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04-25-2008, 09:52 AM
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Location: Southern California, 50 miles North of LA
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If FWD was the solution ALL racing cars would be FWD. No ?
Claude
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04-25-2008, 10:00 AM
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Location: Bethel, CT
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The solution to what? A dry race track, perhaps. Rally racing? Definitely not. My 164 is not a race car, but a year round daily driver, and it is the better solution than my late M3 in the snow. It's balanced and predictable, exactly what I want when driving on slippery surfaces. There's no one "solution" to proper drive set up, the one that comes closest would have to be awd (a la 164Q4) but even that has it's disadvantages compared to strictly front or rear drive. It's all about choosing the proper application for your driving needs. Be it July or January, the 164 does it for me.
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Ryan
1992 Alfa 164S
2003 Ducati Monster 800S i.e.
2005 VW GTI 1.8 t
ryan kundrat jewelry
Last edited by rkundrat; 04-25-2008 at 10:02 AM.
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04-25-2008, 10:49 AM
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Don’t forget this car had stiff competition (at the time) against the 5 series BMW and the 300E MBZ. In America we prefer to spend $$ on German cars, even more so at that time. But now days there are really not too many of those cars on the road either, yet where I live I see 164's all the time. That alone says something IMHO 
As far as plain goes, I finally got rid of the wife’s 1994 Nissan Altima a couple of years ago. That was a great car (minus the turning radius) I always wanted a white one where I could paint a blue stripe on it and paint the word car on the side. That car today is right up there with all the current competition hands down. If the 164’s were keeping up with current times and being produced it would look completely different. You need to look at the cars of that era and realize they all looked like that, in fact the 164's had much nicer lines than most.
And I agree with the other posts, I drove the hell out of my 164L before I killed the engine. I would own one again without blinking an eye. They perform, handle and are a very comfortable car to use on a daily basis. Not many of the other Alfas can be used in the same manner, I have owned my share and again this is just my opinion. But because of my 164 I began my project car, and when completed that one will run circles around all others that even resemble it.
T
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04-25-2008, 12:12 PM
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Location: Dexter, Michigan USA
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Alfa 164 / FWD
 Quote:
Originally Posted by usatrade
If FWD was the solution ALL racing cars would be FWD. No ?
Claude
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The people watching were amazed that Pat was able to get it on the trailer the way it had stopped precariously and finally one of them asked, "Does that car have FWD?"
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Cheryl
(Not an authority nor SME
on anything, just PATSYF)
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04-25-2008, 12:15 PM
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Location: Southern California, 50 miles North of LA
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Hi,
When I did the launching of the car this was in Europe (in Belgium) and when the car was launched the dealers made a face, they did not like it. the consumers did not like it, the car did not sell well. And the gigantic (and costly) "show" put on by Alfa Romeo to put on every European Formula One track a set of 6 or 8 164's in the hand of race drivers, factory guys and well known people was more than a flop as cars crashed one after the other (live on TV ! ! !)
I only have returned to the USA since a year
So my question (since the begining) was (very simple) to know why that car is so much loved here. And I did not want to start any fight or controverse.
My only answer about racing cars and front wheel drive was an answer to someone suggesting that the 164 V6 was turning circles (on a track) around a 75 Milano V6
That's all.
Claude
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04-25-2008, 12:38 PM
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but this one goes to 11..
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Alfaville
Posts: 1,751
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Like Jason says these are questions that may never get answered satisfactorily for you. It may well be a cultural thing. Why are Jerry Lewis and Mickey Rourke god like in France? how on earth did David Hasselhoff become a major singing star in Germany? Why do Aussies like Vegemite? Things we cannot comprehend here go down easily across the pond and we may never know why.
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currently: 1984 GTV6 (Sabrina) 1992 164L (Jill) 1992 164S (Kelly) 1989 Spider Veloce (Julie)
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04-25-2008, 12:52 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah and Aix, France.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlfaTango1
Well you have to see the context of what was offered to the U.S. market at the time. MB 300 series and BMW 5 series oh and the very scarce Peugeot.
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Hey now, the 300E is a fantastic car. I'm not saying it's better or worse than a 164 but somebody has to sing its praises. I miss mine more than any car I've owned.
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ranwhenparked.blogspot.com
Last edited by alfa75 88; 04-25-2008 at 01:03 PM.
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04-25-2008, 01:12 PM
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Location: Salt Lake City, Utah and Aix, France.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlfaTango1
It may well be a cultural thing.
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It goes both ways. This morning in Marseille I saw an 80s Oldsmobile Cutlass. The owner probably thinks he has a real special car, almost a luxury car, whereas in the U.S. people think of a Cutlass as a $300 beater they don't want to get stuck driving behind, let alone inside it.
I am not comparing the 164 to an Oldsmobuick, just the way they're looked at.
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ranwhenparked.blogspot.com
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04-25-2008, 03:02 PM
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Hi there Alfa 75 88
you were in my neck of the woods ! I lived 25 years in St Tropez and obviously I know Marseille, Aix and all Provence.
I am quite sure you did not see many 75's as battered as the 164's.
I had for two years, in 2005 and 2006 a 1994 cadillac STS in Spain and I was the king of the hill.
If I had a 164 people would have laughed at me.
Claude
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04-25-2008, 03:45 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Ct.
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Iginition System...
The only thing that I think really plagued these cars was the Ignition system. As for the timing belt issue, Yea they could of made it chain driven and that would of been one of the best engines of all time. Other than that I love these cars they are so fun to drive and they are NOT under powered Like most NEW crap thats out there with all the safety crap you dont really need.
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Keep it Lookin Good Pal.
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04-25-2008, 03:58 PM
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As I have said earlier that V6 engine IS one of the best in the world. If any of you know the fastest 0 to 60 MPH car in the world (made in Belgium) it does it with an Alfa V6 engine ! (The car is a Vertigo)
Claude
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04-25-2008, 04:27 PM
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Registered Alfa Addict
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Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Tempe, Arizona-US
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usatrade
Hi,
When I did the launching of the car this was in Europe (in Belgium) and when the car was launched the dealers made a face, they did not like it. the consumers did not like it, the car did not sell well. And the gigantic (and costly) "show" put on by Alfa Romeo to put on every European Formula One track a set of 6 or 8 164's in the hand of race drivers, factory guys and well known people was more than a flop as cars crashed one after the other (live on TV ! ! !)
I only have returned to the USA since a year
So my question (since the begining) was (very simple) to know why that car is so much loved here. And I did not want to start any fight or controverse.
My only answer about racing cars and front wheel drive was an answer to someone suggesting that the 164 V6 was turning circles (on a track) around a 75 Milano V6
That's all.
Claude
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Funny you mention Belgium!
I have so many customers there. They don't seem a bit shy driving around in a 164. I have many customers in NORWAY, FRANCE, GERMANY, ITALY, SWEDEN and others, all 164 owners and very big on the car, big 164 clubs and all there.
I think that maybe your not seeing the whole picture, therefore the confusion.
Maybe you would not be laughed at but more looked at as a connessuier. Seems a bit childish to worry about what others think about your car?
Like I said I have had people from all walks of life comment positively on the my own 164.
There is an obvious sour taste in your mouth about this car. So let it go! I am not sure why you even care if you don't even own one? Seems like a waste of your time? Maybe spend more time on vehicles you like and spend more time contemplating why you like those vehicles.
I can say this, the 164 does it all. Is it the best car in the world, no way. Not sure if there is one.
As some have said must be a cultural thing or something. If it did not do well in Belgium and you are from there, maybe that's your answer? Maybe the Belgium mentality/Taste/Preference did not take well to the 164 (obvious from marketing you did, sales numbers, etc) and therefore I think we have your answer.
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04-25-2008, 08:27 PM
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Well first off I have been in Italian cars since I was approx 5-6 months old. For those of us who wanted a new Alfa in the 90's the only choices were the Spider and the 164.
Read the US car magazines of that time and their roadtests of the 164. They all absolutely loved the Alfa's "soul" compared to the German and Swede offerings at that time.
The 164 for a sedan is damn good looking. Beautiful nose to tail body crease gently rising front to back, only Pininfarina could have designed her. Compare her to her contemporaries and she looks pretty timeless...the BMW 5 series is pretty blocky in comparison.
Did I mention that the 164 is basically the most technologically advanced and also the fastest Alfa produced? I did say fastest by the way...
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87 Maserati Biturbo Spyder, 26k miles
91 Alfa Romeo 164S, 40k miles
96 Corvette Grand Sport, 10k miles
Former Alfa's (Dads)
59 Giulietta Sprint
65 2600 Sprint
74 Berlina 2000
76 GTV
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04-25-2008, 10:01 PM
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Boy, I am glad to see that most of you here in the US did not like the BMW, MB, Saabs of those days as on the contartery they were the "things" to have back in Europe. The only thing (as a european guy) I do not agree with (about the 164) is the styling.
But no one can discuss tastes of another person.
So, I do not like BMW, MB nor Saabs nor Volvo's I really hated the looks of the 164 so I went Jaguar for a few years as a daily driver (but with always Alfas in the garages (two 75 V6, one 75 4 cyl, two old GTV's and one 82 Spider - as well as a Honda Aerodeck for my wife).
I later acquired a BMW 735 bought from a friend in need of money. Good car, fast, reliable but nowhere near a Jag or an Alfa for humpteen reasons.
But this away from the 164 thread.
So good you guys love your FWD 164's at least they keep you with the Alfa spirit in mind.
Claude
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04-25-2008, 11:54 PM
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Location: Salt Lake City, Utah and Aix, France.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usatrade
Hi there Alfa 75 88
you were in my neck of the woods ! I lived 25 years in St Tropez and obviously I know Marseille, Aix and all Provence.
I am quite sure you did not see many 75's as battered as the 164's.
I had for two years, in 2005 and 2006 a 1994 cadillac STS in Spain and I was the king of the hill.
If I had a 164 people would have laughed at me.
Claude
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Oh and, I'd take my Fiat over a Cadillac. Just a personal preference..
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ranwhenparked.blogspot.com
Last edited by alfa75 88; 04-26-2008 at 12:06 AM.
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