63 giulia ? - Page 2

Steve O · #16 (**permalink**) 10-12-2007, 12:25 PM

Since I have no interest in your car I will shut up and unsubscribe this thread. But only after saying that grunge is not to be confused with patina, and I agree that a car driven an average of 200 miles per year for three decades should be examined closely before purchase.
Good luck with your sale!

davestebs · #17 (**permalink**) 10-12-2007, 01:35 PM

I want to make sure that my last post was not misunderstood. I did not intend to imply that the interior color of John's car is wrong. On my computer screen the color of both the upholstery and the carpet looks right. I am impressed that he was able to duplicate the perforations on the back of the seats. It's also nice that he got the right Weber carb so he could keep the original twin hose air cleaner. The underside is a little better than mine with 48,000 miles. Looks like a nice car to me.

gowanusvin · #18 (**permalink**) 10-12-2007, 02:21 PM

Fellas let's not be so harsh;to the right person it's a great car and worth the dough. I rebuilt my '63 Giulia engine in 82 and have maybe 15,000 miles on the car since, for various reasons, divorce and brakes stand out.

My quibble however is saying the only difference between 1600 Veloce/SS engines and normale engines is carburetor. It's way different. Try one.
Vince

**pathung** · #19 (**permalink**) 10-12-2007, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by john l

i too have been involved with alfas for 30 plus years. the red vinyl is original.
i 'm not some kind of scamer or attempting to misrepresent anything. i am selling a car that i never thought i would ever sell. the red color interior is alfa spec red for this year car as sold in italy. the fotos in road and track mag confirm this color combo and hue. if you want to come and look at the texture, the detailing and the perforation on back side of seats you will see that it is in fact alfa original equipment. if you don't due that, i don't think you should be passing judgement. and your judgement, in my opinion, is inaccurate. and that goes for the bottom side of car as well.

**Zunige** · #20 (**permalink**) 10-13-2007, 01:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pathung

I think that it would help alleviate our collective fear and loathing of scammers if you spelled your words right, capitalized every first letter of a sentence, and took care to learn the correct spelling of the word "Giulia" in your signature (for a 30-year owner this is a bit of a surprise). By the way you write, I'd almost think that I'm reading the writing of a text-happy twenty-something; I must be wrong, as obviously, a twenty-something cannot have been involved with any Alfa for over 30 years...

My two cents.

ecdysiast · #21 (**permalink**) 10-13-2007, 06:26 AM

For reference, this is a picture of my '64 Spider taken in 1965. The seat upholstery (sorry, only a small bit is illuminated) is red. If you can balance the colors up to the true gray, this should give an idea of the correct hue of the upholstery. I didn't record the color temperature of the sunlight, but it was at Point Reyes, CA.

Jeffrey

**pathung** · #22 (**permalink**) 10-13-2007, 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zunige

Wow! What's happening to us? I don't mean to pick on Patrick, and I certainly value his great comments and contributions on this BB, but I think we are going down a dangerous path, with the tone of the posts getting increasingly poignant...

This BB is what we, the members, will make of it. If we want to make this a place to trade insults, instead of information, that's what it will be. There are many very well educated business people that I know who write in a very different style (without capitals, with unconventional abbreviations, unchecked spelling, etc), when they use on-line communication. By the same token, there are people who are simply not good writers. Both types post on this BB, but we don't go around telling them how they should or should not write...

I was not going to join this thread simply because I am interested in this vehicle and didn't think that it would be appropriate for me to offer comments which could be construed as self-serving. However, we seem to keep escalating the tone of the posts, and I think we are allowing misguided (albeit perhaps well-intentioned) momentum to take us over the top. No one is stopping anyone from inspecting this vehicle in person, and no one is trying to con/scam anyone into sending money anywhere. Finally, if anyone must know, the existence of this vehicle and its current owner are known in the northern NJ area, and can be verified by people in the Alfa community of this area all the way back to at least the early 1980s.

Best regards,

**Zunige** · #23 (**permalink**) 10-13-2007, 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pathung

...I'm just a regular BB'er. ....

AlfaBear · #24 (**permalink**) 10-13-2007, 12:48 PM

I believe this is the level of grunge that Steve would consider acceptable for a 63 Giulia. Although this car is a California car it has 83,000 miles on it and has been stored outside for much of it's life. At least during it's 20 years with me. This photo was taken earlier this year before we "cleaned" it up a bit.

john l · #25 (**permalink**) 10-13-2007, 03:35 PM

your bottom is less grungy than mine!
but you have more oxidation as well!
i can't explain the grunge but it could have something to do with the cars first decade in italy. the undercarriage was sprayed with old engine oil at every oil change. rustproofing italian style!
perhaps we need to get an undercarriage forensic expert to explain!

the guy i bought the car from was amazed at the clean underside and undercoated it for protection. this had fallen off in some spots and when i had the car repainted and rockers replaced, the body shop touched things up. these are the "wet" or black looking areas. they look fresh but they are 20 +years old.

you have nice michelin xzx tires on your giulia. i have michelin "X" tires, which were purchased in the early 70's by the army guy (who brought this italian market car to the us. he is a friend of mine) in paris while he was enroute from italy to the port the car was to be shipped from. he visited his uncle who worked for michelin in paris and he purchased the tires at his discount.

as for the seats - i purchased the alfa "bright red" vinyl from "re-originals"
over 10 years ago to redo the seat bottoms. several years ago i purchased
another yard (min order) to redo the shift boot color. "re- originals" sells this color and texture vinyl as original color and texture. i think i recall him asking me which red i was looking for at the time. so maybe there are a few reds used. certainly this bright red was a fashionable color in the early 60's. who know maybe it was an italian market color. whatever, it is definitely an alfa original equipment color. if anyone doubts this perhaps they should do some more homework.

i purchased the car in late 77 and put it on the road in may 78. in june 78, i landed a job in nyc and the car lived in scardsale. i used it on weekends for a few summers and then in the early 80s it went into a body shop for painting.
it remained at that shop for several years while i restored a 66 rhd mini and used my other cars. by the mid 80's i moved the car to my weekend house where it has remained garaged and under cover. hence the low miles. with kids, business, travel, house restoration, wooden boat restoration and building, my alfa has not had the attention it deserves. having said that it hasn't been neglected except for lack of use. i have only put about 15 kilometers since registering in july.

i hope this helps you understand my car. and i hope you realize that there are some clean cars on the east coast too!

AlfaBear · #26 (**permalink**) 10-13-2007, 04:45 PM

John, your car looks great inside and out. It's been a while since I bought my 63 Giulia, but I am certain I did not look at the underside of the car. At least what I saw there had little bearing on my decision to buy the car. Of course that was 20 years ago and they were not selling for the dollars they are today. They are beautiful cars in any (almost) color combination and still fun to drive.

Steve O · #27 (**permalink**) 10-15-2007, 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve O

Since its a normale, and kinda grubby underneath my bidding would end about 22k, tops.

**Zunige** · #28 (**permalink**) 10-15-2007, 08:44 PM

I did take a drive to see this car in person, and as I told the seller, the ebay pictures are not very good, as the shadows and shades of the picture don't reflect the true colors. The underside of the car looks very good, and not the dirty grayish color of the pictures. There is certainly no thick layer of dirt. This car is solid, and rust free. The 1600 engine revs freely and it feels strong. I pushed it in 2nd, 3rd and 4th gear, and I was surprised at how well it felt, particularly considering that this car is just driven locally. The suspension is also tight.

From a cosmetic standpoint, it's not a concours car, but it is unmolested for sure. It's a very original driver that anyone would be proud to own and show. It is complete, with a decent top that goes up and fits properly,the back drape looks good and the elusive tonneau is all there. A new owner could easily elect to preserve this car as is and enjoy it. It's financial suicide to restore a car that has needs, but with those rare cars that look good and drive well, and have all their parts in the correct position, it is actually not that hard. This car has no dents, nor does it need body work. To make the body perfect, it just needs to have two scratches re-touched. The rest of cosmetics, and mechanics could be made to look like new by servicing and refurbishing them. Cars that are rare include the small number of concours competitive examples, and those that have been cared for as originals. This is a well cared for original. When I went to see it, I was expecting more of a driver, and as I told the seller once I had looked at it, the best deal is one where both buyer and seller feel that the transactions was fair. What I can afford is less than what I think the car should go for. If I were the seller, it would take much more than the highest ebay bid for me to let her go, but of course that is not my call...

Best regards,