105 twinspark - Alfa Romeo Bulletin Board & Forums

  #1 (permalink)  
Old 03-05-2008, 10:52 AM
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105 twinspark

Ok im not sure if this has been done to death so im sorry if im covering old ground.
After reading some post's about fitting a twinspark into a 105 series car I am missing the point on some vital issues. I would like to fit a twin spark into my 105 and run it on carbs so?
Will it bolt to a 1967 1600 gearbox?
Can i bolt 40mm carbs to the inlet manifold?
What do we do about the ignition system?
What do we do about the VCT?
So in retrospect all i want to do is put a twinspark in my 105, run it on carbs, and use this as a daily driver.
Oh and if anyone in OZ has a twinspark for sale I am interested
Cheers
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 03-09-2008, 04:41 AM
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really everything has been covered. use the search function better!
But in short: Any hydraulic clutch gearbox will work .

no you can't just bolt carbs to the inlet. Search sites like alfaholics for this part, or manufacture yourself.


ignition: you could keep it original. Or use two marelli or bosch coils.
Or go aftermarket. Or construct yourself.

VCT, you can get it to work with a microswitch, or delete it.

Then there are things as to which car it goes in. Some models have a problem with the front distributor. You can use an angled Fiat example.

You need to get the crank drilled.

You need a donor preferably 2000 engine, for flywheel etc. Only a 2000 flywheel will fit. Or a custom part.

Again, ALL these questions have been posted and answered.

It will make a great DD.

Rik
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Old 03-29-2008, 02:10 PM
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Dont use carbs for gods sake,....your reason for upgrading to a Tspark motor is for better gas mileage and more importantly lots more usable BHP, use the standard Bosch set up complete with the VVT, go for a camshaft upgrade, a little head work, an ECU chip from the guy in Belgium, Its an easy 170bhp,and It'll be quicker than your Ferrari 308!

Last edited by batman; 03-29-2008 at 02:17 PM.
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Old 03-29-2008, 07:28 PM
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Hey, Batman. I know your TS/105 installation is on the 1st edition cover of JK's tuning book so I'm thinking that you were one of the first to make the swap. If it wasn't you, do you know who made the first TS into 105 chasis swap?
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Old 03-30-2008, 10:39 AM
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Yes Jim, me and Rob Giordanelli, later the test driver for the Auto Italia magazine were the first in the UK and maybe Europe in late 1989, we had lots of fun in those days......

Last edited by batman; 03-30-2008 at 10:51 AM.
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 10-06-2008, 08:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seinista View Post
You need a donor preferably 2000 engine, for flywheel etc. Only a 2000 flywheel will fit. Or a custom part.



Rik
whats the difference between the 1750 flywheel and the 2000? thinking of ditching (ebaying) the 1750 engine i have for a t/s conversion

marc
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Old 06-16-2009, 07:30 AM
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cams

Hey Batman

Donīt know if you still have your ts Giulia, but I hope you would help me with some cam questions.
I run standard 2 liter 75 TS engine with a Belgium guy chip (squadra) in my 1750 gtv and am interested in replacing the cams. I sold a couple of weber 48s because a friend convinced me that the original efi was better, as you mentioned. But how large can I go on the cams? I have installed a couple of heavy duty fuel pumps and a fuel preassure regulator with meter to solve any hicups in that departement. There will be some porting and skimming of the top this winter. But what about the cams?

Regards
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Old 06-16-2009, 11:03 AM
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as regards Marc Evo 1

a 1750 engine has an 8 bolt flywheel. A 2 litre has a bigger 6 bolt flywheel.
However, if you have a late 1800 engine, from say an Alfetta, this crank will have the 6 bolt hole pattern . Given that a 2 litre flywheel is getting hard to get, rather one puts in an old model 1750 crank. Otherwise you're wasting a good 2.0 flywheel in a 1750, to which just about any old flywheel will fit. (basically, there are several exceptions)
You can't use your 1750 flywheel on a 2 litre engine unless you happen to have a 1750 with an 1800 crank in it. Just count the holes/ bolts!
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Old 06-16-2009, 12:24 PM
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Hi,
Yes I still have my Old Banger I gave It a good 200ml run the other weekend to the national spring AROC meet.

Regarding camshafts Id still go for CBs, too much air into the cylinders is the limiting factor using the old Bosch Motronic ECU.

Maybe Squadra Tuning could come up with a more modified chip

An aftermarket throttle body kit with Its stand alone ECU is the best way to go for 200bhp plus

Dave.
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Old 06-17-2009, 07:47 PM
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I just finished converting my Twin Spark motor from Weber 45s and a distributor from autocomponenti.com to motorcycle throttle bodies and an ecu from DTA.

It starts great ,idles at 850 rpm, goes like mad, make no black smoke, is much better on gas and I do not have to mess with jets any more.

Here is a link to my photo page Picasa Web Albums - Alfa Dave - Alfa Twin Spa...

It was a lot of work but I am glad I did it. When I put the TS in my car I wanted things to be simple so I went with Carbs and the distributor . I was so wrong. Tuning webers for a custom setup is a huge pain and you can't do much with a distrubtor. To control the VVT I got an rpm switch but I never got around to installing it. And to bring on my electric fan I put in a temp switch.If you are going to the trouble of an engine conversion leave the Carbs and Distributor and all the rest in the past .

Now I have full control of fuel and ignition I also have a rev limiter and fan control. I have not set it up yet but the computer can also control the VVT.

For a full on race setup Webers would be fine maybe even better but for a daily drive use the Bosch or an after market ECU.

alfettaparts what 105 car do you want to put the TS in? If it's a spider it's very hard to get the Alfa intake under the hood.

In closing (here it comes) I wish people on this board would not tell others to "use the search function better!" first it's rude and second the search does not work very well. Someone could make a sticky for the Twin Spark conversion info . That would help reduce the number of times the same questions get asked but why ? It's not like asking a question again will kill a tree or something. (done venting)
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[URL="http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/engine-conversions/172068-building-200hp-twin-spark.html"][B][SIZE="2"]Building a 200 HP Twin Spark[/SIZE][/B][/URL]
[SIZE="2"]David Munro[/SIZE]
Toronto ON Canada
1969 Spider JR Twin Spark
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Old 06-18-2009, 01:01 AM
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Hi David,

Congratulations, that is some very impressive work you've done on the Twin Spark conversion.

I'm currently in the process of dropping a Twin Spark into my 1969 GT 1300 Junior step front.

For a variety of reasons, I can't use the standard Twin Spark intake manifold, so I'm very interested in your use of multiple motor bike throttle bodies. I have a few of questions, if you don't mind pointing me in the right direction:

1. Do you have more information on the brand and model/part number for the throttle bodies? Also, a ballpark price per unit would be great, if you don't mind my asking.

2. Can you please describe how you control and synchronise operation of all four throttle bodies from the one accelerator cable?

3. How did you hook up a vaccuum line for the brake booster, given the absence of a single intake plenium chamber which usually supplies vaccuum pressure?

Thanks in anticipation.

Regards,


Nick
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Old 06-18-2009, 01:57 AM
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Hi David,

One more question, if it's OK, what did you do about an air flow meter?

The reason I ask is that I'd like to keep and reuse as much of the standard Alfa 75/Milano Twin Spark EFI gear as possible (eg ECU, wiring loom, relays, sensors, etc) in order to keep the project costs down.

In other words, I wouldn't go as far as you have (even though I'd love to), but I'm thinking of copying your idea for the multiple throttle bodies... either that or fabricate a custom intake plenum chamber (ie which will fit the available space), and then reuse the rest of the Alfa EFI bits.

Regards,


Nick
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Old 06-18-2009, 04:21 PM
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Hi njh1964 Thank for you kind words.
The throttle bodies are GSXR 750 from 2001 to 2003 . I got them from ebay for $75.00 US . The throttles are connected with adjusters and springs so each one can be adjusted .
I used the TS injectors so the GSXR injector holes were blocked off except the rear one. I fitted a tube into it and used that for my booster.

As for an air flow meter I have none. I used Throttle position and RPM with Map correction. I joined the four vacuum ports into one and connected that to a Map sensor and the fuel regulator. I think you could use just Map but the signal is very rough. This is not a problem as it is not used as the main input.

You can try to make a custom intake and use the bosch parts and computer but I don't think it will be a happy computer.

I would think Gsxr Throttle bodies and Megasquirt would be the least expensive way to go. Would sure save on headache pills.
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[URL="http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/engine-conversions/172068-building-200hp-twin-spark.html"][B][SIZE="2"]Building a 200 HP Twin Spark[/SIZE][/B][/URL]
[SIZE="2"]David Munro[/SIZE]
Toronto ON Canada
1969 Spider JR Twin Spark

Last edited by 69alfa; 06-18-2009 at 04:29 PM.
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old 06-21-2009, 09:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 69alfa View Post
.....I used the TS injectors so the GSXR injector holes were blocked off except the rear one. I fitted a tube into it and used that for my booster.
69alfa:

Thanks for contributing to this thread - the work you are doing on that twinspark is fascinating.

Like njh1964, I am curious about how you handled the power brake vacuum tap. I read your answer (reprinted above), and saw your photos, but I am still puzzled. Two questions:

- Doesn't the tap for the booster vacuum need to be downstream from the throttle butterflies? I wouldn't think you would get much vacuum where you have the tap, upstream of the butterflies. Do you get much power assist with this setup?

- Admittedly I have never worked on a TS, but I would have guessed the stock manifold would have a tap for the booster vacuum. Since you have retained the stock manifold, and had to rig up a tap, I guess it doesn't. Where did Alfa put the tap for booster vacuum on a stock TS?

Thanks!
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Old 06-21-2009, 10:48 AM
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37mpg std motronic 4.1 150hp its plenty for at 105. Mines been running for 3 yrs now.
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