budget v6 spider makeover - Page 4

AlfaSail · #46 (**permalink**) 04-18-2009, 08:11 AM

Hi AlfaVulcan,

Thank-you for the posts, particularly on the bell housing work.
Planning to do a similar transformation.

What tolerance did you assume for the alignment of the center of the engine crank and the input shaft of the transmission ? I see that you basically accomplished the jig with a piece of wood, bolting the front portion of the bell –housing to the wood and a pilot bolt through to the back have to align them for the welding. It doesn’t look like it would be any better than 50 thousands if that for accuracy. I’m concerned that a miss-alignment will cause problems with transmission input bearing, engine rear bearing or worse.

thanks again for your posting.

regards,

Scott
'69 GTV
'87 Verde
...

**alfavulcan** · #47 (**permalink**) 04-18-2009, 01:31 PM

the wood was just to mount the bellhousing halves. i lined up the 2 piece using a v6 block and a pipe made to just barely rotate in the trans side if the bellhousing [ with input shaft seal removed] to fit to the socket in the rear of the v6 crank i was using. if you moved the centering pipe off center AT ALL it would bind. that said, i may still have to center it with offset bellhousing pins after i check it with a dial indicator after i have the 3.0 crank drilled for the pilot bushing. i know someone here in houston that has a complete alfa 6 zf transmission assembly, but i can't talk him out of it. so, i had to go to plan b. good luck with your project. george

TNTracer · #48 (**permalink**) 04-19-2009, 06:18 PM

Lots of hard work paying off...

**alfavulcan** · #49 (**permalink**) 04-19-2009, 11:31 PM

thanks for the encouragement, but it seems i keep taking things more apart. i am ready to start putting SOMETHING back together. in time i guess.

**alfavulcan** · #50 (**permalink**) 04-20-2009, 08:55 PM

i trimmed off the original front metal airdam and set up the roughly trimmed new airdam. looking at the way it rests on the body, it looks like i will be directing cooling air directly from the high pressure area below the air intake but above the lower air dam. i will most likely cut a couple of air intakes and feed to the radiator and/ or air intake. it fits pretty close. i will map out what mounting tabs i will need to bond onto the back of the airdam this week sometime and then do the final trimming. i still am going to need to blend it withe the fender flares. fortunatly, i kept the lower pieces of the flares that i cut off for bumper clearance with the old s3 bumper. it pays to be an alfa packrat sometimes.

**conedriver** · #51 (**permalink**) 04-21-2009, 06:41 AM

That's a really nice looking spoiler, and will look good with the fender flares (I'll bet that Charlie DeMarco is watching closely). Will you use any kind of front bumper?

Quote:

Originally Posted by alfavulcan

i trimmed off the original front metal airdam and set up the roughly trimmed new airdam. looking at the way it rests on the body, it looks like i will be directing cooling air directly from the high pressure area below the air intake but above the lower air dam. i will most likely cut a couple of air intakes and feed to the radiator and/ or air intake. it fits pretty close. i will map out what mounting tabs i will need to bond onto the back of the airdam this week sometime and then do the final trimming. i still am going to need to blend it withe the fender flares. fortunatly, i kept the lower pieces of the flares that i cut off for bumper clearance with the old s3 bumper. it pays to be an alfa packrat sometimes.

**alfavulcan** · #52 (**permalink**) 04-21-2009, 07:52 AM

thanks, conedriver. it was actually from a 79 spider that i had started on several years ago but after some work decided it was too far gone and bought a gtv6 instead. the spouiler plug was all i saved from it other than parts. charlie is a good guy, thats who i bought the flares from.. george

**alfavulcan** · #53 (**permalink**) 04-21-2009, 08:09 AM

sorry, bumper. as of now i don't plan on using a bumper, but i may mount nerf bars or a short bar to mount a tow bar

**Alfar7** · #54 (**permalink**) 04-21-2009, 07:07 PM

The GTV6/Milano rear engine mounts I have cut apart in the shop to make scatter shields for race cars are magnesium alloy. The transmission bellhousings are aluminum alloy.
Try as I have to stick the scrap pieces together with the rod used to weld up VW & Porsche engine cases as good as it looks, a sharp rap and it is apart.
Took pieces to another race fabrication shop with same results.
Is your front part a transmission bellhousing from a Alfa Sei? Not a Milano
GTV6 motor mount?
Your motor idea in the Spider intriged me. Thought about doing it in my project as I have a couple of built 3 liters in the shop.
Just the welding issue

Haven`t updated my project in some time. Still finishing the body.
Rj
http://www.alfabb.com/bb/forums/spid...nt-effort.html

adelspyder · #55 (**permalink**) 04-22-2009, 08:11 AM

Hi Richard,

I can understand your concerns regarding the Aluminium welding, which I why I suggested the T5/T6 hardening process earlier on.

But at this point of the project I can see that Alfavulcan has many options going forwards - if the hardening and the engine-trans alignment all work out okay, he's got the bellhousing licked.

If he's got problems with either of these, as least he can use the welded bellhousing as the basis of a mould in order to re-cast a new aluminium or magnesiium bellhousing (and Alfavulcan has already shown his capability with fibreglass, moulds and epoxies!). Refacing the surfaces and re-drilling the holes on lathes, etc, could fix any alignment problems, and you could add all sorts of enhancements to a new bellhousing mould (like making it fit the smaller permanent magnet starter motor, different hydraulic clutch mechanisms, etc.).

All the best you guys, I'm looking forward to seeing both your projects moving forwards,

Dino

**alfavulcan** · #56 (**permalink**) 04-22-2009, 11:23 AM

thanks rj and dino. i asked the welder about the weld strength. he was confident it was plenty strong and that the entire assembly was heated to 400+ degrees before welding since aluminum is such a good conductor of heat. i do know the 3/4 plywood base was certainly discolored around the edges from the heat, although i am now kind of suprised he didn't say anything about heat treating, which i will have done next week. using it as a mold may be above my pay grade, but i"ll certainly not rule out trying. i've screwed up lots of stuff before trying new things. sometimes you learn the hard way. george

**Alfar7** · #57 (**permalink**) 04-23-2009, 07:07 AM

If you have remains of the "motor mounts" take pieces of them and pieces of the bell housings and make filings from both. (keep separate)

with a soft torch (non blowing) try to ignite the bell housing filings. Being aluminum they should simply melt. Do the same with the rear cover/mounts if they too melt they are alumn. if they flash off they are magnesium, and welding will not hold, and tempering will do no good.

We have found that GTV6 & Milano clutch covers primarily are magnesuim alloy, but then have found some that are aluminum that are the stronger alloy. (using with 5.5 clutch push type race assemblies, so looking for stronger parts mag is lighter not stronger)

**alfavulcan** · #58 (**permalink**) 04-23-2009, 07:32 AM

i still have all the pieces and that is something i may test this weekend. thanks for the heads up. george

**alfavulcan** · #59 (**permalink**) 05-29-2009, 08:36 PM

finally was able to put down 3 coats of acrylic urethane after life interuptus. plus the fact that i now know how much stuff the attic of my garage will hold. hint- its less than what's up there. 2 broken and 2 cracked rafters repaired, reinforced, and lots of sheetrock and insulation removed. alfa parts were raining down. paint went on pretty well and i will start putting brake boosters, pedels, wiring harness, etc, in.

**alfavulcan** · #60 (**permalink**) 05-29-2009, 08:41 PM

oops, forgot photos