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alfa montreal head bolts removal tool?

9K views 43 replies 11 participants last post by  Gabor K. 
#1 ·
Hi

am looking for a tool to remove the head bolts on an alfa montreal. It is an of set 17mm wrench. If anyone has an original or an Hazet tool (or a home made tool) that they have no need for anymore..let me know I am a buyer..
Hervé
 
#3 ·
I have this one from Hazet, chrom vanadium and same good quality like Stahlwille and Gedore. All are German and I guess they all are made by ONE machine... :) http://themotoringshop.com/pdf/special_ww_07.pdf

I am sure, tool shops in USA will sell you the same tools. Take the original tool, Dirk made an own one 25 years ago what worked quite good (to see on Bruce' homepage) but I gave him the Hazet one as "flowers", ha.
Hannelore
 

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#7 ·
There is a Snapon socket that will work.

The homemade tool shown by Montigirl has been duplicated by Totally Alfa, and is the one I use most. However, he appears to be currently unavailable.

The Snapon tool has a more restricted range, so is slower to use. Sometimes it fits into a corner better than the Totally Alfa tool, so I'm glad I bought both.

I was unable to locate Hazet here in the US. I had to special order the Snapon tool, but it finally showed up.
 
#10 ·
Totally Alfa



Alas, this is on the home page of Gary's website.

"Due to family ill health and commitments I have had to temporarily suspend taking any new orders on the TotallyAlfa website until mid February 2016. All the product and background information is still available but I have disabled the Shopping Basket and Checkout.
All existing orders will be honoured and dispatched as soon as I can. If you have any concerns about existing orders please contact me: "


I have sent a couple of emails to his private email, but have received no reply.
 
#12 · (Edited)
I have two very similar 17mm 'nut wrench' tools. One, borrowed from Tom Sanor, worked pretty well and is trim and compact. It is tool number: A 5 0191. Padlock Lock Hardware accessory Metal





The other 17mm tool I bought from Jim G. here on the ABB is too 'clunky' for most of the Montreal head nuts and is clocked a little off. It is tool number: A 5 0190 (I believe it is for those difficult to remove drive shaft nuts). Metal





Mark
 
#13 · (Edited)
Right tools ?

I have two very similar 17mm 'nut wrench' tools. One, borrowed from Tom Sanor, worked pretty well and is trim and compact. It is tool number: A 5 0191.
You mean these tools ?
 

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#15 ·
As with an earlier post, using these tools the reading on the torque wrench will be incorrect. The correct value can be calculated, but it is a cumbersome process.
 
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#16 ·
Tool

They are easy to make. I`ll find mine and take a pic.
Re: torque values, these engines have a very low head torque specification, as do All the Alfa head torque specs.
on all these engines with 12mm studs the torque should be 70 lbft if you have an interest in preventing the very common head gasket failures on the engines, in particular the Montreal...
 
#18 ·
There is a discussion on Taylor's website about the risk of pulling head studs out of the block with excessive tension (as revealed by torque value).

I'm happy with 70 lb-ft on a clean and well lubed stud.

Depending upon the wrench being used and the length of offset caused by a "staggered" socket, the result could easily be 80 pounds of torque when the wrench reads only 70. That might become tragic.

Sometimes you have to use offset adapters just to reach the fastener. Just do the correcting math first.

The tool I got from Totally Alfa fits all positions, although I sometimes use an extension rather than bother to remove some things.
 
#19 · (Edited)
DPeterson3 said:
I'm happy with 70 lb-ft on a clean and well lubed stud.
Shouldn´t that be a matter of course before tightening any head nut/stud ?? You´re lecturing about tool offset, but clean and oiled threads are prior condition for reassembly, right ?

I´ve never had any problems with 70 lb-ft on any Alfa 12mm head stud - and for the early 11mm studs on 1300-1600 engines 60 lb-ft also work perfectly. The only time pulling a stud out of block happened to me when a PO or workshop had tried to repair a corroded thread seat but only used half of the depth of a standard Alfa thread for an insert. This couldn´t work.

Btw: I´ve never used these factory tools. They´ve been part of a bunch of tools I´ve collected from a former dealer.
 
#22 ·
Yes, of course clean and lubed should be a prerequisite. Frankly, I've seen many a hobbiest get that part wrong, so it helps to "lecture" about it.

Old, damaged threads that are insufficiently lubed can cause quite a torsion to be put onto the stud that was not intended. If one is using an offset socket such as some of those pictured before, the builder will be putting more "torque" (or torsion) on the stud than he realizes, and probably more tension as well. That's a recipe for pulling a stud.

Some Alfa blocks are easier to replace than a Montreal block.

The Totally Alfa tool should be fairly easy to mock up at home, if you're handy with a tig welder and making a good jig to hold stuff where you want it.
 
#23 ·
I'm looking for the height measurement of an original montreal head nut wrench. I need it measured from the bottom of the box end wrench to the top of the tang.

I would also be interested in the measurement of the totally alfa tool. But would also like the measurement of an original to make sure of the height.

Thanks
 
#24 ·
Here are a couple of pics of my head nut sockets. The longer one is a Totally Alfa unit, the fancy, shiny one is Snap On. Guess which costs more? Guess which works better?

The Snap On is part number FRMX17
 

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#25 ·
The snap on one for price. I've had one for about 30 years now. Works great for undoing the fuel injection lines from the spica pump. I'm guessing I paid a lot less then you did.

Thanks for the measurements. Can you give me the exact measurement on the totally alfa one? I can't really tell because of the angle.
 
#26 ·
The above pic suggests 115 mm from the bottom face of rhe wrench "foot" to the top of the drive insertion body. The length is not critical. So long as the upper drive insertion bar is well clear of the cam cover, you're good.

The Totally Alfa tool works great. I hope Gary resurfaces. He does a great service for us.
 
#28 · (Edited)
#33 ·
If Totally Alfa comes back on line, would you please let me know?


Have you looked under the hood of an SM?


A college friend, fellow bicycle racer and accounting major, now "Mike the Mechanic" owns a beautifully restored Citroen SM. I've heard horror stories about their 'pneumatic plumbing issues' but did not know about the timing chain. Fortunately he is in the proper position to maintain this type of vehicle. He is a French car enthusiast and actually located our 1st Touring Roadster in Alabama.

It was, all at the same time, brilliant and tragically flawed. In other words, much like the Alfas, and some of my ex-wives. Yes, we can all see the common thread here.

Yup, all too common! Perfect description.

Mark
 
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