and saw the rust repair areas, so I know they weren't just bondoed over. However, within 6-8 months the rust spots were bubbling back. Was I happy? No, but the shop disclaimed responsibility, and in fairness they had low-bid the job. Then they went under. They only way I'd have gotten satisfaction would have been to sue them, which I was not willing to do.

Fast forward to the present. About two months ago some kindly person keyed the trunk, all the way across on my Super, and then two days later a dog hit me (I didn't hit it, it ran into me on the mean streets of Emeryville). It was a pit bull with a head and chest made of steel, and put a dent in the hood and LF fender. So with all that piled up, and 8 years' advancing of the rust spots (no they haven't gotten better on their own), it's time to do some bodywork.

See pics of affected areas. I have pulled most of the trim off the areas that'll need work, and I'm hoping to get away with localized painting, but we'll see how it goes with the bodywork. The roof rust is nasty, and a very hard place to get at. I have the headliner pulled down, but it may have to come farther.

Conrad Stevenson is going to do the cutting and welding, and then most likely Andy Schank or D&M in Albany will do the paint. Conrad did basically this work x100 on his Colli wagon some years ago, and there's another Super in ahead of me for similar work right now. So he's kinda in the groove on this. I got a settlement check from the insurance company for the key damage, which will cover probably 20% of the whole job if I'm lucky.

At the same time, planning some project creep in advance. Will put in a new windshield as mine is nicely pitted from age and I have a few new ones. My 50+ eyes don't like the glare much at night, so new glass should be a good improvement. Also, the driver's seat is wearing through after 15 years, so I'll get its base redone. Might sort out some better door panels at the same time, we'll see.

Driving the pre-turbo Berlina in the interim (see its own thread), which is not a hardship, but it's not as fun. It's fast; it's got a good 2000, headers, and the Spica is working well. Plus it has brakes and wipers now, more than I can say when I drove it home.

Andrew
 

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#5 ·
The roof rust is not that uncommon, usually on the passenger's side. I've had three Giulias that bubbled up that way, and Conrad's Colli was a veritable iron oxide forest there. Don't know what leads to. This car was not well treated before my time, but it has been a Bay Area car since new, lived outside most of that time. Not under a tree though. The Berlina I had 10 years ago from Oakland did spend a decade under a tree, but didn't rust there, just everywhere else.
Andrew
 
#7 ·
Right side is all done, left rocker is done, just LR fender to go. Once Conrad got inside the right rocker, he took about two feet off, and there was a foot-long rust hole in the inner fender. Clearly not fixed right back in 2004, in fact not really fixed at all. Sigh.
Will post some pics when I get them. Hoping to be done this week, then will change the windshield, which is very pitted, then talking to Andy Schank about paint. Then reupholstering the base of the driver's seat.
Andrew
 
#9 ·
Looking good Andrew, hmn yes I too know of the phrase "quality bondo rather than quality cutting and welding". Still I am sure you will be happy to have it fixed properly this time. My brother once bought a cut and shut wrecked Super for spares, only to find lumps of wood jamed like a tongue in the cills and C piller to help hold it together. That car, was pretty much completely made of bondo !

Like Derek, I can't say I have ever seen either a Giulia or Berlina rust on the roof. So new to me. My Berlina had rust on the lip on the rear window, but that was from the inside of the cabin outwards, where the rubber window seals against the shell of the car.
 
#10 ·
This is my second Giulia with roof rust in this exact spot, the first a 65 Giulia TI I bought from Rich Ott in 1985 that had lived in Monterey, near the coast, for many years. Conrad's Colli had roof rust like you wouldn't believe, but the wagons have their own issues, depending on how the conversion was done.
Andrew
 
#11 ·
Car is back from Conrad's, going to Frank's of Berkeley for new windshield Friday. Then to Andy Schank for blocking and blend-painting next week. I'm hoping it doesn't develop into a complete paint job.
Andrew
 

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#12 ·
Phase 1, Conrad, done.
Phase 2, Frank's of Berkeley, done. Changes the windshield today. I have a variety of windshields around, chose one that seemed the closest fit in size. The glass in the car is original Alfa, perhaps original to the car, but pitted and sand-blasted, thus making glare at night. Frank's changed this gasket 15ish years ago; the one in the car when I bought it had air visible around it. In the ensuing years, this gasket got old and stiff enough that they asked me to find a new one. So got one from Jon Norman and Frank's was done by 3:00pm. Now that's service. They do the best glass around. Kept the old one as a spare.
This isn't cheap. I had the glass already, but retail value is $445. Gasket is about $150 (cheaper from Centerline) and $180 labor. Glue-in is even more, because the labor, done right, take hours. I did the removal of interior trim, etc. to save a bit of labor.
Phase 3, Andy Schank, paint.
Phase 4, reupholster front seat bottom.
Andrew
 

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#13 · (Edited)
Got the car back from Andy Schank yesterday after the Berlina tour. He ended up having to blend larger areas than we expected, which in itself should not be unexpected, and painted most of the rear of the car. Got a good paint match from Finish Master in Oakland on their scanner, with a PPG base coat (this is two-stage), Andy has the clear coats, bondo, waxes, sealers, etc. in stock. Took about five days, car looks great. There's a bit of waviness in one rear door and one rear fender along the ridge, but it wasn't perfect before, and it's not perfect now, but it's fine. If I'd wanted to spend an extra $5000 on prep time I could have had it perfect. That doesn't make sense for how I use the car.

Andy parked it inside a couple days, I brought it home, kicked the Giulietta outside, and will leave it inside for a few more days and then will start to reassemble. Andy says this kind of urethane is dry in like two days, so there shouldn't be any issues. He buffed the whole car (I am not good about washing and waxing), and is happy with the result, as am I.

I had basically all this same work done back in spring/summer 2004, took 4.5 months to do, and rust started popping back out within months. Having seen Conrad and Andy's work in progress this time, and knowing their reputations, I'm thinking I'll get a better long-term result.

Andrew
 

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#16 ·
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I too have had some localized body work - considerably more than I had anticipated when I took the car to the shop but certainly necessary.
Work done by Ayer European Auto in Gardiner, Maine, a shop I've worked with for the last 20 years or so. Very good quality and fairly priced.

Robert Willis
 

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#17 ·
My car had the RR lower fender repair down in 2004 and it's the one part that remained OK that that body shop touched. Same basic repair on mine, not quite as extensive.

My car is reassembled and back in use. Will get some pics. Much as I like my Berlina, I like my Super better. Berlina (Spica) gets much better gas mileage though, especially in town.

Andrew
 
#18 ·
Pics taken today in El Cerrito. Bodywork and paint suit my purposes; looks good, isn't so nice that I'm afraid to use the car. That's no indictment of the work, it's wanted I wanted and paid for. I could have paid for a ton more hours of prep and perfection that experience shows I wouldn't keep up to snuff.

I still plan to use this as my daily car, though I am more aware of its increasing value, and how much work and money I just put into it. I have to say, all things equal I'd rather the value of these hadn't gone up so much. Just my view from wanting to use it every day and not worry about it. The last couple months driving the beater Berlina have been great from this perspective; if it gets a scratch or ding, big deal. I don't even lock it.

About 1/3 of the car was painted and re-clearcoated. In most cases I can't tell where the old and new meet; mostly the joins and blended and buffed, not cleanly at panel breaks. Front left corner of hood was worked too, in addition to right roof, both rockers, both rear doors and wheelwells, and repaint on the whole trunk lid. Good work by Conrad and Andy. Conrad managed to do all the roof cutting and welding with my just pulling back the headliner a few inches, then regluing it when he was done. Did it myself, didn't have to involve an upholstery shop. Also, the new windshield, glare free. Weighs about half what the original Alfa glass did.

Andrew
 

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#23 ·
Not Prosource. It was one of two new ones I had with FWxxx sticker on it, so I believe an older one out of a warehouse. I want to say FW078, but will have to look it up. I can also look at the manufacturer "stamp," which unfortunately is somewhat high up on the driver's side, which seems like poor placement.
Andrew
 
#24 ·
Looked at my glass. As I say, I had several windshields and can't recall specifically where this one came from. It has a sticker with FW00178 on it, the interchange number, but the sticker is gone now.

Glass has on it:
CCC within a circle
E000039 DOT 563 AS-1 M-668
FW00178
9
48
20124

I presume CCC is the maker? FW00178 is the part number that any glass shop can find it with. But in terms of thickness and weight, I think it just depends on the luck of the draw. I have about 8 windshields; at some point I could dig them out and weigh them, but they're all under the house, a sore-back-making project.

Andrew
 
#25 ·
Just found this picture of the Super in approximately its original cosmetic condition when I got it, summer 1997. This was at a Berlina Register tour, unsure of the year, can't recall the name of the guy who had the equally nasty Super with BWAs, in the picture behind mine.Tall German hippieish guy, never saw him again.

I bought the car 1997 when if failed smog, had a bad rod bearing, and was sinking into the pavement in Berkeley; Roger's in Oakland had to harass the owner to take it home. It became smog-exempt Jan 1998 and I registered it. The car was nasty in every way other than rust, kind of its one good point. By the time of this picture (early 2000s) I have installed an unbroken grille, new window seals, a new engine, redone the interior, 14" wheels and hubcaps from my old 1969 Berlina. Its original "volcano" 15" wheels were can-painted beige for unknown reasons.

Car was sold new in Oakland or Berkeley, has had six (maybe more) previous Bay Area owners, most of whom I've met. First owner Russell Potts lived up on Grizzly Peak in Berkeley, had a street GTA as well at the time. A neighbor a couple blocks over hailed me down when he first saw me driving this, told me about the original owner, who had been a friend of his. The "UAW" black license plate is a real spotting feature for folks.
Andrew
 

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#26 ·
Been enjoying the car immensely. The nice paint has prompted me to actually wash it form time to time. It's bodywork year; as I mentioned above, first I got the vandalism key scrape, then did that and the rust repair taking car of one of the dog-bites-Super dents at the same time. Well, two weeks ago, I don't know where, someone swiped the driver's door and LF fender slightly, probably in a poor parking lot maneuver. No note, and I don't even know when/where it happened. Will take it to a good paintless dent guy to see if he can work his magic. Otherwise it's back to Andy for pounding and paint. It's not a bad dent, but it's maddening as hell, and this is on collision coverage, while the vandalism was comprehensive, so I'll have to pay deductible.

In other news, I have loved the 165-14 Vredestein Sprint Plus tires on this car, had them for 10+ years. I don't drive enough to wear tires out through mileage, rather they die of dry rot, hardness, cracked sidewalls, carcass issues. These Vreds are my favorite tires ever, got them from a Berlina guy who bought them, then sold his Berlina before he mounted them. I picked them up in LA on the way back from buying a Berlina in Phoenix and driving it home. Mega adventure. But they're really cracked, and they've gotten old and distorted enough that if I rotate them, the carcass are screwy enough that the car doesn't track straight. Clearly on borrowed time.

Someone gave me a couple years ago these 185/70-14 Hercules tires on 2000 wheels, so I mounted them today and will put some miles on them to see how they are. If they work well, I'll transfer them to the Super's 1750 wheels. They're cheap, treadwear rating of 500, so they should last til the end of time. Drove around the block and the steering is nice and light. So we'll see how they drive and stick. They're a bit taller than the 165-14, OK with me. I like the clearance and the gearing.

I'm definitely not a tire snob. The Berlina has had two sets of Nankang Chinese tires on it, the latest which came with BWAs.

Andrew
 

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