1750 engine into a Sprint 750B 1959

[Gordon Raymond]

Same idea, but much different Chris. Also probably a simpler solution to your problem. Centerlines are machined, not cast, and have an angular drop built in. Let's see if I can photo them from the catalog...oh yea!
Gordon Raymond

[Subtle]

Thought I'd add that with the CL mounts and the tilt and all--the small Nippon Denso alternator fits. . Puts out some 48 amps, compared to the old Lucas at 28 amps.

This also puts some juice at low rpm so I got the rad fan from CL and will soon instal it. Will be effective at town speeds.

[Tacconi]

Hello
Yesterday I got the alternator, and tryed to fit it, no chance, I must have the engine about 1,3/4 inch. ( ca 4 cm) over to the carburator side to get it clear of the steering box, but then I am not sure if the exhaust manifoild will hit the brake cylinder, I can not see any solution for this yet, I can not lower the engine then the cranck shaft pully will hit the crossmember.
I have taken a photos showing the clearence between the engine and the steering box, can anyone confirme if this looks normale?
Regards
Chris

[Gordon Raymond]

Chris,
I could be wrong on this, but unless you have a strange double pulley, or the trans mount is incorrect, the pulley should move down and back behind that cross member with room to spare. you may not have the bell housing low enough to clear the body's bell housing hump. The 1750 engine is the same length as the 1600, and I know that fits. I have also put 1750's in a Sprint Speciale with no fit issues. ANY chance the chassis was altered for the previous non Alfa engine? Also, your alternator is too large for the existing space. You WILL need one of the little ones as Subtle has suggested. I have seen several installations of this, I believe, Japanese unit, and being no larger than the generator it replaces, it slips right in there. However, unless you NEED the extra electrical power, there is nothing wrong with the 1600 Bosch generator, which again, was made to fit, and fit perfectly in my SS. I will try to send a picture of the correct relationship between the stock front crossmember and pulley a little later. Gordon Raymond

[Tacconi]

Hello Gordon
I hope you are wrong on this one ( i know ) I have seen other photos of pully beeing over the crossmember.
I can not se any where there have been altered on the chassi for putting in another engine.
I have been measuring the space between the engine mounts compered with the manual and it looks ok, also between the the steering box and the idler box mounting, may be there is a misalignment here for about 0,5 cm ( about 1/5 inch.) .
I have attache some photos of the pully, the rear of the engine, and the alternator it is about 4 inch in diameter, and about 6 inch between the mounting holes, it is small ! but I do not know if it is small enough.
I would have mounted an orginal dynamo if I had one, anyone know if it is the same dynamo on the Gt 1300 junior Bertone?
I have decided to buy the mounts from centerline.

Thanks for everyone's input! This BB group is a tremendous resource!

Regards
Chris

[Alfajay]

Tacconi:

Your engine looks to be positioned properly in the fore-aft dimension. I took a look at my Giulia spider, and yes, the pulley is right above the crossmember. You can just make out the red crossmember in the picture below. Gordon's may be thinking of a 105 chassis, where the pulley is behind the crossmember, or perhaps his SS is different from your Sprint. The clearance between the rear of your block and the firewall looks correct as well.

The alternator in your picture looks big to me. The mounting tab is some distance below the centerline of the pulley. Take a look at the Denso alternator pictured in my thread about alternator conversions, as well as in the photos below - it is much more compact. I'm sorry that I don't have a part number for this alternator.

Alfa used the same generators on the 101's as on the 105's. So yes, a generator from a 1300 GT Jr. would be the same as the one that originally came with your car. If you can even borrow one, try mounting it, and see if it will clear - from your photos, it looks like it will. The small Denso alternator basicly fits into the same space (although it doesn't extend back as far; ie., an alternator is shorter than a generator).

Here are a couple of pictures of my car - unfortunately with the radiator in place, it is difficult to show the area that you are interested in.

Hope that helps!

[Gordon Raymond]

Jay is correct. I took the same pictures as he has, with the same problem getting the camera to look in there. On the 101 chassis, with the correct pulley, there is 50.9 mm between the bottom of the pulley and the crossmember. thats about 2 inches. The correct pulley is # 105 00 02 102 03, and is about 4 inches in diameter, 103 mm. Jay is also correct as to the generators. There were several Bosch units, but they all measure the same, at least the three I measured were the same. Here are my pictures to go with Jays.
With 2 inches under the pulley, lowering the engine using centerlines mounts will not drop it that much. There is room. Jays alternator is the photo I remember. He has sourced the correct unit, as can be seen in his great photo's. Thanks Jay! Gordon Raymond

[Tacconi]

Hello
Thank you for all the photos!
I have a friend who have a dynamo, I am going to borrow it and try, I hope it is not to deep that it will interfere with the oil filter behind, I have just ordered a Spin-on adapter from Hurlock Engeneering, for 1750 in 101 chassi.
I will also order the Centerline mounts today
So It still might be a chance
Regards
Chris

[Alfajay]

Tacconi: You had asked: "I have a friend who have a dynamo, I am going to borrow it and try, I hope it is not to deep that it will interfere with the oil filter behind, I have just ordered a Spin-on adapter from Hurlock Engeneering, for 1750 in 101 chassis"

This is one area where I am confident that you will NOT have a problem. The Hurlock spin-on filter occupies the same space as the cannister filter. The first photo that I posted on 24 January shows the left side of my 1600 engine - that is a Hurlock spin-on filter behind the alternator.

Of course, there is a hitch (there's always a hitch when you are doing a conversion) - you are installing a 1750, and as I recall, the cartridge filters used on the 105 chassis extended out further from the engine than did the cartridges on the 101 chassis. You may need to cut a notch out of your block and oil pan to allow the canister to "hug" the block more closely so that it will clear the frame rail. You may want to study that first photo in my last post - see how there is a "U" shaped cut-out in the block & oilpan to clear the oil filter. This cut-out was done by the factory on the 101's - again, the cartridge and spin-on filters are the same size (i.e., I didn't need to make the cut-out to accommodate the spin-on filter).

[Tacconi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gordon Raymond Jay is correct. I took the same pictures as he has, with the same problem getting the camera to look in there. On the 101 chassis, with the correct pulley, there is 50.9 mm between the bottom of the pulley and the crossmember. thats about 2 inches. The correct pulley is # 105 00 02 102 03, and is about 4 inches in diameter, 103 mm.

[Gordon Raymond]

Hi Chris,
The small pulley pictured is from a 1600. Use caution here. The 1300 101 pulley is the same size, but uses a wider belt. I have also seen some 1750's, I believe VERY early production, that use the smaller 1600 105 pulley. Cast into the correct pulley is a part number that begins with 105. The actual part number is 105.00.02.102.03. There is another that will work, from a SS, with the number 101.21.02.102.00. Never having compared these two side by side, I believe they differ in timing marks only. It is unlikely you will find a SS 101 pulley. As far as timing marks, I degree them myself, as 1600 Std. & Veloce have different distributors, and as such, different timing. I do not know which distributor you are using on your 1750, but the marks will need to be adjusted to the ignition timing of that particular unit. Gordon Raymond

[ESjaavik]

Hi Chris!

Your rubber mounts does not look remotely like mine. They are about the size of a small pack of goat cheese with rounded corners. And there is no torque reaction rods on it. Still with the very tight clearance to the steering box it very seldom touches as evidenced by just some slight marks. I'll measure the diameter of the pulley tomorrow and try to take pictures that shows the mounts better than those I already sent you (assuming you are the same Chris I PM'ed on Cuoresportivo). It will be easier as I have taken out more of the stuff that hide the mounts. I can also measure the mounts and rubbers when I get the engine out, which will be pretty soon now.

I can measure the crank centerline to crossmember height and left/right position too. Any other measurements you'd like? Call me on 9068 0980 after 16:00 Sat/Sun "fisketorget" time zone. That's when it's most likely I'll be with the car. Or call me any time between 09:00 and midnight for a GPP.

It's OK to move the crank centerline up/down or left/right as long as you make sure the new centerline is parallel to the old one, and you move the intermediate bearing the same amount. This will be the most difficult one.
You should also avoid the crank and the differential input shaft being on the same centerline. They must be parallel however.

It seems to me that the engine can be tilted more than mine without any issues with the cast iron exhaust manifolds. Actually I think it should be to get more space for air entry to the carbs. But mine is a 1600 so your mileage may vary. And a 1600 with 2x40DCOE is fast enough to surprise a lot of drivers in new cars! ;-)

And for the pulley, try to contact Giulietta-Sprint He have a lot of old engines and parts. A problem is he have not made a catalogue of them, but try to ask him.

[Tacconi]

Hei Einar
Jeg ringer deg senere i dag.
Mvh Chris

[PSB]

Yet another photo of a 1750+ in my SV. I have room with this Alt. I could not get a photo of my Aluminum.degreed crank pulley
I have to say. I think these new Alt. the guys are talking about are the way to go.. This was done in 1989-90 Lots o Mods