1973 Alfa Romeo GTV Chop Top Convertable For Sale

[NikosF]

Cool - and once again - good luck.

[GTVMAN]

Does anyone have a really good condition 164, GTV, or even mabey a berlina they would trade for?

[magista]

You probably will have to offer up some cash along with the GTV chop for any sort of decent trade.

[Roadtrip]

Dan, if you've got white smoke coming out the exhaust at startup, it probably has a head gasket that ready to blow anytime. If you can't find a buyer and don't have the time and space to part it out, you might take it down to APE and see if they want it.

[GTVMAN]

Not funny, and it aint a head gasket, I checked every sign there is to check, the radiator cap for creamy foam, the oil dipstick, the compression, etc... The coolant is full in the overflow tank and the reservoir and isn't leaking at all! I got stopped by the cops yesterday because of the white smoke, I got a ticket and the cop said it is the most smoke he had ever seen in his life coming from a car! I am going to change out the spark plugs because I think one of them is burnt out... (it sounds like it is only running on 3 of the 4 cylinders... I love the car and all, but when you have stuff go wrong with it and when you have driven it only a week out of the almost 2 months that you have owned it, it aint cool, you start hating the car... my friends are trying to convince me to go american too (because of the extremely easy repair (compared to italian cars, my friend changed a head gasket on his Nomad in 5 hours), and dirt cheap parts): buy an old mustang (60s) with a 289 or a 6 cylinder, or a Dodge Charger (66-67) which I think is the most beutiful of the muscle cars (with a 318 or a 6 cylinder for good gas mileage) or a 67-68 Camaro with a 6 cylinder... all with 4 speeds (bah), but they get like 17-25mpg with those engines... I mean if the charger or mustang can handle like it did in "Bullit" (going 90-100mph on a San Francisco hill and making a 90* turn without even spinning out in the least) or in "Et Homme Et Une Femme" (A Man and a Woman), where the guy plays a race car driver for Ford France and drives a Mustang for the Monaco race going hella fast and even in the snow in some parts doing 180* turns and with amazing handling... I don't know how I will be able to live with myself if I give up and buy a car that is way easier to work on and where parts are dirt cheap... I mean I don't know how I can live without an Italian car, ITALIAN... I don't ask for much: An amazing design, at least 15mpg, good handling, somewhat good acceleration, must have vinyl or leather seats, must be a stickshift, must be RWD... I aint askin for much...

[John M]

Hey Daniel:

RT is right. You have most likely a blown head gasket. And for that matter, its a right of passage for Alfa owners. Not uncommon to replace the HG. But luckily, its an easy fix.

Symptoms initially show themselves as smoking heavy on deceleration and idle. Coolant in the overflow is not a surprise. On acceleration the combustion gases pressurize the radiator and force coolant to the overflow. On decceleration, coolant will push back into the combustion chamber. Eventually you will smoke constantly as it progresses.

If you want to test it, you have to get a block tester and test for combustion gas in the radiator. A block tester is a suction tube with testing solution within that changes color if it detects combustion gas. You suck the air out the top of the radiator with the car running using the block tester. The air passes through the test solution....and if it changes color you have combustion gas in the radiator....and a blown head gasket.

And you had better hope that is all it is. In any case....white smoke = coolant in the combustion chamber of one of the cylinders. If not a HG, then that leaves you with liner seals (a huge PIA), a cracked head (major money), or something even worse. No matter what is causing the smoke, you had better park it before you bend or break a rod, eat a hole through a piston and/or break rings, or trash every bearing on your crank and ruin the crank.

In short, if its smoking heavy white smoke and you are still driving it....its just a matter of time until you trash the motor.

Can you fix it? Sure, with a little help from the board. Its a pretty easy fix for a head gasket.

Best of Luck,
John M

[magista]

Collective Alfa wisdom once again points to a blown head gasket. Don't you think it's odd that everyone keeps telling you this or that there is something majorly wrong with the engine and you should not be driving it?

Bottomline is you paid something like $1k for that car. You get what you pay for. You can put all the lipstick you want on a pig and it's still a pig. Get what I'm saying.? You will never ever in a million years be able to sell it for $5k nor trade it for another "decent" Alfa. It just won't happen. You have a running parts car, that is barely running at this point.

The car is a chopped GTV with no chassis reinforcement, obviously has a blown head gasket, the electrical is screwed up, the paint ain't great and God knows what else is about to go wrong with it. Why do you think the guy sold it to you for so cheap?

You can either take the time with it to learn how to work on Alfas, what they are all about and listen to the old timers (these ppl know their sh*t) or you can not own Alfas. You have to be realistic about the responsibilities of owning one. They are not for everyone.

Just because you own one you are not going to be transformed into an F1 pilot. Just because you own a Mustang you will not be transformed into Bullit either.

I'm sorry to be harsh, I can be a dick at times, but dude...you really need to understand what this whole Alfa thing is all about. I'm sure you will be p*ssed at me for writing this and I'm sorry but I'm just calling it as I see it at this point.

I do wish you luck with it and think it'd be a great car for you to learn how to work on yourself...but not use as a daily driver at this point.

[aafoon]

That white smoke defintely sounds like head gasket problems, all of the symptoms points towards it.But to each there own.

[boggissimo]

Quote:

Originally posted by GTVMAN my friends are trying to convince me to go american too (because of the extremely easy repair (compared to italian cars, my friend changed a head gasket on his Nomad in 5 hours), and dirt cheap parts): buy an old mustang (60s) with a 289 or a 6 cylinder, or a Dodge Charger (66-67) which I think is the most beutiful of the muscle cars (with a 318 or a 6 cylinder for good gas mileage) or a 67-68 Camaro with a 6 cylinder... all with 4 speeds (bah), but they get like 17-25mpg with those engines...

[74GTVEEE]

I lost a HG in my 74 GTVEEE last Jan. It was my fault. I did not have the head decked after the rebuild. The shop had to take off .012 to get it flat. These .012 were right where the gasket failed. This is an easy job.

I removed the head in about 2 hrs had it decked and the next day had it back running in 3 hrs more and I was completely taking my time, reading the manual sometimes 2 or three times. Typically before I undertake a procedure I am not familliar with, I will read the procedure about 30 times until I can almost recite it. This may not help you but it makes me much more comfortable.

I blew the HG in a Porsche club event at @ 88 mph. Big fat white smoke, removed the plugs and could see the coolant on the pistions, on the plugs etc. If you attempt this, do not be surprised if the car continues to smoke for a 100 miles or so. Depending on the level of the blow, coolant will continue to burn for sometime.

One more reccomendation, make sure you buy a Reinz HG. That is all I will use. The others don't have enough teflon in them and can be a real b*t*h to removed when blown. And make sure do the torque procedure by the book, including the re-torque.



Good luck

[italcarguy]

i seriously think you should find a gtv that needs a motor and transplant all your parts over. head gaskets on a gtv are a breeze. once you are used to doing them you can easily do it in 1-2 hours (not including down time while head is being surfaced). your alfa will get better gas milage. if you sell it, you are gonna have to add money to move up to a better car so why not just get a gtv with blown motor and do the swap. great thing is you have a parts car (your chop top) and you cna even ebay off parts you don't need. hit up your local alfa club, someone has gotta have a gtv with your name on it!

[magista]

Amen to that. You'll still have a nice running GTV and a parts car. That is truly ideal.

[Roadtrip]

Dan - I really wasn't trying to be sarcastic about see if APE wants it. Judging from your other posts, it doesn't seem like you have garage facilities to devote to a tear down for parts. A HG isn't a big deal on an Alfa. I've got a Jeep Cherokee right now with a oil leak out the HG, and that's going to be a . . . . well, real inconvenient to replace. I'd much rather replace an Alfa gasket.

Time to be realistic here. You've got a very unique car there . . . one with lots of very fundamental problems . . . namely the frame and top issues. I think you yourself complained about the cowl shake . . . . no doubt from the now very flexible frame. I can't imagine anyone familiar with Alfas, buying it for anything other than parts. When the body was cut and customized, it's value as an Alfa Romeo GTV evaporated. However, if you really like it, fix it and keep it. Personally, I don't think it's a safe car with the frame weakened like that. Someday you're liable to get into an emergency manuever and that car may do something completely unexpected and real scary.

As far as the improvements in the motor, if I were a buyer interested in the parts, you wouldn't get any more for it than an ordinary motor. Darn difficult to prove what parts are internal . . . Sort of telling someone that it was "just overhauled" but there's no documentation or disinterested 3rd party source to verify.

You don't have a tremendous amount of money in it, so keeping it as a donor/parts car is certainly an option, if you have the space, but it sound like you don't.

Owning an older Alfa is not a turnkey operation. You should have garage/small workshop facilities, or availability of a good local Alfa mechanic . . . . and deep pockets. If you don't have these things, then another more common make of car would suit your lifestyle.

Nobody's trying to trash you here. We're just trying to help . . . . otherwise I, Papajam, John M, Magista, et al would just blow you off and not spend time to even answer your posts.

I'm sorry your first try at Alfa ownership was disappointing, but there's been alot of people in your shoes. Lots who had stars in their eyes and bought rust buckets thinking that they're going to restore them, only to find that they're looking at $5000 worth of bodywork alone, but could have spent $3000 more and bought a really nice solid car with good paint. Moral of the story, don't go cheap when buying your car. If you're not a retired bodyman/mechanic with complete workshop facilities, buy the best possible car and don't be cheap about it. There are bargains to be found (I got my Spider for $3000 off Ebay with a no-rust body and excellent paint, very good mechanicals), but most people that are selling a good Alfa, know it's good. and that goes DOUBLE for GTVs.

[Sniady]

White smoke?

How many quartz of oil did you pour in the engine, when you did that oil change?

[GTVMAN]

I poured 7 in... and the white smoke is from the tailpipe not from the engine... my oil is at max... Thanks to the help of papajam I fixed my taillight and brakelight problem in just a few minutes! It probably is a headgasket, I need to get tools though for the car, so I will work on it when I get my next paycheck this friday! Think Pat Bradens Alfa Bibles step by step guide with pictures on how to replace a head gasket would be the best guide to use right?