Unknown Carrozzeria 6C2500.

[dretceterini]

Sorry, but I do not have any answers; only more questons.

[rap]

Sorry about my absense.I suppose I have have misspoken when I said '3 cars were built'.3 cars were planned to be built,2 cars were actually built.Also,I did not mean to imply that these 2-or-3 cars were to be Riva cars.Each of the 3 were to be different.Laurani's tdf,the Riva was built and the second car by Colli can be seen on page 217 of the Anselmi book.The unbuilt car was the Touring bodied car seen on page 215 of the Anselmi book.This car may not have been fully sanctioned by Touring.
The chassis were built by Gilco.I may have misspoken when I said the engines were 'built by Cattaneo'.I probably should have said that the engines were 'supplied by Cattaneo'.
I find it curious that I see mention that 'on the Bob Tucker mystery car' the door ends before the rear fender.That is not true,you need to look closer at whatever photos you have.Bob tucker's car is for sure the Laurani/Riva car.

[gtv2000]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rap I find it curious that I see mention that 'on the Bob Tucker mystery car' the door ends before the rear fender.That is not true,you need to look closer at whatever photos you have.Bob tucker's car is for sure the Laurani/Riva car.

[2000 touring sp]

Thank you rap, but I liked the idea of 3 in a row.
Looking at the picture of the Riva car, the line of shape/profile of the rear fender goes into the door, we are able to se the line between door and fender , and the distance between the rear fender line of shape/profile and the door handle is very narrow, and the line of shape/profile of the front fender seems to go almost trough the door site to the door handle.
On the picture of Bob tucker car, the only picture I have seen,thou there is a shadow on the side, but the light reflect on the surface that turns toward the camera.
There it seems that the distance between the line of shape/profile of rear fender on door handle is larger than on the Riva car. And the line of shape / profile of the front fender don't reach onto the door handle, I would expect that the light would reflect these lines if they ***** there.It is diff.on the picture to se the line between the door and the fenders, but there is a black dot in the window frame and with a good will there can be a line following the dot onto the side soft the car. I this really is the door /fender line?
Admittedly the basic for this evaluating is very poor as the camera distance for the pictures is different on these pictures, and the light under witch the pictures was taken is so different, that it can lead to the shape of the cars looks different.
Interesting with the information , that Colli and Touring should have bodied the 2 other frames of Gilco
As you seems to be very well informed about these 3 cars with Gilco chassis,and in particular you knowledge with the Bob Tucker car, It would be very interesting , my wishful thinking, if we could have a suitable picture of the Bob Tucker car for further elevation.

But where do we then levee Carlos mystery car with the Riva front, is it an Alfa Romeo at all????

[dretceterini]

If you look closely, there is a diamond shaped badge in the middle of the grille on Calos' mystery car. Could be possably be a Borgward, with some odd Swiss or German coachwork?

[rap]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2000 touring sp Thank you rap, but I liked the idea of 3 in a row. Looking at the picture of the Riva car, the line of shape/profile of the rear fender goes into the door, we are able to se the line between door and fender , and the distance between the rear fender line of shape/profile and the door handle is very narrow, and the line of shape/profile of the front fender seems to go almost trough the door site to the door handle. On the picture of Bob tucker car, the only picture I have seen,thou there is a shadow on the side, but the light reflect on the surface that turns toward the camera. There it seems that the distance between the line of shape/profile of rear fender on door handle is larger than on the Riva car. And the line of shape / profile of the front fender don't reach onto the door handle, I would expect that the light would reflect these lines if they ***** there.It is diff.on the picture to se the line between the door and the fenders, but there is a black dot in the window frame and with a good will there can be a line following the dot onto the side soft the car. I this really is the door /fender line? Admittedly the basic for this evaluating is very poor as the camera distance for the pictures is different on these pictures, and the light under witch the pictures was taken is so different, that it can lead to the shape of the cars looks different. Interesting with the information , that Colli and Touring should have bodied the 2 other frames of Gilco As you seems to be very well informed about these 3 cars with Gilco chassis,and in particular you knowledge with the Bob Tucker car, It would be very interesting , my wishful thinking, if we could have a suitable picture of the Bob Tucker car for further elevation. But where do we then levee Carlos mystery car with the Riva front, is it an Alfa Romeo at all????

[gtv2000]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rap Just to reply to your observation concerning this Carlos mystery car....I seriously doubt that the car shown in your photos is an Alfa Romeo.The rim size is wrong for the era and i don't recall a Left-Hand-Drive version either.However,the car certainly posseses the Riva style....probably a Fiat.

[2000 touring sp]

Re rap´s statement on the 3 build, the Riva, the Colli, the Touring. As I understand Aselmis comment, my Italian is only to be interpretive, to the Touring one ,then it can be questioned whether it was actually build. I find it naturally if it wasn't build by Touring. Touring was known for there Superleggera frames. If Touring accepted to build Bodies to a frame that was produced by a "competitor" it could turn bad for the Touring image and the business. I think that the proposal from Touring was based on the fact that Touring also should build frame for there own body.
If the Touring one was not build, where can we then find the frame, can that be the Carlo mystery car, or Bob Tuckers car , witch I still think differs from what we know as the Riva car.

[2000 touring sp]

Another picture of the Riva, where it is easier to se the line between the door and the rear fender.

[carlo]

I don't have the intention to hijack the thread, but I would like to add some photos of another 6C with an interesting body.
The car was offered by http://www.stefano-paracchi.com/ some time ago.

Sorry for the quality of the photos




The Alfa was used in the "Giro d'Italia" as support and team car, carrying spare parts and spare bikes.

Was this Alfa later modified to a pick-up?
Or was it a pick-up from the first day, and who built it then?
In my opinion, an Alfa as pack-@ss in a cycling race must have been a demonstration of status...

Best regards
Ciao Carlo

[2000 touring sp]

Hi Carlo , nice to se you have regain surface in relations to this forum.
No hijack, the head in this tread has wide room for interpretations, and I expect that you have noticed , I have been borough from you fields.
Customised cars, to of the carrozzeria I am aware of customised cares is Bianchi and Beneschi, its my impression that is was there main business up in the 50 . So my I propose that you look in that line.
regarding Beneschi, one of the customised I like very much, is this 6C2500 Freccia d´Dor , The large rear window make it a completely other car in my eyes.
In connection with bicycle races in the southern Europe , the first that comes I a caravan of customers build cars , as a rolling advertisement , prior to the cycle competitors. Like this 6c2500 advertising for soft drink and the Giulietta for tooth past, its from carrozzeria Introzzi

[2000 touring sp]

If I my revert to the 3 Gilco/Cabi-Cattaneo chassis . Did these chassis have the geometric lay out as the normal 6C2500. Or what was the track with and the axle distance on the Gilco chassis???

The 6C2500SS had Track with Front 1450 Rear 1470 Axle dist.2700 all in millimetres .
The Freccia dÓre 1460 1480 not given
6C2500 Competizione 1350 1300 2500
6C3000 C50 1350 1300 2500
All figures according to Fusi
What puzzles me, is the missing chassis that was offered to Touring. In some reef, the C50 is stated as to be on an experimental chassis, not according to Fusi.
The Touring Superleggera book, don't give any space for the C50, thou it was build by Touring, according to my knowledge.
If any one have the knowledge of these dimensions of the geometry of the Gilco chassis or can confirm that the C50 was build on the 6C2500 Competizione chassis, I will be obliged

[Boudewijn]

The C50 Touring body with 3 litre engine was built on Competizione chassisno.#1, after #1's crash in the 1948 Mille Miglia. This means C50 had an original Competizione chassis.

[2000 touring sp]

Sorry Boudewijn. But the C50 was first build in 1950, in one example, to my knowledge by Touring
The 6c2500 Competizione came in 1946 and was build in 2 or 3 examples, and the first chassis must relate one of these.
There is a slight difference in the design of these 2 models

[dretceterini]

Anselmi's 6c2500 book seems to agree with Boudewijn; that the 6c3000-C50 was built on one of the 6c2500 Competitizione chassis, as was simply an upadte of the older car, rather than an all new one. The only Gilco chassis car I am aware of is the one with the Ghia body. The Riva car has a chassis by CABI-Cattaneo, and not Gilco (although Gilco probably provided the tubing)