Giulia SS Bondo Sculpture - Page 5 - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums

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post #61 of 119 (permalink) Old 02-26-2013, 01:41 AM
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Pete,

Your comments are important because it will helps me explain the process and others understand how the process work from beginning to end. I am trying to build a video library for anyone with a desire to either learn or just satisfy their inquisitive thinking. I could not tell you how much I learned by watching David Gardiner Metal working video. I watched from time to time even though I have reached a higher skill level. The only skill set I am still not to par is the TIG Welding process. And to be honest, I have not tried hard enough; I find TIG to be an exceptional bench work tool but complicated to operate when you have to get down and under in hard places. TIG requires you to use both hands and foot to handle heat control I find it like walking the tight rope and thus find myself frustrated and unwilling to try harder.

Thank your inquisitive thinking.

Lionel

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Thanks. So planishing is only required on flat panels?. Do you planish all your welds?

What would you do if you had welded an arch on many years ago by MIG ... and the inner arch was still installed?
Pete

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post #62 of 119 (permalink) Old 02-26-2013, 05:24 AM Thread Starter
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It counts, but depth requires digging.

D
Don,

You are absolutely correct. I was being facetious.

Lionel
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post #63 of 119 (permalink) Old 02-26-2013, 06:50 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks. So planishing is only required on flat panels?. Do you planish all your welds?

What would you do if you had welded an arch on many years ago by MIG ... and the inner arch was still installed?
Pete
Pete,

Not necessarily, you can hand planish any panel from flat to curved or take a flat panel and curve it into a desire shape. If you take a look at various body dollies you will notice that these are available in different shapes and forms. The varied shapes of dollies are key to guide the work when a desired shape is needed as you strike the panel with hammer and dolly. It is the same as using a pneumatic planishing hammer only slower, much more slower.

As to planishing welds, you can not hand planish welding produced with anything other than Oxy-acetylene. MIG welding crystalizes when a panel is welded and can only smoothed out by grinding. Welding produced with MIG will break when you try to hand planish them. While, oxy-acetylene welding is fused into the metal when the panel is hand planished after words. I can not speak for TIG welding because I have no experience with this process.

The results of MIG welding are good under the hands of a skillful welder although, the finished work will require filler after the work is done.

Tell me more about your arch? why would you want to change it?

Lionel

Last edited by Lionel Velez; 03-02-2013 at 06:15 AM.
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post #64 of 119 (permalink) Old 02-26-2013, 11:28 AM
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Tell me more about your arch? why would you want to change it?

Lionel
i was after reassurance that I hadn't stuffed it up, and now have that thanks. This is what happens when the Internet is so easy and I'm currently not working on my car as I'm making my shed bigger.

I repaired my spare wheel well with oxy and planishing, and very rewarding. But it used to drive me crazy getting that first tack as the metal moves when the heat is applied. This does not happen with the MIG.

I also see now, being an amateur, that my lack of courage has meant I've repaired things the hard way. I say this because I should have cut my cars nose panel off and repaired it with access to both sides AND removed the rear inner arches so less filler/lead will be required with the arch replacement.
Pete

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post #65 of 119 (permalink) Old 02-28-2013, 07:05 AM Thread Starter
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Photo updates on SS Bondo Sculpture Metal Fabrication

Work on the SS continues at an incredible pace. And now that the undercarriage is completely cleaned of rust, tart, fiber glass as well as paint. All the rusted body parts have been removed and new parts have been fabricated.

I have bee working with the Spies Hecker Paint Rep in order to get all the correct colors for these cars. This will be another post.

Lots of welding on the way. Enjoy the photos. www.aisllc.smugmug.com

Lionel

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post #66 of 119 (permalink) Old 03-14-2013, 02:21 PM Thread Starter
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On the road to redemption

Many and I say many hours of work and the Giulia SS Bondo Sculpture is, and I am happy to say is... on its way to redemption. All the rust has been replaced, all the floors are done, and currently working on our way back on the outside metal. Here is a preview of how everything is coming together.

I will be posting more photos on the AISLLC's Photos | SmugMug photo album.

Lionel

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post #67 of 119 (permalink) Old 03-14-2013, 02:25 PM Thread Starter
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Notice how we use self taping screws instead of Cleco fasteres to hold the metal. These are easier, better and cheaper to use as supposed to the Cleco fasteners. Don't think that we are holding down the car with screws on a permanent basis.
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post #68 of 119 (permalink) Old 03-17-2013, 06:46 AM
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i would like to have your skills!!
nice work!

Marc
Giulia ss 1963, Giulietta ss 1960, SZ ES30 1991
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post #69 of 119 (permalink) Old 03-17-2013, 09:00 AM
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Another SS getting saved.

Nice Work Lionel!

But it looks all to familiar, except I am more of a minimalist when it comes to replacing panels.

I just love having to use my English wheel for every panel.
Ciao,
Bill Gillham
Pictures of Richard Lane's Giulietta SS that Don and I are doing the same work to.
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post #70 of 119 (permalink) Old 03-17-2013, 12:23 PM Thread Starter
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Nice Work Lionel!

But it looks all to familiar, except I am more of a minimalist when it comes to replacing panels.

I just love having to use my English wheel for every panel.
Ciao,
Bill Gillham
Pictures of Richard Lane's Giulietta SS that Don and I are doing the same work to.
Thanks Bill!

I hardly use my English wheel since the preponderance of the work is done with Oxy-acetylene, dolly and hammer and a 4' diameter pipe.

The only time I have used the English wheel was for curving the outer sill panels and lower rear valance on the SS. Unfortunately, there has been nothing of a small scale with this SS at all. Too much damage and too many parts requiring replacements.

Lionel
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post #71 of 119 (permalink) Old 03-17-2013, 01:32 PM
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Lionel,
I use my e-wheel instead of swinging a hammer too much, at my age (65+) it hurts too much. This is my 5th SS resto, I built my English wheel 25 years ago to do the second one. I use it a lot, altho I use some of my other tools just as much. I use tooling to save my aging body.

I have just gotten a new toy, it is a P-Max reciprocating hammer, especially nice for making floor panel beads etc. but also works for deep shrinking and power planishing. I also have a CP Planishing Hammer but the throat on it is only 12 inches so between them I should be able to planish any panel I make for a Giulietta.
Ciao,
Bill
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post #72 of 119 (permalink) Old 03-17-2013, 02:51 PM Thread Starter
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Bill! I like your P-Max! In fact, I have been collecting pieces because I am going to make my own from scratch.

I understand what you are saying regarding age and I will be soon joining the ranks, but hope not too soon. I place fancy tools in the same category of fancy financial and scientific calculators in that the user must have a relatively strong understanding of mathematical formulas before delving into punching numbers into a calculator.

It is nice to have those tools around when needed and I have a good number of them, but I mostly enjoy using hammer and dolly as much as possible for a number of reasons. I have been learning a lot through vocational classes since I retired from banking and I also have been extremely fortunate to have a mentor with a 30 plus years of experience as a panel beater who prefers dolly, hammer, oxy-acetylene torch in addition to making many of our own home made tools to perform magic.

When Carlos first came to work with me, he was not impressed with the amount of tools I have collected but rather with the space, privacy and tranquility of working in a place with no deadlines, so, I have been learning from a Master Metal craftsmen.

I like to know more about your P-Max.

Regards,

Lionel

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post #73 of 119 (permalink) Old 03-17-2013, 10:59 PM
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Lionel,
Iwas also considering building my own, but I don't currently have the time, my shop is pretty busy right now. So I started researching commercial units, I considered the smaller Baleigh 19" Unit and the Clay Cook Mini Max hammer. While doing an ebay search for a Pull Max I located this P-Max hammer in Milwaukee Wi at a Street Rod Shop, they had bought a set of the Desert Hybrid P-Max plans and built 3 hammers, they kept one and sold 2.

You can learn a lot about the Hammer by googling P-Max or Desert Hybrids Precision. They are in Tucson AZ.

I had Desert Hybrids build me some tooling to reproduce the beads in the trunk and floor boards of the Giuliettta, plus a nice set of thumbnail shrinking dies and an adapter to allow me to use my CP Planishing hammer dies in the machine. It uses standard square 17mm, (3/4") Pull max tooling, there are a lot of different patterns available (but they are kind of spendy) a lot of guys make their own tooling.

If it works out like the other tools I will use it a lot. My E-wheel and planishing hammer get used nearly every day, my other tools all the time. Especially the lancaster shrinkers / stretcher and the Bead rollers, (I have 4 different ones), and my box and pan break and shear, the slip roll is really handy when you need it. I love tools can't you tell!

But my son Don says the best tool we have is my Thumb but that is another story.
Ciao,
Bill
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post #74 of 119 (permalink) Old 03-18-2013, 12:13 AM Thread Starter
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I know the guy from Desert Hybrids. I have purchased some of its tooling and he sells the plans for the P-Max. If the one you have is based on his plans I would like to see photos of yours. Can you email me some photos of your machine at lionel.velez@gmail.com? I would appreciate so.

Lionel
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post #75 of 119 (permalink) Old 03-18-2013, 03:37 AM Thread Starter
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Formerly Giulia SS Bondo Sculpture

Here are the latest photos of a formerly Giulia SS Bondo Sculpture rust bucket.

The driver side outer skin is almost done but, I wanted to share a few photos of our headway. The photos with the various shape template gauges are used as a guide in order to evaluate how much curve and how much hand planishing work is required. It is also a guide to ensure correct symmetry on both sides of the car. Would hate to see one side with contours. We are about to move to the other side of the car starting Tuesday. By the end of moth 3 we will have completed a total of 580 hrs of work including cleaning, sand blasting, metal fabrication, welding, and hand planishing.

After that, we have the front lower valance to replace and a few miscellaneous parts. That said, we are on tract to complete all the work at about the 700 hrs as originally estimated.

Although we have a shop full of tools the preponderance of the work has been completed with these few tools and the Oxy-acetylene torch.

Enjoy the photos.

Lionel

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