The 164 package deal

[Alfisto Steve]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlfaTango1 Hey my next 164 will probably be a 164LS auto. I have four five speed cars and my 63 Impala is a auto but is not a daily driver and when you've driven a stick for YEARS having an auto for s&g socal traffic is a god send.

[Bill77]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gprocket Hello, My name is Rich and I'm an Alfaholic...

[gprocket]

We made it!

Last Wednesday the family (less one conscientious college student) flew down to pick up the trio of Alfa’s. A couple of days of sun and relaxation was just what the doctor ordered – it’s been a rough winter back home (it snowed 4” on Friday). Refreshed, we headed out Saturday morning up I-75 with the cars in formation (kind of a cool sight I might add). The #3 car (project car) was running a little hot and a little low oil pressure but also felt the tightest of the three. Although the PO had replaced the AC pump (and serviced the whole system) prior to our arrival, the pump seized almost immediately so I drove without AC. Also no radio so needless-to-say I got to drive that one. But the weather was pleasant and the slippery design of the 164 coach allowed for 80 mph cruising with the windows down and acceptable wind noise. Overall the cars ran great – the other two giving essentially no trouble throughout the trip.

The plan had been to take the 1,200 mile trip in three days so as not to overtax the cars (or the occupants) with overnight stops in Athens, GA (family) and Lexington, KY. But plans changed a bit when my son’s girl friend flew in to the Atlanta airport and then they drove the final 850 miles in one day with the #1 car (PO’s daily driver). I wanted to stick together but the cars were running so well that I felt comfortable splitting up at that point.

The other two cars stuck to the game plan and headed out Sunday for Lexington. Again the #2 car drove fine but the #3 car really started to heat up as we traversed the mountains. After about 6 hours of driving the #3 thermostat light came on. I didn’t trust the temperature sensor (the motor seemed cool) but I still was a little uneasy. Dropping down to 60 MPH kept the engine temperature at bay but towards the end of the day it was clear I was pushing my luck. Figuring the chances of finding an Alfa repair shop in the dark on a Sunday night in the Appalachian’s might be a bit of a long shot, we decided to find a hotel at the next exit. As soon as I pulled off the “check engine” light came on and I could see heat waves coming up from under the hood – not a great sign. Fortunately there was a gas station a few hundred feet away so I zipped there. A quick check revealed a dry radiator but a quick run to the Walmart next door remedied that.

I didn’t see any obvious leak in the radiator and with few options I trusted my gut that the car would return to a safe operating temperature. So the next morning I pulled out of the hotel parking lot and back on I-75. Within a mile the engine warning light was on. This time steam was billowing from the motor bay so I just pulled off the side of the road. While I let the motor cool down I punched in “car repair” in my GPS and found to my relief European Motors just a mile away and right off the next exit. I called them and although they don’t work on Alfa’s as general rule they at least knew what an Alfa was. Also, they specialized in Saab’s so I figured they would find some kinship with a 164.

I limped over there just as the mechanics were showing up for work and they graciously pulled my car ahead of their other work to inspect the car. Fearing that this could be a multi-day project I elected to hop in the #2 and continue on our way. A couple hours later the shop called to say that a plugged radiator, bad thermostat and a cracked overflow tank were the immediate issues. Parts would have to be ordered and since they hadn’t done one before it was going to be T&M charges. I’ll drive down next weekend and trailer it back up. They were again gracious enough to allow me to store the car there in the interim.

The good news is that the overheating did not damage the motor. It starts up and runs fine with plenty of power. Nothing melted or warped as I caught it early enough. The steam was from the cracked overflow spraying anti freeze on the motor. No water in the oil or white smoke out the tailpipe.

So we made it home in the #2 without incident. Final tally:

#1 Car: First place overall. 1,560 miles without incident
#2 Car: Second place overall. 2,200 miles with a broken cruise control stalk (Super glue repair)
#3 Car: DNF. 897 miles with a plugged cooling system.

Overall I was very pleased with the cars and their condition and their performance. Mechanically the PO was a real wizard and knew these cars inside and out. The only reason the #3 was troubled was that he had not used the car in the two years that he owned it. Being southern cars I was equally pleased that the bodies suffered none of the rust issues we deal with up here and were straight. OTAH, the paint does not fair so well down there and all three cars suffered from sun fading and dried leather. But these are things I can deal with. I was more concerned about dealing with the complexity of the V6 and the electronics that my older Alfa’s don’t have.

While a bit sedate off the line and around town, the real merit of the 164’s (I had never driven one before this BTW) showed as the speedometer rose. My son reported that he had #1 up to 125 MPH (needless-to-say this was after split up!)and it was smooth all the way. We cruised 80 -90 MPH all day (except as noted above) and felt little strain. These are very nice cars.

Today I turn in my leased 2006 Volvo S60. While a nice car and superior in a number of ways, I have concluded that it just is a machine without a soul. I just can’t get passionate about the car and I am mostly looking forward to the return from the dealer in my 164.

[Zunige]

Rich,
It's good to hear that you found a good shop and at least the problem seems manageable. There are some great alfisti, and BBers, in Lexington. I would suggest you post your planned schedule for when you go to pick up the car...

Best regards,

[Alfisto Steve]

Good to hear you got 2/3 of group buy home without incident. I am referring more to the 125 mph trick than the radiator issue. Sure hope the car had good at least H-rated tires!

I have a teenager understand my concern.

[ChazzyD]

You mean to tell me, your son drove a 17 year old car at 125 miles an hour with ZERO knowledge of the condition of either it, or the tires! Knock some sense into that young man! That was a dumb stunt, I must say! But glad you are home safe and have 164s in the driveway. Let the wrenching begin. Congrats on the purchase.
Charles

[gprocket]

Teenager + Alfa - Parental Observation = Dumb Stunt...

[Alfisto Steve]

Sounds like you are well on your way to full membership in the 164 brotherhood. Once again welcome.

[gprocket]

Got the #3 car home this weekend. Today we pulled the water pump off and replaced it with a spare good pump. It is definately tougher than a nord but manageble. It was a new pump but leaked around the shaft which of course is why the fluid evaucated. Fortunately there does not appear to be any damage. Centerline, being the stand up company they are is replacing the pump. I have new belts in my spares so really, other than gas for the trip and anti-freeze (man that stuff is expensive these days) I'm getting away pretty cheap.

Noob question: I think we must have mis-timed it. Although it spins freely it won't start (a little sputtering but that's it). Try as I might to mark the cams prior to pulling the belt off, I'm just not 100% sure it's right. I have learned the hard way that these motors are not too forgiving as far timing is concerned...

So it looks to me that the only sure fire way of timing this beast is to pull the cam covers and verify that they are correctly positioned. True? I assume the cam pulleys don't have a factory mark since they are not keyed to the cams. And I'm not really keen on relying on someone else's marks (another hard learned lesson). I really want to just do it right and if it take a little more time - so be it.

Thanks in adavance.

[Alfisto Steve]

OK, 12v engines cam pulleys are keyed to cams. It is 24v engines that are not keyed.

Most 12v engine cam pulley hubs are scribed with timing marks so you can check timing with Rick's template without pulling cam covers.

[gprocket]

Ahhh, good to know! I just found them. Thanks Steve!

Here's another Noob: What is this? Seems like a fuse link. Doesn't look too healthy...

[Alfisto Steve]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gprocket Ahhh, good to know! I just found them. Thanks Steve! Here's another Noob: What is this? Seems like a fuse link. Doesn't look too healthy... Attachment 98024

[gprocket]

Ah, I guessed right - the fan stopped and I knew the fan was working before. I wonder if it shorted when the anti-freeze sprayed down the engine bay...

Thanks (again)!

[AlexGS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gprocket Ah, I guessed right - the fan stopped and I knew the fan was working before. I wonder if it shorted when the anti-freeze sprayed down the engine bay... Thanks (again)!

[ChazzyD]

With 3 164s, your going to need a Cardisc for them. It's a scanned factory manual, basically. You probably already know about this, but here is the link. Alfa Romeo 164 CarDisc CD Pulling the valve covers is the very best way to know you have it right, and them make your own marks wherever you see fit for future reference.
Charles