164 LS or 164 Q help needed

[Ian Evans]

Gents,

Having a spot of trouble convincing the California Smog referee that Alfa used thinwall stainless headers on any V6 engines. Now they did not in my case, Milano transplant into '81 Spider, but the short sighted referee will not cut me any slack unless I can show him evidence,

Ideally if someone can scan a picture from a workshop manual showing the non Cast Iron exhaust manifolds as used on the 164Q and the '94 164LS?, or if someone has a picture of their engine with the factory headers. Best option is a scan from a workshop manual.

He wants me to install cast iron manifolds, which is not an option due to space.

Otherwise, the car will appear on Ebay for sale only outside of California.

Thanks in advance,

Ian

'81 SuperSpider 2.5L

[Alfissimo Int.]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian Evans Gents, Having a spot of trouble convincing the California Smog referee that Alfa used thinwall stainless headers on any V6 engines. Now they did not in my case, Milano transplant into '81 Spider, but the short sighted referee will not cut me any slack unless I can show him evidence, Ideally if someone can scan a picture from a workshop manual showing the non Cast Iron exhaust manifolds as used on the 164Q and the '94 164LS?, or if someone has a picture of their engine with the factory headers. Best option is a scan from a workshop manual. He wants me to install cast iron manifolds, which is not an option due to space. Otherwise, the car will appear on Ebay for sale only outside of California. Thanks in advance, Ian '81 SuperSpider 2.5L

[elite38868]

Ian, you need to be more clear. Do you have a spider or 164? Or a spider with a 164 24v engine?

[AlfaTango1]

I'm surprised he's not shooting you down based on the V6 tranplant alone.

[Greg Gordon]

Ian, you say it's a Milano engine, so that's a 12 valver. The Alfa SZ used stainless steel headers on the 12 valve Alfa V6, but it was never sold here. I fear that if you show him evidence from a 24 valver he will point out it's a different engine. This is going to be a problem. I wish I could help more.

Greg

[Ian Evans]

It's a 12 valve Milano engine in an '81 spider. With the O2 sensor and a new cat, he's willing to pass it provided it passes on the gas emissions, which it will, the stupid thing is it fails based upon the manifolds only. The 164 intake, although modified to turn at the firewall was less of a concern to him.

So, not being there when the engine was fitted, I'm sure that stock 164Q manifolds were used and were not modified in ANY way.

Note to self: the next time you upgrade an engine in California, do so with a pre-1976 vehicle...

[Alfissimo Int.]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian Evans It's a 12 valve Milano engine in an '81 spider. Fact is the headers were specially constructed. With the O2 sensor and a new cat, he's willing to pass it provided it passes on the gas emissions, which it will, the stupid thing is it fails based upon the manifolds only. The 164 intake, although modified to turn at the firewall was less of a concern to him. So, not being there when the engine was fitted, I'm sure that stock 164Q manifolds were used and were not modified in ANY way. That's my story and I'm sticking to it... Note to self: the next time you upgrade an engine in California, do so with a pre-1976 vehicle...

[Ian Evans]

Information on the manifolds is hard to obtain, I was told by the builder that 1994 164 LS or "Q", stock manifolds bolted right on.

[Greg Gordon]

Ian, I think you should edit some of your posts, big brother is out there.

If this were my car I would fab up some cast iron log manifolds by combining stock Alfa V6 manifold flanges and logs from an American V6. They will flow poorly, but look pleasing to an inspector's eye. Of course they will pollute more than what you have, but the smog police don't seem to care about that.

[Alfissimo Int.]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian Evans Information on the manifolds is hard to obtain, I was told by the builder that 1994 164 LS or "Q", stock manifolds bolted right on.