Unknown Carrozzeria 6C2500. - Page 5

2000 touring sp · #61 (**permalink**) 12-11-2005, 08:21 AM

thanks Boudewijn for clearing this up. It was not this way to find the missing third chassis of the Gilco/Cabi-Cattaneo. But where is this third chassis???

dretceterini · #62 (**permalink**) 12-12-2005, 07:40 AM

There seems to be 3 fairly distict shapes to the doors. The two-tone car has one shape, most of the photso show the doors as on the photo just below the two-tone car, and the 6c3000-C50 seems to have less of a crease in the doors.

It is pure speculation, but my belief that the car never raced with the body as on the two-tone cars.

Records seem to indicate there was a total of 3 6c2500 Competitziones; one of which was converted to the 6c3000-50....and that one of the other 6c2500 Competitziones had body mofications at a later date, including hood louvers and a new grille shape.

All this leads me to an idea that perhaps more than 3 chassis were involved, but I have no evidence.

As to Gilco, I belive the only cars with Gilco chassis are the 6c2500 Ghia (now Fench blue) and the pre-Disco 1900 based car that looks something like the 6c3000-CM Supercortemaggiore spider.

Gilco may have provided the tubing for other chassis, but I don't think they constructed them.

I still have no idea excatly what the car is that started this thread, but I don't think it's an Alfa. It also looks to be too early to be Fiat 1400 based, as the 1400s didn't come out until 1950...so what is it?

I'm also not sure that the Riva/Lurani car show in the circa 1950 Concours photos is indeed the car Tucker owns (owned?) It may just be the angle of the photos, but they don't look to be the same car to me.

As to CABI-Cattaneo, I belive they did the chassis (possably with tubing from Gilco) for the Lurani/Riva concours car, and for the Plate/Alfa sports racer also owned by Tucker, but I have not seen any evidence they actually built any other chassis.

Boudewijn · #63 (**permalink**) 12-12-2005, 08:32 AM

[quote=dretceterini]There seems to be 3 fairly distict shapes to the doors. The two-tone car has one shape, most of the photso show the doors as on the photo just below the two-tone car, and the 6c3000-C50 seems to have less of a crease in the doors.

It is pure speculation, but my belief that the car never raced with the body as on the two-tone cars.

Records seem to indicate there was a total of 3 6c2500 Competitziones; one of which was converted to the 6c3000-50....and that one of the other 6c2500 Competitziones had body mofications at a later date, including hood louvers and a new grille shape.

All this leads me to an idea that perhaps more than 3 chassis were involved, but I have no evidence.

QUOTE]

The two tone car was identified by Bruno Binini, test driver in those days, as #92001. It was the not yet finished prototype of the Competizione. Later Henry Wessels from old fotographic glassplates in the Alfa archive could read the S/N was indeed 92001. This prototype, as confirmed by Arese, was the same car Sanesi had driven to an accident in the 1948 Mille Miglia. This was confirmed by a rare photo, which I now share, where the rear of the Sanesi car is exactly the same as the "bicolore" car. Before the Mille Miglia, on 30 April 1948, the car was involved in a accident with a streetcar with Franco Venturi, the official first owner, at the steering wheel. The damage was repaired two days later when Snaesi appeared at the start of the Mille Miglia.
It was an ebarressment for Alfa Romeo when Sanesi crashed the car that was sold to Venturi. The car was later rebodied with the same body that was put on Rol's car #92002.

dretceterini · #64 (**permalink**) 12-12-2005, 11:11 AM

Are you saying that car #1047 (as above) raced in the 1948 Mille Miglia with the doors the same as in the photo of the two-tone car, after the crash with the streetcar?...or were they changed before the race? There seem to be no photos of #1047 just before the race or after the crash that show how the doors looked.

2000 touring sp · #65 (**permalink**) 12-12-2005, 12:04 PM

Thank you for opening up Dr.
Quote:As to Gilco, I belive the only cars with Gilco chassis are the 6c2500 Ghia (now Fench blue) and the pre-Disco 1900 based car that looks something like the 6c3000-CM Supercortemaggiore spider
What is the pre- Disco and who build it???
Re the French Blue I gave the following reef earlier in this tread, regarding Ghia.
http://www.sportscarmarket.com/profi.../Alfa%20Romeo/
at that time you gave in, that this reef, was not always a fully reliable source.

dretceterini · #66 (**permalink**) 12-12-2005, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2000 touring sp

Thank you for opening up Dr.
Quote:As to Gilco, I belive the only cars with Gilco chassis are the 6c2500 Ghia (now Fench blue) and the pre-Disco 1900 based car that looks something like the 6c3000-CM Supercortemaggiore spider
What is the pre- Disco and who build it???
Re the French Blue I gave the following reef earlier in this tread, regarding Ghia.
http://www.sportscarmarket.com/profi.../Alfa%20Romeo/
at that time you gave in, that this reef, was not always a fully reliable source.

Boudewijn · #67 (**permalink**) 12-12-2005, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dretceterini

Are you saying that car #1047 (as above) raced in the 1948 Mille Miglia with the doors the same as in the photo of the two-tone car, after the crash with the streetcar?...or were they changed before the race? There seem to be no photos of #1047 just before the race or after the crash that show how the doors looked.

dretceterini · #68 (**permalink**) 12-12-2005, 12:54 PM

In the 1948 MM, race #20 is also supposed to be a 6c2500 Competitzione, but I have not found any photos. There is also a race entry #31, listed as a 6c2500 (what type?) of which I have never found photos.

2000 touring sp · #69 (**permalink**) 12-12-2005, 12:55 PM

Sorry Dr, I have no reason to offend you. My concern is the 3 Gilco chassis on witch we know the Riva and the Colli, and I have the sincere hope that with the tremendous knowledge of you people , and you personally, can help in the question where is the third one.
You question led me to believe that it could be the Ghia one, that was the third chassis.

dretceterini · #70 (**permalink**) 12-12-2005, 02:24 PM

No offense taken. I am not sure any of the cars you mention has a Gilco chassis, other than the Ghia bodied car, and I am questioning it...not saying that you are wrong.

2000 touring sp · #71 (**permalink**) 12-12-2005, 11:39 PM

Maybe I am to hasty, when I state Gilco, I am referring to the 3 Gilco/Cabi-Cattaneo chassis that vas produced with the initiatives by Lurani . Three we have the Riva and the Colli, and there is the proposal from Touring, to witch I suppose there was a chassis.
If Touring didn't use this chassis it must be someway around. It can be a possibility that it went to Ghia to be used for the French blue.
I have inquired by Peter Marshal regarding any info about these 3 chassis.

2000 touring sp · #72 (**permalink**) 12-27-2005, 03:52 AM

I found this picture of a Alfa Romeo 6C2500 built by Bertone in design of Mario Revelli de Beaumont on chassis 915516. I don't know where to put it so it is placed here, but the ladies at that drove Alfa Romeo at time did look as bountiful as those we se today.
What puzzled me is the is the text in the building besides the car Scuderia Automobilistica Milan.
Is there anybody that knows anything about that company, was Biondetti one of the drivers.
Happy New Year to everyone

dretceterini · #73 (**permalink**) 12-27-2005, 07:57 AM

They were a club/racing team like Scuderia Ambrosiana. I don't know if Biondetti was a member, and there is very little on them published anywhere, except perhaps in period magazines, etc. FYI, there is a hand made model of that Bertone 6c2500 coupe available in 1/43rd scale with a public price of about 125 Euros.

Boudewijn · #74 (**permalink**) 12-27-2005, 01:26 PM

This is how #915.516 looks today. Its for sale.

2000 touring sp · #75 (**permalink**) 12-27-2005, 03:36 PM

Where you also in Essen in 2003