My new 1969gtv(french blue?)

[fettaguy]

Was hoping to hear better news in the handling department but still it sounds like a fun ride.

[series1gtv]

when I was describing the 2002 I was talking bone stock 13 inch wheels with 165s vs. my bone stock gtv. With the upgrades on the 2002 the thing handles better than my stock 98 318ti. People who have ridden in it are often blown away by it's abilities BMW people have told me it's the best 2002 they've seen the combo of 15's with 205's eibach pro springs and bilstein sport(which on this car are very stiff) uerethane bushings and the big brake kit make for one amazing car that seems very modern to drive.In other words the 2002 is a good handling car that with some modification can be made into a very competitive and modern feeling car. Don't get me wrong fettaguy these things are wicked fast and very similar to the Alfa's the character is very balanced when stock and extremely sharp when modified. Unlike the Alfa it takes some upgrades to make it feel right. The 2002s handling is awesome with only a few changes. I think that BMW made some compromise in the handling in order to make the car more comfortable. It seems Alfa did too as they resond to tuning really well, it just seems that Alfa kept the car a little more raw rather than go for the comfort factor.

Jeff

[fettaguy]

Sorry dude, must have got my wires a bit crossed there...

[series1gtv]

Fettaguy, I think you would really like the 2002 there's a hatchback version thats really cool looking and the tii version is fuel injected they are cheap to maintain and easy to find(in the U.S.) I reckon they would be the same in Australia


Jeff

[alfaholico]

A hatchback version of a 2002??? I've never seen this. During my youth, a good friend had a 2002 ti. Nice car but I always felt that it was like driving a little tank. Solid, secure, but not inspiring. In addition, everything was an effort. Steering, braking. My current Giulia Sprint is much more tossable and fun to drive. It's not insulating at all. Just my two cents. Oh, in addition, in the looks department, there's no contest.

[fettaguy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by series1gtv Fettaguy, I think you would really like the 2002 there's a hatchback version thats really cool looking and the tii version is fuel injected they are cheap to maintain and easy to find(in the U.S.) I reckon they would be the same in Australia

[Touringspider]

Wasn't the 2002 hatch called the "ti Touring" or something like that? Kind of funky looking in that 70's sort of way. Similar roofline to a Hillman Imp or Sunbeam Stilletto if that helps any...

Arno Leskinen
AROC National Concours Chair
102
115
116

[BKCowGod]

Yah, 2002 touring... Great old cars.
coupla pix - http://home.wanadoo.nl/toontraets/im...%20touring.jpg
http://www.modelcarworld.biz/Grafik/...800/856_01.jpg

On another note, the amazing thing about the '02 handling was always how forgiving it was. My first car was a modified 1970 with a huge Weber carb and 5" Pirelli P400s. It was in that car that I learned skid control.

[fettaguy]

Dunno about that hatch......reckon i'll stick with the coupe

[series1gtv]

I thought I should revive this thread, I now have the 1976 BMW 2002 back on the road as my daily driver. Some changes: The recaros are now in the Alfa and the orginal 02 seats are back. The biggest change was to remove those awful cow catcher bumpers to save some weight. The shocks they mounted to were at least 25 pounds each. If you picture a set of konis multiply that by 2.5 for size then multiply the thickness of the metal casings by about ten. Yes these were bumper shocks for a nuclear attack not some 5 mph love tap from a delivery truck.
The 2002 was in limbo for a little over a year but its driving great.Honestly it is really a bit quick for the road and some what difficult to drive at times.Of course being too quick is the sort of problem you don't mind having.
The Alfa has had a lot of little things done to it. The previous owner was getting very old and had driven it since new so there were a few items that were many years past needing replacement. The most obvious being suspension bushes and springs. Both cars need a little body work but the Alfa will be first mainly because I love it the most. I will post some new pics of the BMW to show the way it looks without those Giant bumpers. BTW I know there are others who have this combo of 2002 and GTV what comparisons can you make? Each has its own seperate qualities the Alfa is very much more agile and athletic. Also I'm more comfortable in the Alfa even though I'm 6'1. The only space problem I have is that the Alfa pedals are difficult for me to heel and toe. The BMW pedals are soooo easy I can push the brake and gas at the same time and also move them independant of each other despite using both. In other words pedal work in the 2002 couldn't get much easier. I really don't even need to left foot brake because the set-up is so perfect( Now I'm not saying that I could left foot brake even if I wanted to........just that I don't need to). I have a metric mechanic motor in the 2002 its 2.2 liters, lightweight reciprocating parts, etc, etc. but it still doesn't rev or sound as the Alfa. It is however very,very fast. Its even faster higher up (between 60-90 MPH I guess because of the gearing)so its a difficult car to drive smoothly and with a lightweight flywheel you know the story. Anyone who has driven a 2002 knows that a fifth gear is really needed. I have the 5 speed but the 320(I think 5speed gearing is more relaxed so you never really need 5th) in fact if you so choose 3rd gear will go from way slow to 85-90MPH. If anyone has some interesting BMW 2002 vs. Alfa GTV stories or experiences I would be glad to read about them or if you would like to post BMW 2002 pictures you are welcome to place them in this thread.
To quote the old Bugatti catchphrase
Vive La Marque !

Jeff

[rloewy]

I own a '72 2002 in pretty much stock condition. It is indeed, a fantastic car - even without modifications. It was bought as a family backup car because I could not find a comprable Giulia Super in good condition for 3 times the price - and I looked for a long time. I actually saw a great, low mileage '67 Giulia Sprint GT Veloce that I almost bought before I purchased the BMW - but could not fit a child seat in the rear - so it was a no go. I am still upset I did not buy it anyway...

I think the description in this thread is spot on - while I never owned a GTV (I did own a spider) - the BMWs are great little cars that with a bit of tinkering can be made to be really good handlers. The Alfas seem to come out of the box closer to the ideal.

FWIW - I am ready to purchase a "real" family car - once this happens (or before if anyone is really interested) - my BMW will be sold and an Alfa (or Lancia Fulvia) will join the garage as a backup fun car

[series1gtv]

rloewy
Thats a really nice 2002 I was starting to think that a good stock 2002 was a myth. So many of these cars have gone through many,many owners and modifications its really refreshing to see one as it was before time and the quest for more power.
Good luck with your search I'm sure there's an Alfa out there somewhere......
BTW have you checked with Andrew Watry
http://www.berlinaregister.com/

or for just the giulia super you might try contacting
http://www.alfaclubdc.com/jsuper1.htm

[rloewy]

Yes, I have looked at several of the Giulias that were available for sale for a while before I ran across this BMW and just had to buy it (as you said - finding a non-molested 2002 is getting harder and harder).

I have got some pointers from Andrew and he offers a great resouce - it is just that these cars are really hard to find - especially if you do not want a project. Most of the Giulia Sedans I have seen were in one of two states - rust buckets/basket cases and $14K+ cars in good condition.

I have recently seen a local TI in rather poor state (it was sound mechanically, but had at least $10K in restoration costs to bring it to where my BMW is as far as rust, exterior and interior is concerned) - the asking price was $5K - more than what I paid for a my Bimmer in very good condition.

Do not get me wrong - a good Giulia sedan is a more exciting car in my opinion than a comprable BMW 2002. I am just not ready to pay 3.5 times the price to get one in the same condition as my car. I would probably pay twice as much as what my car have cost me for one - but more than it just does not make sense to me (and I understand that others differ and I respect that).

At this point it seems that I will buy a bigger modern car that has a real back seat to serve family duties- at this point I will consider selling the '02 and look for something like a GTV or Fulvia - less practical but more fun.