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Old 09-25-2005, 09:39 AM
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Mystery Car

Found these pictures on the web.
Anyone who has a clue ?
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Old 09-25-2005, 11:08 AM
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Old 09-25-2005, 11:34 AM
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Looks like a Brazilian FNM to me. Here is a basic history of the company:

http://www.italiaspeed.com/2005/hist.../fnm/0501.html

Check out all 3 pages of the story...
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Old 09-25-2005, 08:31 PM
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Yeah, that's FNM from Brazil...

The FNM 2000 was a knockdown model based on iron block 102 2000 berlina (I think this car looks very sexy, lot better than 2600 berlina. Too bad there aren't many left). During the caurse of the production, FNM tried to modernize the car's look, and as a result, the car lost that sexy nose . It is pretty amazing that they kept using the same engine till 80s. the unit on FNM 2300, which looks like a bloated alfetta, is identically the same as the one (1884cc unit of 1st series 1900) originally designed back in 1940s (I am assuming that the engine on 1900 series debuted in 1951 were designed in 1940s). My mom once thought about putting that 2300cc engine into her 1900M (should be bolt-on) when Tony Stevens of alfa stop offered her one for sale...
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Old 09-25-2005, 09:06 PM
CarterHendricks CarterHendricks is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tiger0529
The FNM 2000 was a knockdown model... It is pretty amazing that they kept using the same engine till 80s. the unit on FNM 2300, which looks like a bloated alfetta, is identically the same as the one (1884cc unit of 1st series 1900) originally designed back in 1940s (I am assuming that the engine on 1900 series debuted in 1951 were designed in 1940s).
1. The FNM's were actually manufactured [not shipped knocked down] in Brazil, though engines and some components originally flowed from Italy. Production was very difficult, and when the cars were finally flowing in quantity they were a difficult sale, and some were finally sold in Holland and Germany. <p>2. Not identically but basically--it got some oiling system mods etc all of which required a lot of changes, but it did grow to 2300cc and was even fitted with some locally made twin Solex carbs. <p>3. The 1900 4 cyl was derived in the late 1940's from the 6C3000, the passenger car project which also begat the 6C3000CM race cars. Yes, designed in the 40's, but breaking away from the older engine designs. The formal debut was on October 3, 1950.<p>The whole FNM story is either fascinating or very, very boring.<p>--Carter
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Old 09-25-2005, 09:22 PM
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Originally Posted by CarterHendricks
1. The FNM's were actually manufactured [not shipped knocked down] in Brazil, though engines and some components originally flowed from Italy. Production was very difficult, and when the cars were finally flowing in quantity they were a difficult sale, and some were finally sold in Holland and Germany. <p>2. Not identically but basically--it got some oiling system mods etc all of which required a lot of changes, but it did grow to 2300cc and was even fitted with some locally made twin Solex carbs. <p>3. The 1900 4 cyl was derived in the late 1940's from the 6C3000, the passenger car project which also begat the 6C3000CM race cars. Yes, designed in the 40's, but breaking away from the older engine designs. The formal debut was on October 3, 1950.<p>The whole FNM story is either fascinating or very, very boring.<p>--Carter
I thought the word "knockdown" means otherwise... I knew the FNMs were made over there in Brazil!!

You picked on every point I made in the previous post... You made me look like a mere ignorant !!

If it's based on 6C 3000, does that mean that the 6C 2500 is it's root?

Oh well, I feel like I'd rather have my previous post deleted...
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Last edited by tiger0529; 09-25-2005 at 09:27 PM.
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Old 09-25-2005, 09:34 PM
CarterHendricks CarterHendricks is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dretceterini
Looks like a Brazilian FNM to me. Here is a basic history of the company:

http://www.italiaspeed.com/2005/hist.../fnm/0501.html

Check out all 3 pages of the story...
This is a good account of the FNM story from the European perspective. It glosses over the difficulties in getting production underway in Brazil. I think that Alfa started out only as a supplier of engines and parts to FNM, but eventually owned the whole... project. Luraghi made a trip to Brazil try to understand and fix the situation. <p>The article describes the 1900 cars made in Argentina as Alfas. The 1900 cars made in Argentina were actually made by IKA, Kaiser, from tooling bought from Alfa. The car used Willys running gear, and McCloud [the head of IKA] told me that part of Kaiser's intention was to build a local supplier network to build cloned parts for the cars. Alfa wasn't involved.<p>My hope that Alfa 1900 tooling might remain in Argentina was dashed when McCloud explained to me that IKA was a "vertically integrated company." When Kaiser was done with the 1900, the tooling was hauled a few thousand feet and dumped in the blast furnace..<p>--Carter
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Old 09-25-2005, 09:45 PM
CarterHendricks CarterHendricks is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tiger0529
I thought the word "knockdown" means otherwise... I knew the FNMs were made over there in Brazil!!



If it's based on 6C 3000, does that mean that the 6C 2500 is it's root?

Oh well, I feel like I'd rather have my previous post deleted...
no no no! <p>I only wanted to add to things which I find interesting, and maybe clarify a few details. And there were Alfas "made" from kits in other countries. For example: Frere wrote that the 1900 cars were assembled in Belgium [I'd like to learn more about this].<p>But to explain further. The 6C3000 motor is not an enlarged or developed 6C 2500. It is a much simpler [and in that way better] design. I have 1900 and 6C2500 engines underway in my shop, and the only clear connection is in the intake port shape.<p>--Carter
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