
07-17-2008, 10:30 AM
|
 |
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Posts: 423
|
|
|
GTA options for standard 105s...
Ok guys, Im pretty close (like, one trip to the bank) away from getting a 67 Stepnose 1600 Veloce to build up as a racecar to enter in Historic racing here in Australia.
Anyway guys, heres where I need your help!
Basically, in regards to engine modifications, the rules stipulate the following...
"3.1 general Requirements:
(i) To be acceptable in competition, each option shall comply with at least one of the following requirements:
(a) It shall be listed by the manufacturer as a “production option”, ie, an optional item or specification listed on the
automobile build sheet and fitted at the time of build of the automobile. (For some automobiles the options with
which it was built are listed on the automobile ID plate.)
oR
(b) It shall be an option listed and authorised by the manufacturer in official sales literature and to which a
manufacturer’s warranty applies and which may be fitted at an authorised dealership.
oR
(c) The option shall have been proven to have been supplied by the Manufacturer in more than the minimum
production quantities for eligibility, in automobiles registered for road use.
(ii) In addition to 3.1(i) above, an option shall comply with ALL of the following requirements:
(a) Each option must comply with the regulations of the relevant road authority and be ADR compliant.
(b) Each option included on the automobile must have been available during the model run of the automobile.
(c) Where a recognition document has been issued for a particular automobile, each option shall be specified in the
recognition document"
Now, for the big question; were any GTA or Autodelta performance/racing options available to the public to put on their cars when they bought them new from dealerships? If so, which ones?
And an even bigger one; was the GTA engine a factory option at all?
Cheers guys in advance 
__________________
i cavalli mai abbastanza, ed il peso sempre troppo...
|

07-17-2008, 03:59 PM
|
 |
Senior Member
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Bargo, Australia
Posts: 235
|
|
|
Or an even bigger biGGER BIGGER one
Does CAMS (Confederation of Australian Motor Sport) recognize GTA parts and options as being race legal on a GTV?
Last edited by Blue Flame; 07-20-2008 at 12:27 AM.
|

07-17-2008, 04:07 PM
|
 |
Senior Member
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: near Pasadena, CA
Posts: 671
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by raff_gta
...
Now, for the big question; were any GTA or Autodelta performance/racing options available to the public to put on their cars when they bought them new from dealerships? If so, which ones?
And an even bigger one; was the GTA engine a factory option at all?
Cheers guys in advance 
|
Could one contend that the entireity of the Porformance Options Catalog were available to the public for installation onto GTV's and Sprint Gt's? if so, the whole treasure chest of sliding block rears, 7"x15" GTA wheels, twin plug heads, 105.36 camshafts, GTA flares, etc. is open to you
__________________
1966 Giulia Super (current)
1966 Giulia Super (R.I.P.)
1967 GTV (R.I.P.)
1955 1900CSS (R.I.P.)
Last edited by Il Vecchio; 07-18-2008 at 09:39 AM.
Reason: Spelling, always spelling...
|

07-17-2008, 05:54 PM
|
 |
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: BC
Posts: 773
|
|
Get a copy of the parts book, the performance parts catalogue and the homologation papers and use them creatively
Among others, 45DCOE's were listed as optional for the Giulia Sprint GT in the parts book.
|

07-17-2008, 07:11 PM
|
 |
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Posts: 423
|
|
|
sorry for being stupid here, but, any ideas where I can get these? Ebay?
__________________
i cavalli mai abbastanza, ed il peso sempre troppo...
|

07-17-2008, 07:21 PM
|
 |
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Posts: 423
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Flame
Or an even bigger biGGER BIGGER one
Does CAMS Cconfederation of Australian Motor Sport) recognize GTA parts and options as being race legal on a GTV?
|
In regards to historic racing in Group C1, rule 1.1.iii states that "A replacement block permitted by the CAMS Historic Commission for that automobile in Group N or S historic
competition.
Substitute cylinder blocks shall be of the same type, configuration, number of cylinders and material as the
original." however, this is only in regards to modifying the engine; if the GTA engine is a feasible option for the 105s, then putting a GTA engine in wouldnt be defined as a modification but rather an installment of an option correct?
In regards to options, the rules say that an item can be used if; "It shall be an option listed and authorised by the manufacturer in official sales literature and to which a
manufacturer’s warranty applies and which may be fitted at an authorised dealership."
Were these performance options listed in literature by Alfa (Im guessing so, because we can get parts books for it right?)? Even if they were listed by Autodelta, Autodelta was owned by Alfa at the time, and that would mean that any Autodelta option (that was covered by warranty, as required by the rules) is legal in historic racing here in Australia!
Just begs the question though; how do you define "official sales literature"? Parts catalogues maybe? If people could get there hands on them back in that day then we are onto something right (although how would we find out this was the case?)
__________________
i cavalli mai abbastanza, ed il peso sempre troppo...
|

07-18-2008, 03:44 AM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 29
|
|
|
raff gta - Do you actually have a GTA engine to put into your car????
|

07-18-2008, 04:54 AM
|
 |
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Posts: 423
|
|
I know someone that is willing to sell me one if that helps  And anyway, its not just about that; if you can use GTA parts then it opens avenues to a whole host of parts, just like "Il Vecchio" expanded on previously...
__________________
i cavalli mai abbastanza, ed il peso sempre troppo...
|

07-19-2008, 07:36 AM
|
 |
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posts: 678
|
|
|
If there are particular parts you want to see the options of in the factory parts book I can scan and send to you.
__________________
[B]Derek Entesano [/B]
'66 Giulia Super (Driver) AR 721136 Biancospino  --'67 GT Veloce(Resto) AR 299772 Rosso
|

07-19-2008, 11:24 AM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: London UK
Posts: 1,061
|
|
|
It might be cheaper to buy a GTA!!!
__________________
Stuart
'56 Giulietta Spider, '57 Giulietta Spider Veloce, '57 Giulietta Lightweight Sprint Veloce, '60 SZ, '68 GTA, '76 2000 Spider
|

07-19-2008, 11:52 AM
|
 |
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Posts: 423
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by alfa2go
If there are particular parts you want to see the options of in the factory parts book I can scan and send to you.
|
Any literature that has to do with Autodelta/GTA performance parts would be absolutely fantastic buddy 
Quote:
Originally Posted by alfazagato
It might be cheaper to buy a GTA!!!
|
Possibly, probably, but hey, when doing up a car, by the end of it, you can many cars, Ferraris, houses, whatever right?
__________________
i cavalli mai abbastanza, ed il peso sempre troppo...
|

07-19-2008, 06:35 PM
|
 |
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 207
|
|
|
Hi Raff,
I think you should listen to Blue Flame.
Find out what CAMS will allow in the type of racing you want to enter. Is it Group N or S you want to enter or even another category - the rules are different for each.
I would suggest picking up the phone and calling CAMS.
Words on a piece of paper can be interpreted may different ways - it is the interpretation that is allowed that is important.
Was the engine an option for a street car or simply available to buy as a replacement for a race car? The real facts from 1966 bear little relevance to the interpretation of a governing body trying to make racing fair and cheap, and will be different from category to category.
Ask the people that know for a fact (not me).
|

07-19-2008, 08:50 PM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: AUSTRALIA
Posts: 224
|
|
|
Hi Raff,
As others have said, most of the ground work has already been done for historic classes, with many cars already having been built and all the posibilities for inclusions of special tricky bits having been accepted or tossed out!
The question is which clas do you want to run, and obtain a build spec sheet for that car in that class from CAMS.
I have been involved in this procees for 105s and 116 models for GpS, GpNC, GpC and GpA and am currently involved with a Biante Series 105 specification at the current time.
If you have specific parts allowable/class questions then maybe I can give you some direction.
Cheers,
Vince.
|

07-20-2008, 05:29 PM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Brisbane
Posts: 173
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by vsharp
I have been involved in this procees for 105s and 116 models for GpS, GpNC, GpC and GpA and am currently involved with a Biante Series 105 specification at the current time.
|
I'd been wondering if they were ever going to let Alfas into TCM - Are they going to allow big arches?
__________________
1966 Giulia Sprint GT Veloce
1971 Ford XY GTHO (replica) race car (For sale?)
1982 Suzuki "Bathurst" Katana
1985 Suzuki RG500
1995 Cagiva Mito (race kitted 250 powered)
|

07-21-2008, 05:09 AM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: AUSTRALIA
Posts: 224
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by la_strega_nera
I'd been wondering if they were ever going to let Alfas into TCM - Are they going to allow big arches?
|
For the Biante Touring Car Masters, it is the 1750 GTAm type model that we are seeking approval for, based on the fact that Brian Foley raced one here in the Touringcar Championship in 71/72. While this is not a specific criteria for inclusion, it does add that bit of nostalgic air and brownie points to the whole application, which has got to be a plus; not to mention the extra track width and reduced weight that goes with it.....!
|
|