1964 Guilia Spider on Ebay

Richard Hipwood · #1 (**permalink**) 02-08-2009, 09:52 AM

There's a 1964 Guilia Normale Spider on Ebay with a Buy it Now price of $16,500. The vendor is Sportscar LA and I called them yesterday. The car runs and drives well, but has rust issues in the footwell areas on both sides and the rockers need to be replaced. It needs a total cosmetic restoration, but mechanically is in good shape. It looks straight, however the dealer said that it has been hit in the front, but the damage is repairable without having to weld in fresh metal. The good news is that the car is complete and totally original except for the top which has been replaced. I'm tempted to buy it, however I wonder if I would be better off to look for a car that has been restored.

ecdysiast · #2 (**permalink**) 02-09-2009, 06:35 AM

With so much damage already identified, you're probably in for at least $15K worth of restoration. You always see more that has to be done once it's apart or stripped. And what did the dealer not tell you? And how about the drive train?

Nobody does a restoration as an investment, because history shows it's very very hard to get your money back--much less make any. Might as well let the person who paid for the restoration take the loss.

Jeffrey

Alfajay · #3 (**permalink**) 02-09-2009, 08:02 AM

I agree with everything that Jeffrey has written.

Having said that, it all depends on what journey you want to take, and where you want to end up. A few random thoughts:

- It always costs less to buy a fully restored car. That's if you want to own a fully restored car. If a daily driver Giulia spider is your goal, then the ebay car could fill the bill as-is. Or if you enjoy restoring cars, this one (if bought at the right price) could be a good starting point. Sure, you will spend more on the car + restoration than the price of an already restored Giulia, but you will 1) have the experience of restoring it, and 2) be able to complete it exactly as you want.

- The ebay car does have some needs - just from the photos, the trunk is obviously damaged, I can see some rust in the rockers, and then there is the admitted front end damage. There is no doubt more.

- Who knows what this car will sell for - the dealer would LIKE to get $16,500, but if his reserve is lower, it could sell for less. It might be a deal at $8,000 (say).

- This is the sort of car that needs to be seen in person. Trusting the dealer's description is risky. I am not suggesting that he is dishonest, but many of these guys don't really understand classic cars, or what is involved in a restoration. For example, saying "the damage is repairable without having to weld in fresh metal" is silly - without removing the paint (+ all the Bondo underneath it) no one can determine how to properly repair this car.

Richard Hipwood · #4 (**permalink**) 02-09-2009, 08:34 AM

Thanks for inputs. I pretty much decided not to bid on the car. I have the restorer's disease called "I never saw an Alfa I didn't like". I currently have a '67 Duetto and '71 GTV just finishing total restoration, and a '67 2600 Sprint and a really rough and incomplete '57 Giulietta spider waiting in the weeds to be pulled into the body shop to start the process. So, I needed to get a reality check and you guys provided it. Thanks

Alfajay · #5 (**permalink**) 02-09-2009, 10:01 AM

Richard:

It sounds like you have as much or more restoration experience than I do, so perhaps I shouldn't be offering advice. But, here I go:

Is that "really rough and incomplete '57 Giulietta spider waiting in the weeds" really the best platform to begin you next project with? One thing I have learned as I have done a few of these is that the cleaner a car you begin with, the cleaner a car you will end up with. AND, you will save time and money in the process. An incomplete MGA or Porsche 356 can have its missing parts sourced from catalogs - expensive, but possible. Alfa Giuliettas are tougher to find parts for - many items have not been reproduced, and can only be found used. So your instincts on the ebay car were good in this regard - complete, running cars have some advantages.

Richard Hipwood · #6 (**permalink**) 02-09-2009, 10:18 AM

Jay, I was wondering the same thing about the Giulietta. I bought it cheaply from a guy on Ebay who was really honest about the condition of the car. He was turning it into a street racer and had stripped the bumpers, side window glass and top, and had sold them. I sourced all the missing parts on Ebay, but the chrome needs refinishing, etc, etc, so I'm in for a long and tedious restoration and to be honest I have had enough of restoring and want to drive the cars that I have. I'm thinking of selling the Giulietta as the basis for a racing car.

**jarrington** · #7 (**permalink**) 02-09-2009, 03:49 PM

Richard, if it helps I bought a really nice '60 Normale in the fall for $21k with the resto nearly complete. I had a top installed and it still needs carpet and a couple of other bits on the interior, but the body work, chrome, seats, and mechanicals were already done to a high standard. You can see the car here:
http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/giul...road-trip.html

Obviously from my perspective $16.5k seems pretty pricey for the car in question.

-Jason

Richard Hipwood · #8 (**permalink**) 02-09-2009, 05:42 PM

Jason,

Thanks for sharing. You have a beautiful car and I envy the road trip you took, and I admire the spirit of you and your wife to put your trust in the Giulietta that's nearly 50 years old. The Alfa 4-cylinder engine was one of the most reliable ever produced.
I will keep looking for the right car. I think that one of the side effects of this economy will be more prime examples of vintage cars will be coming on the market and the prices will stabilize or perhaps come down slightly. Thanks again, Richard

**jarrington** · #9 (**permalink**) 02-09-2009, 05:58 PM

This was definitely a recession special. The car was in Detroit, which was obviously hit harder and earlier than most of the rest of the country. Of course what comes around goes around - I was planning on replacing my '74 Spider with the Giulietta, and now I'm sort of stuck with both. Not the worst fate, I suppose.

-Jason