Giulietta Sprint Veloce -61 abnormal restoration - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums

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post #1 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-14-2010, 03:45 AM Thread Starter
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Giulietta Sprint Veloce -61 abnormal restoration

So I'm starting a new thread to tell a bit about the restoration of my Giulietta. More info soon. But first I have a question.

The upper frame rails that hold the front upper suspension arms are slightly banana shaped (see picture). The picture is taken from above and both inner and outer fenders are removed. A straight beam is attached for comparison and the gap in the middle is 5 mm.

Was this really an original feature or has these rails been bent over time (the car has been extremely rusty)?

Simply put: can anyone confirm if the rails should be straight or bent?

Thanks!
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post #2 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-14-2010, 05:32 AM
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I am inclined to think they should be straight. Mine seem to be.
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post #3 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-14-2010, 08:03 AM
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Don

Welcome to the BB

Can't help you with your question, as my Sprint did not need such a tear-down at the front.

Wish you well on the project.

Bob,
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Avatar is the 69 Super, bought new.
Current Ride: 67 Super, bought in 2013: Red/Black, "Tuned" 2 L.
Daily drivers, beginning in 1965: 750 Spider, Giulia Spider, 105 Sprint GT, 101 Sprint, 69 Super, 79 Alfetta Sedan. Collectors beginning in 2006: 101 Spider, 101 Sprint. Both sold.
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post #4 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-15-2010, 11:05 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks Subtle and divotandtralee,

Yes, help is needed... maybe someone could put down a ruler on the inside to check?
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post #5 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-15-2010, 11:28 AM
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I did. It was straight. Any sign of frontal blows? Seems this would want to bow outward in a front crash. I thought of triangulating with a plumb line but that won't work unless the frame is dead level which might be a challenge in itself.
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post #6 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-15-2010, 12:10 PM Thread Starter
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A Sprint Veloce for free?

Well, I guess there's no such thing as a free lunch but...

Almost to the date nine years ago I was working home, which was quite unusual for me those days.

I had since 1984 become a real Alfa fan owning and restoring several Bertone-coupes, Giulias, GTV and so on. At that time, 2001, I was owning a 164 3.0 (-89), 2 Giulia Super (-66 and -67) and a GTV-6 racecar and on my wishlist was to someday own a Giulietta and a Montreal. So, when the mail woman brought the Swedish Alfa Romeo Car Club magazine (Klöverbladet = Cloverleaf magazine, actually the name is a play with words since "bladet" in Swedish means both leaf and magazine...) that day I had no problem to set aside work at once and focus on something more fun... like Alfas.

When I eventually reached the ads, my eyes focused in on an small ad for a Giulietta Sprint. It said: Giulietta Sprint Veloce -60 bortskänkes (bortskänkes = give away for free).

This was not the ordinary ad!?!
Of course, I thought that there must be a catch or prank, but what the heck, I had to call. I wanted a Sprint and there was still some space in my 130m2 workshop and 160m2 barn.

"It,s my brothers car" said the voice on the phone. "He gave up the restoration, sold all the parts, but the body got left here...yeah, and a small box with parts he forgot to send". "No, there are no doors or hoods or anything else... the front fenders have been cut off and sold too"."Yes, you can come on Saturday and collect it.... yes, its for free".

So, on Saturday the 17 March 2001 me and my then four year old daughter Sofia got into the car with a trailer connected and drove the 140 or so km to the outskirts of Växjö. The home of the car owners brother was outside Växjö in a forrest clearing... and just on the border to the forrest the beauty was laying, and actually partly covered, in snow. Beauty... well she was a rather sad sight, stripped, with the front outer and inner fenders cut off, the paint partly scrapped and unprotected and with some deep dents in the roof and rear fenders. Fortunatelly, she hadn't spent too much time out there so there was still hope. Anyway we went back inside, had some coffee and icecream and spent some time with the very friendly young family. Of course we bad-mouthed the other brother substantially. Eventually I signed the papers, put Sofia in the car, and with the Giulietta on the trailer (without getting stuck on the snoowy clearing) drove the 140 km home.

I felt happy!
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post #7 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-15-2010, 12:22 PM
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I don't do smiley faces.. fast forward 9 years...uhmmmmmmmm....do you still have the job at home and are you still happy? That's what I got from your message... Oh, and when over this 9 year period did it strike you the front top rail might be out 5 mm? Beam me up Scotty.

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post #8 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-15-2010, 12:26 PM
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Don

Enjoyed your story.

Bob,
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Daily drivers, beginning in 1965: 750 Spider, Giulia Spider, 105 Sprint GT, 101 Sprint, 69 Super, 79 Alfetta Sedan. Collectors beginning in 2006: 101 Spider, 101 Sprint. Both sold.
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post #9 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-15-2010, 12:40 PM Thread Starter
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Hi devotandtralee,

Thanks for checking the beams. I will straighten mine. I guess what's happened is that the chassis upper members (from suspension to firewall/doors) got very rusted and with the car still driven hard the upper beams bent.

To your second reply. Life don't always take us where we expect. My two son's got badly sick 2003, which combined with lifes other challanges and developments basically made me put aside all car activites until last autumn. They are both reasonably fine today and yes I am still happy. Hope you are too.
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post #10 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-15-2010, 05:39 PM
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Don,

Too bad you car is a 2nd series car. I do have a pair of brand new front fenders that would make up the entire front clip. You could them beam up Ricardo alias - Divotandtralee.

Good luck with your project.

Lionel
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post #11 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-15-2010, 06:15 PM
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Question

Don

Your lead title includes "abnormale restoration".

Does this refer to the plans you have for the engine?

Or do you still have the Veloce engine?

Bob,
Director BC Chapter SNO.
Avatar is the 69 Super, bought new.
Current Ride: 67 Super, bought in 2013: Red/Black, "Tuned" 2 L.
Daily drivers, beginning in 1965: 750 Spider, Giulia Spider, 105 Sprint GT, 101 Sprint, 69 Super, 79 Alfetta Sedan. Collectors beginning in 2006: 101 Spider, 101 Sprint. Both sold.
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post #12 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-15-2010, 11:15 PM
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Dear Don,
It is actually fortunate that your Veloce is a second-series Sprint body, since so many bodyshells were made of that run and the 2nd-series are machine-stamping panels which should all match from Spring 1958 to 1966 after Lionel's Veloce (06611)! You should have an easier time finding donor panels or a rear-end damaged donor body. Windows, doors, bonnet, boot, any SO many parts are interchangable from a non-Veloce donor. Best of luck finishing your Giulietta, and enjoying her! I'm happy your family is now thriving.
Laurence

Last edited by AR58SprintV; 03-17-2010 at 10:25 PM. Reason: spelling
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post #13 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-16-2010, 12:10 AM Thread Starter
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Hi guys,

Thanks for your replies. Actually I have far from finished the story of what happened 2001-2003 and also last year. And there is also a catch to why it is an abnormal restoration and possibly will be an abnormale too.

I'll be back later today with the continuation of the story...
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post #14 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-16-2010, 06:07 AM Thread Starter
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Rust, rust and more rust...

Unfortunately, I don’t have any picture of how the Giulietta looked when I collected her. It would have been nice for comparisons today.

Nevertheless, with the car home in the workshop I started to track down where the original parts had ended up. From the previous owner I got the name of the guy who had bought most of the mechanical parts. Apparently he lived in the northern parts of Sweden some 1400 km from me, and he were owning two Giuliettas, one restored and one under restoration. He had bought most of the parts as extras and was willing to sell most of it back to me. He also arranged with some parts that originally hadn’t come from my car but I was missing. This contact also provided me some useful help on Giulietta restoration.

Of course, now things were not for free anymore, and I had to pay a reasonable price for the parts. But the great thing was that I could get back the original fenders, doors, rear hood, all windows, wiring loom, radiator, pedals, some chrome trim and parts of the suspension. A front hood from another car and normale instruments and fuel tank were included too.
Now, I could get into work. I started by cleaning up the car making the rear end clean to the metal and removing bumps and dents as I went along. Fenders and front piece and doors were given the same treatment. Especially the roof was badly dented with what looked as fist blows.

Right side and rear end was already reasonably restored by a previous owner with new rockers, upper torpedo and so on. The driver side was in very bad shape (see pics) and it was clear that I would need to replace rocker panels, upper torpedo, floor cross members, front cross member and much more.
To support the car under the surgery a beam was welded under the car between the left front lower beam and the left rear suspension arm attachment. Next step was to open up and remove rusted panels and replace them.

I had in preparation gathered as much information about the Giuliettas as I could, but detailed pictures of how it should be were missing. The Internet in 2001-2003 was not that great source of info as it is today. I could eventually gather that my car had the pressed steel body that appeared September -61 and not the earlier type(s) even though the registration papers coming with the car stated that it was a -60 normale. And yet it was supposed to be a Veloce -61. Confusing ehh? I’ll come back to that later.

The car had during earlier owners been restored in periods. We have to remember that during the late seventies these cars were not that valuable and replacing sheet metal was usually done cheaply and with a lot of plastic padding. So much of the old rusted sheet metal was anyway not a source of information how it really should look. Someone for instance put an enormous tank filler entrance on the right rear fender while someone else removed front wings to build a flip front instead. The left inner fender I could never find again while the right one only remained in fragments.

So during the work 2001-2003 I had to make several educated guesses on how the sheet metal, reinforcements and so on should look when I manufactured them. My intention has always been to restore the body as much as practically possible to original state with correct pressings and all. Pictures 0-17 shows some of what was done during this period. I opted for replacing the outer rocker first and then the inner to keep the car reasonably stable.

More info coming up…
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post #15 of 235 (permalink) Old 03-16-2010, 06:11 AM Thread Starter
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Some more pics

Some more pics...
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