AC/Power Steering Serpentine Belt - '91 S4 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums

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post #1 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-01-2015, 04:15 PM Thread Starter
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AC/Power Steering Serpentine Belt - '91 S4

I imagine this has been discussed, but was unable to find a thread, so my apology if this is "old" subject....

When I operate the AC on my Spider, the belt slips at low RPM (Likely also slipping at higher RPM, but don't notice the resistance in steering effort at speeds above 25-30 mph). The adjustment is maxed out, so I purchased a new belt . . . . part # 25-050570 from NAPA which fits, but also slips. Once again the adjustment is maxed out, I can't do any better than maybe .5"-.75" deflection of the belt. I tried the next shorter belt from NAPA, but it's absolutely too short. Lengths are 1462mm (Too long) . . . and 1338mm (Too short) . . . .

I've owned the car for a bit less than a year, and previous owner said he had AC charged, and it seems to operate as designed . . (Blows cold air without drama or noise). I'm beginning to suspect that a new belt was installed at the time of service and recharge. (The one I changed out thinking the belt was worn rather than too long as it now appears.)

Now for my question:
Is there a U.S. domestic belt that is intermediate length that will work better. Also, is it possible that folks who serviced the system "overcharged" creating excessive torque requirement at the compressor?
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post #2 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-01-2015, 04:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldblokesbro View Post
part # 25-050570 from NAPA which fits, but also slips. Once again the adjustment is maxed out
That is the correct belt number.

Can you show us what you mean by "adjustment is maxed out"?

My belt was also slipping. I found the grooves in the AC pulley and the crankshaft pulley were full of crap!

Here is the before and after of the AC pulley and crankshaft pulley.

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Name:  Crankshaft pulley.jpg
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Once I cleaned them up, no more slipping.

Good luck,

Vin

1991 Spider Veloce - Red on Tan - Rosa Bionda
1987 Spider Quadrifoglio - Red on Grey - Rosa - Sold
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post #3 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-01-2015, 05:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldblokesbro View Post
The adjustment is maxed out
Found this picture when I was doing an engine clean up.

This shows the adjustment height. See the large bolt on the right side, roughly half way up the adjustment groove.

Name:  Front after.jpg
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Are you saying your bolt is at the very bottom of the slot?


Vin

1991 Spider Veloce - Red on Tan - Rosa Bionda
1987 Spider Quadrifoglio - Red on Grey - Rosa - Sold
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post #4 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-01-2015, 05:41 PM Thread Starter
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I'm still novice enough I won't try to post a photo, however when the belt is tightened, the bolt is up solid against the bottom of the adjustment slot. I will uses some cleaner and clean out the groves, to see if that makes the belt any "stickier".

By the way . . for future reference . . . when I attach a photo here, is it necessary to dial back the resolution on photo settings? Or going thru a 3rd party (Photo Bucket maybe).

Thanks for your replies
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post #5 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-01-2015, 05:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldblokesbro View Post
I'm still novice enough I won't try to post a photo, however when the belt is tightened, the bolt is up solid against the bottom of the adjustment slot. I will uses some cleaner and clean out the groves, to see if that makes the belt any "stickier".

By the way . . for future reference . . . when I attach a photo here, is it necessary to dial back the resolution on photo settings? Or going thru a 3rd party (Photo Bucket maybe).

Thanks for your replies
If the bolt is up against the bottom of the slot, either you do not have the route correct or you might be missing the idler.

Here is a picture of the idler. It is the silver wheel in between the ac pulley and the crankshaft pulley.

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Here is the route. I suspect you did not route the belt around the idler. The belt goes from the bottom of the ac pulley, up and over the idler, down under the crankshaft pulley, up and over the power steering pulley, back to the ac pulley.

Name:  Screen Shot 2014-07-22 at 7.49.05 PM.png
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Good luck,

Vin

1991 Spider Veloce - Red on Tan - Rosa Bionda
1987 Spider Quadrifoglio - Red on Grey - Rosa - Sold
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post #6 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-01-2015, 05:54 PM
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The jpeg size 249.0 KB 700 max width, I shot 640x480 for using BB software.

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post #7 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-01-2015, 06:05 PM
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Here is a better picture of the route.

Name:  Belt Route.jpg
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Vin

1991 Spider Veloce - Red on Tan - Rosa Bionda
1987 Spider Quadrifoglio - Red on Grey - Rosa - Sold
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post #8 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-01-2015, 06:58 PM Thread Starter
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Following the helpful advice from this Forum . . . I've been out in the garage and #1. Double checked serpentine routing - is "OK" . . .#2. Check for build-up and residue in the machined slots on the pulleys - "OK" . . . . #3 Check deflection at location indicated . . . deflection is in the range of 20.320mm - 25.400mm (Excessive) . . . #4. Took some photos, adjusted resolution and will now attempt to attach.

[IMG] 1766[/IMG]

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post #9 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-01-2015, 07:09 PM
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To post a picture:

1. Click Reply or New Thread as appropriate. That brings up the familiar text box to type in your reply. Above the reply box you will see an icon for a paperclip. Click that.
2. Click on Manage Attachements. A new box will appear titled "Manage Attachments." Click on Browse.
3. Find the file on your computer's hard drive that you want to attach to your reply. Double click on it or select and click Open. That box will disappear and the previous on will show the file uploading to the ALFA BB server. It may take a few seconds to upload, depending on the speed on your connection.
4. This will return you to the main "Reply" and click the paperclip again and your attachment's file name will appear there, but the picture will not actually show in the text box.
5. Click Submit Reply and you're done.

1991 Spider Veloce - Red on Tan - Rosa Bionda
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post #10 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-01-2015, 07:47 PM
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Maybe the belt itself is the wrong length?

I keep a spare and just measured it.

When doubled the belt is 28.5" long.

Just thinking.

Vin

1991 Spider Veloce - Red on Tan - Rosa Bionda
1987 Spider Quadrifoglio - Red on Grey - Rosa - Sold
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post #11 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-01-2015, 08:49 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks Vin . . . I'm also thinking the belts too long. It measures closely to 28.5" when doubled, but as you can see by the photos, the upper hydraulic line is uncomfortably stressed. I can't see what may be peculiar about my Spider, but I'd like to find a belt that is 20mm - 40mm shorter than the ones I've got.
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post #12 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-01-2015, 10:40 PM
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Something is just not right.

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post #13 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-02-2015, 08:15 AM
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How are your motor mounts?

I know the picture on the left is on a bit of an angle, and our engines are designed to be on a slight angle towards the driver side, but yours looks to be too much.

If your motor mounts are shot, the whole engine will be low and could cause this.

The driver side mount is easily accessible for a picture.

Could you post a picture of that?

Vin

1991 Spider Veloce - Red on Tan - Rosa Bionda
1987 Spider Quadrifoglio - Red on Grey - Rosa - Sold
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post #14 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-02-2015, 05:41 PM Thread Starter
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Hello again . . . Here is a photo of Driver Side Motor mount, however it appears in good order. I will look to see if I can find a full picture of the Engine bay to get the decent perspective . . . . if the engine is not sitting at the correct angle, or not.

By the way, I spent some time today researching and found a slightly shorter Gates Belt, but ordered the Alfa Belt from I.A.P. Should be here Thursday and it's dimensions were shorter than the NAPA Belt.
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post #15 of 35 (permalink) Old 06-02-2015, 06:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldblokesbro View Post
Hello again . . . Here is a photo of Driver Side Motor mount, however it appears in good order. I will look to see if I can find a full picture of the Engine bay to get the decent perspective . . . . if the engine is not sitting at the correct angle, or not.

By the way, I spent some time today researching and found a slightly shorter Gates Belt, but ordered the Alfa Belt from I.A.P. Should be here Thursday and it's dimensions were shorter than the NAPA Belt.
Motor mount looks ok. Certainly not so deformed so much to cause the issue.

Engine bay looks nice.

It's so strange because I use the Gates belt with the same part number and the same length.

Let us know how it works out.

It's still bugging me to figure out what is going on.

Good luck,

Vin

1991 Spider Veloce - Red on Tan - Rosa Bionda
1987 Spider Quadrifoglio - Red on Grey - Rosa - Sold
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