Choke control for Weber carbs

[norm_86veloce]

My GTV2000 has been converted from Spica to Webers; however, the car was originally a CA car that was always kept in warm climates so the previous owner(s) apparently did not need to install a hand choke. I have the car in PA where you normally choke carburetorated cars in cold weather. I identified the choke attachments on the carbs and installed an after-market choke cable but it seems to have little effect on starting cold. Any suggestions? I presume Euro GTVs had choke cables on carburetorated setups. If so, where was the stock choke cable mounted in the cockpit and are originals available?

[rafael]

In my 1971 gtv 2000 there are two handles on the left side of the dashboard, one for the hand gas, and the other for the shoke. In the USA, the two handles are replaced by a single big handle for hand gas only

[norm_86veloce]

That makes perfect sense. I guess I should start looking for the Euro handles to replace my one big handle to get the proper setup. In fact, when I looked at my handle, it appears to have a seam in the center. I thought it was cracked from age or use but it may be the same handle fixed together for the US version. I would still need the choke cable. I'll look at the rear of my handle more carefully and see if it might have been designed dual-purpose for both Euro & US markets. BTW, I am somewhat familiar with Eindhoven. My mother-in-law lives in Heino (near Raalte) and her sister used to live in Eindhoven. My sister-in-law lives in Epe. Thanks.

[JeffM]

I speak from experience - you can retrofit the dual handles (throttle & choke) into a later US market car that only has the larger single throttle handle. I did this a couple of years ago. My '74 GTV was just like yours - converted to carbs from SPICA years ago in Texas, but I was living in New England and wanted to choke it once in a while.
I don't recall for sure, but I got one of the handles on Ebay and the other NOS from Italy (which was pretty expensive). I was also able to get the various nuts, bolts with cross holes, etc to complete the assembly in original fashion from the Italian source. I don't know if I bought a choke cable from Italy or just used a generic one from an auto parts place. The hardest part is getting the cables and levers located and tightened into place under the dash - there's very little room and you're basically standing on your head under the steering wheel. Have a good light source handy and lots of patience.
One note of caution - it seems that different markets had the choke on left or right of the pair of levers. You need to be sure to buy a pair of handles that mate (ie it's possible to end up with a throttle and choke lever that are both for the left position). I made very good use of the exploded parts diagrams for the GTV from my CarDisc CD, especially when ordering from Italy.

[Alfajay]

Two comments:

The early US delivery 105 Alfas had the 2 handle choke/throttle controls. Those cars that were sold in the States from '65 to '67 came with Webers, and had individual levers for the choke and throttle. My point is that you don't need to send to Europe to get these parts.

Bicycle stores sell brake/shifter cable by the foot. This makes great choke and throttle cables. The black sheath looks very similar to the original cables that Alfa supplied, and the inner cable is teflon coated (or something-coated) and operates very smoothly. And, by Alfa standards, the stuff is cheap!

[norm_86veloce]

JeffM, No lie about standing on your head under the dash - I spent part of my weekend doing that. However, great info and thanks!

Alfajay, Also great suggestions, especially about bicycle shifter cables.

However, I may have fallen off the choke idea for now. After installing an AutoZone choke conversion cable with little or no improvement in cold starting, I posted my question on AlfaBB as well as the British counterpart, Alfaowner.com. The responses I got from Alfaowner.com were interesting: a) the choke levers on Webers are reportedly not chokes in the classic sense at all - they're enrichment levers with which there apparently is the possibility that the enrichment circuits are gummed up and not functioning as designed and b) The gist of all the suggestions were to merely pump the throttle or use different throttle combinations, like several quick pumps and then starting with the throttle cracked open slightly. I had intuitively been doing that but thought I was being hard on the battery and starter so I jumped to the conclusion that I needed to attach a cable to the enrichment levers for an added bump for cold starting. Since my car had been in CA, Mexico & TX it's whole life, I figured the previous owners had no need for a choke and, therefore, just hadn't bothered when the car was converted to Webers. The Brits admitted they didn't know how cold it got in PA. Thanks again for your opinions and insights - I'm considering my options, waiting for spring and moving on to other issues to get my car as good as possible before the weather breaks.

[JeffM]

I actually agree with the pump gas then start practice. I've heard that as well from other sources, and it works well for me. In fact, since making the dual lever conversion for my choke I have probably only used it once or twice. Properly set up Webers aren't that hard to start with careful use of the gas pedal and a little warm up time before beginning to drive. Granted, my car is always kept in a garage and not driven in the wet snowy season, so you may have different experiences.

I mainly undertook the dual lever conversion because a previous owner had installed an aftermarket choke and mounted it on the face of the dash just left of the glove box. So I already had a choke cable, just not in a very attractive or ergonomic location. If you don't have one yet, I wouldn't bother with all this work.

[norm_86veloce]

JeffM, I already bought a cheap auto choke conversion kit from AutoZone (about $6) so nothing much ventured. I hooked it up but didn't mount it. I tested it but it didn't have any noticable effect. Based on other advice, I am falling off the choke idea now and removing it. I'm concentrating on more pressing issues. Thanks again.

[PSk]

Never needed a choke ever with twin choke Webers/Delortos ... a couple of big pumps and you just about drown the engine in petrol anyway, plus their throttle response is so good it is dead easy to keep a motor running.

I ofcourse will install the choke on my car, but I bet I never use it . Ofcourse it does not snow in Sydney ...

Best
Pete

[ill_will]

The enrichment circuits are very crude. The only time I tried to use them (when i first got my car) I flooded it and had to take all the plugs out to dry them off. a pain in the ***.

It's worth checking that the enrichment pistons aren't sticking/jammed and that they're correctly seated to avoid fuel dripping through. One of mine was jammed half open, causing a leak.

The four-quick-pumps-and-a-bit-of-hand-throttle technique works fine, it was below freezing every day for a couple of weeks here and the car starts on the third try every time despite sitting all week.

w