US 164S production by year?

[hpinfo]

Has anyone researched US 164 numbers by version? I think I read somewhere that around 500 164 (of all models) were imported in 1993 - anyone have any idea how many of those were S versions?

[elite38868]

Formatting might not be right, but...

Total World-Wide Production
164 Version Years Total number
2.0 and 2.0 Super 1987- 6/30/1996 158,057
3.0 V6, 3.0 V6 Super and 3.0 4x4 1987- 6/30/1996 69,748
2.5 turbodiesel and 2.5 Super turbodiesel 1987- 6/30/1996 45,602

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164s in North America
Total Alfa sales 164s As a %
90 3482 1549 44
91 3478 2155 62
92 2828 1721 61
93 1325 713 54
94 565 357 63
95 414 414 100

Note: These figures are for actual year, not model year. All of the cars sold in '90 were '91 MY. Many of the cars sold in '92 and '93 were '91 MY also.

Source: Dave Hillman, ARDONA, NHSTA, Autoweek and John Burrows of NWARC


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Chassis Numbers
Year1 Model Chassis (tel.) Number Range
1987 Tipo 164 A2 (Twin Spark) ZAR164A20*00001011 - ZAR164A20*00003300
Tipo 164 A (V6) ZAR164A00*00001011 - ZAR164A00*00001420
Tipo 164 A1 (2.5 Turbodiesel) ZAR164A10*00001011 - ZAR164A10*00002570
1988 Tipo 164 A2 (Twin Spark) ZAR164A20*00003301 - ZAR164A20*00014200
ZAR164A20*06000001 - ZAR164A20*06009000
ZAR164A20*06100001 - ZAR164A20*06110800
Tipo 164 A (V6) ZAR164A00*00001421 - ZAR164A00*00003650
Tipo 164 A1 (2.5 Turbodiesel) ZAR164A10*00002571 - ZAR164A10*00008900
Tipo 164 A2B (2.0i Turbo) ZAR164A20*00250011 - ZAR164A20*00253450
ZAR164A20*06000001 - ZAR164A20*06009000
1989 all ZAR164000*06110801 - ZAR164000*06169799
1990 all ZAR164000*06169800 - ZAR164000*06214999
1991 all ZAR164000*06215000 - ZAR164000*06253900
1992 all ZAR164000*06253901 - ZAR164000*06278800
1993 all ZAR164000*06278801 - ZAR164000*06298100
1994 all ZAR164000*06298101 - ZAR164000*06314600
1995 all ZAR164000*06314601 - ZAR164000*06324900
1996 all ZAR164000*06324901 - ZAR164000*--------


http://www.digest.net/alfa/FAQ/164/164prod.htm

[hpinfo]

Thanks for the info. Any way to determine how many were 'S' versions?

[Alfisto Steve]

Not without some sort of Access like software to look at data tables in ALfa Parts CD or ePer DVD data tables for V2 version 164 Sport or engine stamp AR 64301 for USA Models.

Here is picture of my cars data retrieved by entering 0 then 7-digit chassis number or 17-digit VIN in this format ZAR16400006179200 for 87-93 models and ZAR168000012344567 (7-digit number after 4 zeros.

Data base tables files do not end in Microsoft format. Euro spec file extensions I guess.

Maybe we have a computer expert in group who could Access tables. Anyone?

[hpinfo]

I bet they have records in the homeland, but how do you get the 10-14 year old info here? I wonder if anyone who actually works at the factory in Italy has been on the BB?

I'm SURE someone on the BB speaks Italian and could e-mail the factory, work their way through the various levels, and get to the RIGHT PERSON. Certainly Alfa has a dedicated historian who knows just where to look for specific data like this.

Wouldn't it be nice to know exactly how many of a given year/version/color/option were produced?

[alfa_corse]

What I would like to know is exactly how many of the 6196 164's that were sold in the US are still on the road. It must be a small number (like 1000 or so) by now...

[MrT]

One suggestion (sorry if it's not practical -- you be the judge):
Write a letter to carfax or similar agency (or find out how they get their data). Their data should include the ability to sort through all valid 164S VIN numbers and tell which have been registered in the last 2-3 yrs. At least, this should be possible with their available data. They probably don't have a mechanism to do this search, but any of their database staff should be able to do it almost instantly. Of course, you might have to offer to pony up for a subscription or several. Such searches may already be available to some of their customers.

[hpinfo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by alfa_corse What I would like to know is exactly how many of the 6196 164's that were sold in the US are still on the road. It must be a small number (like 1000 or so) by now...

[alfa_corse]

Well looking at AutoTrader there are only about 100 FS nationwide (on that site). There are only a handful listed on Ebay and most people selling them are listing them on national sales sites to get an interested party. If 200 net are listed FS I would expect that to be 10-20% of the total population of cars so that puts the net at 1-2000 cars. Many people here have a second 164 as either a parts car or commuter so it's got to be over 50% that have gone to parts/dismantled. I was at APE last week and noticed a box full of Milano trunk plackards (I estimated ~50 of them in the box); each one represented a dismantled car. That's just one California dismantler (OK, probably the biggest Alfa dismantler).

I dont think the 164 is faring as well as the Milano because the majority of them were built with the A/T which has shown to be problematic. With transmission rebuild costs running ~3k people are chosing to part out these cars rather than fix the A/T. There are a couple of fixes that can be done for low cost (governor seals and valve body springs). I expect that lots of people who owned these cars did not know there were inexpensive fixes to try first and either traded them in or parted them.

[hpinfo]

I think many people get taken for a ride on auto trans service and repairs due to the 'magic box' factor, meaning they have no idea how it actually works, just that they put it in 'D' and the car moves 'magically'.

Most people that are into cars could describe in great detail how a 4-stroke engine works, and the troubleshooting basics (air + fuel + spark = run) but how many could do the same for an automatic transmission? Its too bad that the end result of this is thousands of automatic 164s being (needlessly) parted out or sent to the crusher.