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Old 12-18-2007, 05:21 AM
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carlo carlo is offline
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8 Tipo 33 for sale

Some of us were already waiting for those cars being offered....
The eight cars come from the former Rosso Bianco Collection in Germany.
Here they are.... Kidston - Accelerate your collection

I just wanted to share this information. no further discussion about the originality intended

Btw, the chassis numbers are:

75033.004 1967 Periscopica Spyder
75033.005 1967 Mugello Spyder
75033.014 1968 Targa Florio Spyder
75033.016 1968 LM Long Tail Coupe
75033.031 1968 Daytona Coupe
75080.003 1971 Targa Florio Spyder
11572.007 1972 Spyder Corsa
11512.012 1976 Spyder Corsa

Best regards
Ciao Carlo
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Old 12-18-2007, 07:53 AM
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dretceterini dretceterini is offline
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I get first pick? I'll take this one..75033.004 1967 Periscopica Spyder
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Old 12-18-2007, 03:13 PM
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This is mine:

75033.031 1968 Daytona Coupe

or next pick would be the LM long tail. I'll get the wife to buy a Loto ticket
Pete
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Old 12-18-2007, 03:47 PM
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cstlhn cstlhn is offline
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Peter Kaus was a very nice man and a great enthusiast. What a shame to see the cars scatter. When will this sale be held?
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Old 12-18-2007, 04:12 PM
Cris Cris is offline
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Wild. Wasn't there a Stradale in the collection?

Cris
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Old 12-19-2007, 01:56 AM
kroehl kroehl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carlo View Post
Some of us were already waiting for those cars being offered....

I just wanted to share this information. no further discussion about the originality intended
Please DO discuss the originality, if you don't mind. I love this stuff. There appears to be some doubt wrt to the chassisnumbers but Kidston knows his stuff and I expect him to be forthright in his description but what do I know?

It is extremely unfortunate that the Rosso Bianco collection is being broken. I expect that this was not the intention when Kaus sold the lot and if I were him I'd try to stop it. Obviously I don't know the wording of the contract but surely this was not what he had in mind.
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Old 12-19-2007, 03:21 AM
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I'd also take the Daytona Coupe. There's another one for sale at the moment, I think through Gregor Fisken in London.

It would be rather nice if Alfa Romeo themselves took this opportunity to either take them all for the Museum or to fill the gaps in their collection!

Alex.
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Old 12-19-2007, 01:50 PM
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MALDI MALDI is offline
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I would like to see the new owners take them to the track. From the descriptions it sounds like it has been awhile since any of them received an Italian tune up.
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Old 12-19-2007, 05:25 PM
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I'm just curious.How much would these cars fetch at auction?
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Old 12-19-2007, 05:31 PM
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In the neighborhood of a 3/4 of a million to 1.5 million dollars each, assuming they are all real cars with substantiated histories.
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Old 12-19-2007, 05:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kroehl View Post
It is extremely unfortunate that the Rosso Bianco collection is being broken. I expect that this was not the intention when Kaus sold the lot and if I were him I'd try to stop it. Obviously I don't know the wording of the contract but surely this was not what he had in mind.
While some might find it unfortunate (I'm not sure why?) there is really nothing anybody can do about it ... people hit tough times and need to sell sometimes (not saying this has happened) or have lost interest.

Unless we cough up with the cash we cannot say or do anything .
Pete
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Old 12-19-2007, 06:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dretceterini View Post
In the neighborhood of a 3/4 of a million to 1.5 million dollars each, assuming they are all real cars with substantiated histories.
ok wow! not exactly affordable machinery

But they look incredible.Hopefully they will go to a good home
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Old 12-20-2007, 01:11 AM
kroehl kroehl is offline
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While some might find it unfortunate (I'm not sure why?) there is really nothing anybody can do about it
Pete
I find it unfortunate because the Rosso Bianco collection was quite extensive and a great visit. When Louwman bought the collection it was supposed to be rolled into the Dutch National Car Collection which would have been great to see.

Now I fear a lot of the cars will disappear into private collections, not to be seen again for a long while.

....oh well. Were I less handsome and more rich....
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Old 12-20-2007, 03:21 AM
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Quote:
I find it unfortunate because the Rosso Bianco collection was quite extensive and a great visit. When Louwman bought the collection it was supposed to be rolled into the Dutch National Car Collection which would have been great to see.

Now I fear a lot of the cars will disappear into private collections, not to be seen again for a long while.
I can only agree to that!
Some mounths ago there was an article about the sale of the collection in a German Oldtimer mag. Indeed the collection was sold with the condition that the new owner should keep it together.
But from the first day it was not a surprise that there is not enough space in the National Car Collection to exhibit all cars of the Rosso Bianco Collection.
So the first cars were entered in different European auctions.
Being confronted with that, the new owner claimed that he "just" sells those cars that were double now after connecting both collections. Further the sold cars were of "minor" value as their racing sucess was not too interesting, due to their point of view.
But in my opinion selling the complete lot of Tipo 33s is indeed another thing than getting rid of car with "minor interest".

For me it is a real shame that the Rosso Bianco Collection is getting more and more destroyed just for making cash
Btw, Mr. Kaus offered his collection as a gift to the city of Frankfurt before it was sold to the Netherlands. The only condition of Kaus was that the collection should be kept together and the administration just had to find a building where to show the cars.
Anyway, Frankfurt wasn't interested in this offer and today we see that the former largest collection of sports cars is being destroyed

Best regards
Ciao Carlo
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Old 12-21-2007, 09:59 PM
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Odin Odin is offline
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Smile Somebody is not honest

Hi Carlo,
are you shure about that? Kauss was a difficult man, like most very rich people. He sold before some important cars, like the Zagato Collection. Can't believe, that he didn't know, that Louwman is the owner of Bonhams. Most of the big Collectors are selling, Bardinon, Shirley, Ecclestone, Kogan. None of them, needs cash.
I think, Louwmans intention, was everytime to make cash. Telling, he want to sell some minor cars, the whole French luxory Car Collection, from Talbot to Delahayé??? All the Can-Am cars, the Maseratis??
In my opinion, he was not honest, he only wanted cash. How many cars are still there, 20% from the collection? Why Kauss didn't stop him?

But why he is selling the important Tipo 33 Collection, with Kidston and not with Bonhams?? Why, for some cars, were never before mentioned a chassisnumber? Kidston is assuming the numbers.
Fact is Peter Kauss bought a lot of T 33 parts and most cars were built from spares, by Erwin Derichs in Germany. Kauss wanted the whole T 33 Collection complete, same happened with other cars, the TZ-2 had no papers and no history.
The difference is, Kauss did it for his collection, but the 'new' owner is trying to make cash, even with 'homemade' history.
The Mugello Spider is unique, the Perescopia, there are only two more and not for sale, why they didn't went to Monterey, or to the Gstaat Auction??
Think about it.
Regards
Jörg

Last edited by Odin; 12-21-2007 at 10:20 PM.
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