05-14-2007, 02:05 PM
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What is wrong with locked diffs? They're quite popular on the grassroots level...beats open diff don't it? Platinum tranny's are very rare and expensive thesedays...like $600 or more for a working unit?
On second thought, ABS could be disabled for racing purposes....would be better than ripping it out. The additional weight could be made up with having a class wide minum weight.
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1987 Milano Platinum - check for many new items. [B][COLOR="Red"][URL="http://alfabb.com/bb/forums/showthread.php?t=42980"]PARTING OUT[/URL][/COLOR][/B]
1989 Verde - Harsh shocks and SS rears, 27mm torsion bars, stainless lines, pads, 16X7.5 rims, 4.10 rebuilt platinum tranny, poly bushes, and RSR 28mm front and 25.4mm adjustable sways!
1984 GTV-6 - 80K miles
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05-14-2007, 04:55 PM
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Rather than setting hard eligibility rules, you would be better off with a points system or handicap to maximise the number of vehicles that can run as is. You might assign a 2 point penalty for an LSD, 1 point for cams etc, with a max of 8 points allowed, or your number of points deducted from your round win points ... Eg 30 points for a win, 25 for a second etc
Dean
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05-14-2007, 05:03 PM
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Can the GTV6's come out and play?  
In all seriousness, I know nothing about the logistics needed to get something like this set up though SCCA or NASA. If it's actually possible, it would be awesome, and the transaxle Alfa's seem like great candidates. Recently the Spec Focus series was started by NASA. The average build cost seems to be somewhere around $10k, and yet it seems to be taking off. I don't see why an Alfa series wouldn't work as well as a E30 series, just on a smaller scale (which might be a good thing as apparently Spec Miata is so crowded it's difficult to race anymore).
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James
1984 GTV6
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05-14-2007, 05:10 PM
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 Quote:
Originally Posted by dfrye
Rather than setting hard eligibility rules, you would be better off with a points system or handicap to maximise the number of vehicles that can run as is. You might assign a 2 point penalty for an LSD, 1 point for cams etc, with a max of 8 points allowed, or your number of points deducted from your round win points ... Eg 30 points for a win, 25 for a second etc
Dean
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Nothing should prevent people from entering a car that is not build to the full potential of the rules. Of course, by setting a max you may rule out some already built cars that may happen to exceed the max. Min requirements should only address safety.
If this is under AROSC I'm sure it would be a gentleman's series where fair play is assumed rather than enforced.
IMO it should be all about making it simple (from a logistic point of view) and affordable.
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Can the GTV6's come out and play?
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Maybe it should be a Milano/GTV6 Spec series or even a 116 Spec series?
Jes
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87 Milano Verde - daily driver - Juliet
87 Milano 3.0 Motronic - budget race car - Roxanne
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(Repeating what I suggest or do is at your own risk - be critical)
Last edited by AR4me; 05-14-2007 at 05:14 PM.
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05-14-2007, 05:22 PM
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I think the Milanos would need a handicap boost if the GTV6's came out!
It would be really neat to see Alfetta's and GTV6's and Milanos all out there racing, but then again, don't we already have this in the AROSC races?
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1987 Milano Platinum - check for many new items. [B][COLOR="Red"][URL="http://alfabb.com/bb/forums/showthread.php?t=42980"]PARTING OUT[/URL][/COLOR][/B]
1989 Verde - Harsh shocks and SS rears, 27mm torsion bars, stainless lines, pads, 16X7.5 rims, 4.10 rebuilt platinum tranny, poly bushes, and RSR 28mm front and 25.4mm adjustable sways!
1984 GTV-6 - 80K miles
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05-14-2007, 05:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grant
I think the Milanos would need a handicap boost if the GTV6's came out!
It would be really neat to see Alfetta's and GTV6's and Milanos all out there racing, but then again, don't we already have this in the AROSC races?
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I really think the points system would work well, and could provide a built-in handicap if one model proves inherently faster then another.
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James
1984 GTV6
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05-14-2007, 05:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Echo Leader
That would be really cool. Maybe there's more AROSC events in sunny CA... Plus if this was done through SCCA and NASA it would perhaps promote the Alfa chassis and get people, and additional aftermarket companies, involved in the Alfa world.
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05-14-2007, 09:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfar7
As to non SCCA racing it`s a dream to think you are goning to get 20 or even 10 (I`ll bet 5) Milanos at the same track with a "SPEC" level of preparation. Alfa owners are too independent & cheap to toe the line particularly to spend the $$ with "a run at the back" car. That`s why they are not racing. Sorry for the reality check.
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 There are plenty of "places" for that in IC and SCCA! I am talking about a spec series for Milanos! (Not that far fetched when you compare the two cars, their limited following, the budgets, the people and look at the participation of the E30 spc series HERE AND ON THE EAST COAST!!! When you consider that with such a series in place I myself know of at least 2-3-4 guys in Seattle alone who would JUMP on the opportunity right away - imagine how many there are out there who would also go for it once established!
I guess you are right though; with attitudes such as that towards the marque and the supporters of the brand - it won't/can't happen... 
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05-14-2007, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hit an Apex
On a more important note, who would sanction it?
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Dunno - take a page from the E30 guys - I am sure that they had some of the same questions when the idea came to fruition. They did not look for ways to shoot it down; they looked for ways to make it happen and it did!
As far as cheating; there are cams and lots of other small "edge" tricks for the E30s as well - you just don't do it.
That is the one thing that is nice about a spec series - it is easy to see when one guy just runs away from the pack...
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Full-Race 3.7 Litre 24v Milano; Street/Track 3.0 Litre 24v Milano Verde; 2.0 TS '73 GTV; 6-speed 3.45 litre 24v Street 164 LS/Super; '06 Scion XB - Runs!
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05-14-2007, 09:56 PM
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The point of a spec series is EXACTLY NOT to have a "points" system... Cars are all supposed to be equal.
This isn't Alfa track-day stuff - the average owner couldn't just throw these cars together - specialty items such as a custom cage and final suspension setup and other trim-work runs through a hand full of shops who know their customers and know the cars and who can tell differences between cars...
Cheaters/constant winners get pulled and pumped - simple as that!
Dunno - maybe this is a BAD idea... I guess Alfa people are just different...
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Full-Race 3.7 Litre 24v Milano; Street/Track 3.0 Litre 24v Milano Verde; 2.0 TS '73 GTV; 6-speed 3.45 litre 24v Street 164 LS/Super; '06 Scion XB - Runs!
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05-14-2007, 10:17 PM
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I don't think it's a bad idea per se. Obviously, it works with the Miata Spec, and the E30 group you spoke about.
Alfa owners are a different breed .... this thread, while not completely representative to all Alfa 75/Milano owners worldwide, has about the "right feel" to it  |
05-15-2007, 05:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by junglejustice
The point of a spec series is EXACTLY NOT to have a "points" system... Cars are all supposed to be equal....
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But the NASA Spec Focus series figured out a way to allow the 2.0L, 2.3L and SVT models to all compete equally. With that in mind we could probably figure out a way to get the Milanos, GTV6s and Alfettas to all turn equal(ish) laptimes. I guess this would technically betray your "point" of a spec series, but again it might be better to bend the traditional formula a bit in order to make sure the idea comes to fruition.
Maybe it couldbe more of an Alfa Racing Series with different "Spec" formulas for each transaxle variant, all of which yeild a similarly performing car?
Have you begun to think about the technical specs you'd like to implement?
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James
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05-15-2007, 09:09 AM
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I know someone who races Spec E30. I am going to see if I can get him or someone he knows in E30 to contribute to this thread re basic rules/points/handicaps/formula, etc.
Assuming it is OK for a BMW guy to enter? 
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05-15-2007, 11:03 AM
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Useful: http://www.nasaproracing.com/rules.html
I have emailed the Spec E30 man. Perhaps he'll post up.
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