11-06-2009, 10:03 AM
|
 |
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Novato Ca.
Posts: 258
|
|
|
Alfetta to v6 conversion
We're looking at putting a v6 in one of our Lemons cars. Tired of getting passed by the e30 BMWs. Our biggest hurdle is to do this as cheap as possible to keep the costs within Lemons spec. I'm guessing that a 164 3L motor would be the way to go. What is the HP of one of these motors? I've got a line on a GTV6 so the mounts and bellhousing are not an issuse. What else are we going to need to change as far as the motor goes? If we do this we'll have to step up to 5 lug wheels with the bigger brakes. Lokking forward to all replies.
__________________
Wes
Have:
85 Spyder, 79 Alfetta GT 24 Hours of Lemons 2007 Eyetalian Class Champion
Gone: 61 Sprint, 61 Spyder 67 Super, 73 &74 GTV 74 Berlina, 74 & 76 Spyder, 79 GTV Not including cars parted out
|
11-06-2009, 10:18 AM
|
 |
Senior Member
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Boxborough, Mass, USA
Posts: 892
|
|
 Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfaguy35
We're looking at putting a v6 in one of our Lemons cars. Tired of getting passed by the e30 BMWs. Our biggest hurdle is to do this as cheap as possible to keep the costs within Lemons spec. I'm guessing that a 164 3L motor would be the way to go. What is the HP of one of these motors? I've got a line on a GTV6 so the mounts and bellhousing are not an issuse. What else are we going to need to change as far as the motor goes? If we do this we'll have to step up to 5 lug wheels with the bigger brakes. Lokking forward to all replies.
|
The early GTV6 suspension bolts right onto any Alfetta, and is a nice upgrade. Don't just take the wheels and hubs, take the springs, sway bars, torsion bars, etc. The GTV6 stuff is essentially the same diameters as the Shankle street performance suspension they used to sell for Alfettas.
Don't forget the castor arms, the GTV6 ones bolt on, the Alfetta ones are riveted on. Makes changing castor bushings a LOT easier.
For the engine, I think you can bolt the V6 right to the existing drive shaft and bellhousing. You're going to need the ECU, engine wiring harness, etc.
However, if you have a GTV6 parts car, I'd say why bother? Why not just run the GTV6? It's a lot less work to throw a 3.0 into a GTV6 than it is to retrofit V6 stuff into an Alfetta.
The thing you really need, imo, is a Milano Platinum transaxle. We've been running a Verde with the stock 3.55 limited slip transaxle, and two other Milanos running Platinum (4.10, limited slip) have been able to accelerate right along side us. At the most recent event, we installed the Platinum transaxle, and it made a huge difference.
Question - the LeMons BS judges know a few things about Alfas. So, how much penalty would you get for stuffing a V6 into an Alfetta, vs showing up with a GTV6? I mean, the V6 in the Alfetta is somewhat obvious, but throwing a 3.0 into a GTV6, or a different transaxle, they'll never know.
HTH,
bs
|
11-06-2009, 12:02 PM
|
 |
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Athens Greece
Posts: 682
|
|
|
A good nord 2.0 won't loose to a an e30 BMW no WAY! I raced one in my 105 with a 92 nord spider 2.0 engine , i was slightly faster.
The v6 is not much hp gain considering the added weight, i'd go 1.8turbo or twinspark
|
11-06-2009, 01:20 PM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Novato Ca.
Posts: 258
|
|
|
v6 into an Alfetta
Brian,
We already have the larger torsion bars and sway bars on this car. The real question is which is easier, to swap the motor in or to build a new cage in another car? We've already built two new cars in the last year between the two teams and I don't know if I can talk the team into the time and expense of building another car. You know how long this takes. The only way that would happen is if we sold off one of the cars.
If you look in the Alfetta/GTV6 forum you'll see where I started a thread about building a cheap close ratio transaxle using a Milano Platinium transaxle for 1st and 2nd then using 3rd thru 5th from an Alfetta, doable with some work. I'm supposed to pick up a Platinium transaxle next week so I'll be able to start on this after T'Hill. I'll let you know how this works out.
As far as BS penalty is concerned if I can sell the current motor out of the car then I have some money to play with.
__________________
Wes
Have:
85 Spyder, 79 Alfetta GT 24 Hours of Lemons 2007 Eyetalian Class Champion
Gone: 61 Sprint, 61 Spyder 67 Super, 73 &74 GTV 74 Berlina, 74 & 76 Spyder, 79 GTV Not including cars parted out
Last edited by Alfaguy35; 11-06-2009 at 01:29 PM.
|
11-07-2009, 05:30 AM
|
|
Senior Member
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Boxborough, Mass, USA
Posts: 892
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfaguy35
Brian,
We already have the larger torsion bars and sway bars on this car. The real question is which is easier, to swap the motor in or to build a new cage in another car? We've already built two new cars in the last year between the two teams and I don't know if I can talk the team into the time and expense of building another car. You know how long this takes. The only way that would happen is if we sold off one of the cars.
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfaguy35
If you look in the Alfetta/GTV6 forum you'll see where I started a thread about building a cheap close ratio transaxle using a Milano Platinium transaxle for 1st and 2nd then using 3rd thru 5th from an Alfetta, doable with some work. I'm supposed to pick up a Platinium transaxle next week so I'll be able to start on this after T'Hill. I'll let you know how this works out.
|
I'll have to go there and read it, seems like you're getting into diminishing returns building a close ratio box for a LeMons race. Again, fwiw, we found the stock Platinum box to be a big improvement over what we were running, but then again we still have yet to see fifth gear on any track. I think we were getting over 100 mph at Nelson Ledges.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfaguy35
As far as BS penalty is concerned if I can sell the current motor out of the car then I have some money to play with.
|
I wasn't questioning your ethics, I was calling into consideration how much crap the BS judges might give you in various scenarios. Although in New England, they didn't seem to mind people swapping motors *during* the race. A team called 'Chard Beef' swapped motors THREE TIMES during the last New England event. So that's one option for you (obviously said jokingly).
bs
|
11-07-2009, 09:09 AM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Novato Ca.
Posts: 258
|
|
|
Lemons Stuff
Quote:
Originally Posted by bshorey
I'll have to go there and read it, seems like you're getting into diminishing returns building a close ratio box for a LeMons race. Again, fwiw, we found the stock Platinum box to be a big improvement over what we were running, but then again we still have yet to see fifth gear on any track. I think we were getting over 100 mph at Nelson Ledges.
|
The bottom line is I'm a racer and always looking for that little extra advantage that we help us do well with an Alfa. I don't have alot of interest in running a non Alfa in Lemons. We had a chance at a true $500.00 Miata and I told the guys that if they wanted to run that car go ahead and do it but I was not giving up on the Alfetta. This was at the time when we were having real troubles keeping the head gaskets from blowing. Now that the head gasket problem is solved the whole Miata thing is passed.
Quote:
|
I wasn't questioning your ethics, I was calling into consideration how much crap the BS judges might give you in various scenarios. Although in New England, they didn't seem to mind people swapping motors *during* the race. A team called 'Chard Beef' swapped motors THREE TIMES during the last New England event. So that's one option for you (obviously said jokingly).
|
I hear what you are saying but the Judges like our car and all the effort that we have put into it. Just look at all the nice stuff that Murilee Martin writes about us on Jalopnik.com. After the 2nd race when we had a completely dead motor and a chassis that needed time on the frame rack I was ready to chuck the Alfetta body and run a '81 Spider that I had, but with all the nice things he was writing about us I couldn't just give up on that car. Deep down Judge Murilee wants an Alfa to have an outright win at one of these races. Besides if you feed them well their eyes aren't quite as sharp as they could be.
__________________
Wes
Have:
85 Spyder, 79 Alfetta GT 24 Hours of Lemons 2007 Eyetalian Class Champion
Gone: 61 Sprint, 61 Spyder 67 Super, 73 &74 GTV 74 Berlina, 74 & 76 Spyder, 79 GTV Not including cars parted out
|
| Thread Tools |
|
|
| Display Modes |
 Linear Mode
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|
|
